Saskatoon Construction II

[Irvin]

Saskatoon is to get its first Cob's Bread in Lawson Heights - those not familiar with Cob's - it is a very nice small fresh bakery with several artisan breads - it is part of the largest bakery firm in the world - based in Australia

[Irvin]

Pink Cadillac Diner is to open in the Gateway Plaza in Willowgrove Square this month. - Not sure if it is a franchise of the ones in the states.

[North_Regina_Boy]

Originally Posted by midnightrambler

After waiting 3 lights this morning at Airport drive with Semi's and traffic backed up onto the freeway, I think it is time for an overpass at Airport Drive.

This will aleviate traffic throughout circle drive, and there should be a way for Semi traffic to flow through the City as I am sure much of it does.

They should also probably get rid of access to Circle Drive at Clancy Drive, and eventually Laurier.

I think this is needed most of all in the City.

Step one is put a merge lane in from Airport Drive onto Circle Drive. There is no way a freeway should have a simple yield sign on ramp with 20 Feet to merge. It's just ridiculous.

It is slated for 2018, I talked to the City about this already.

I also did this design and put it on here a while ago:



However to connect it with a residential area would not be a prudent way to go. As they are trying to reduce traffic in that area.

Also yes both Laurie and Clancy should both be closed to left turns. Right turns though would be acceptable however. Just not south right from laurier as it would interfere with traffic taking the ramp SB-WB 22nd.

[WoodlandCritter]

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[scotty c]

While we're discussing on/off ramps from circle what are everyone's thoughts around the sb exit onto 14th. I work at the University but live on the west side so have been using the new Circle south bridge to get to and from since it opened. I find that the College on ramp to circle south can be a huge cluster at rush hour due to a small transition area between college and 14th.

I'm wondering why they don't close that exit onto 14th as anyone who is using it would be able to use College or 8th with minimal headache and it would really open up that merge area causing less issues between College and 8th as people are merging on or off Circle.

As for closing Clancy and Laurier I'm fine with it, if they can figure out some sort of mechanism to allow traffic to flow easier going north bound on circle coming out of Confed Park, Fairhaven and the new Kensington area going in north of Blairmore. Using 22nd to go North is already a disaster and they are putting a few thousand more people out that way that will want/need access to Circle.

[North_Regina_Boy]

Originally Posted by scotty c

While we're discussing on/off ramps from circle what are everyone's thoughts around the sb exit onto 14th. I work at the University but live on the west side so have been using the new Circle south bridge to get to and from since it opened. I find that the College on ramp to circle south can be a huge cluster at rush hour due to a small transition area between college and 14th.

I'm wondering why they don't close that exit onto 14th as anyone who is using it would be able to use College or 8th with minimal headache and it would really open up that merge area causing less issues between College and 8th as people are merging on or off Circle.

As for closing Clancy and Laurier I'm fine with it, if they can figure out some sort of mechanism to allow traffic to flow easier going north bound on circle coming out of Confed Park, Fairhaven and the new Kensington area going in north of Blairmore. Using 22nd to go North is already a disaster and they are putting a few thousand more people out that way that will want/need access to Circle.

This is the way I would fix Clancy / Laurier:



Laurier (Sorry NB access from this intersection needs to disappear, no adequate land to develop further then a right hand turn off of Circle SB)



22nd:



Clancy (If headed SB Circle take 22nd Fairmont Exit to get to Clancy WB)



New Road to connect to 11th:

[Wyku]

RE: closing Clancy and Laurier...

Pumping even more traffic to 22nd St. to get on to Circle Dr. North seems like a huge recipe for disaster, which the intersection at Confederation/22nd/Fairmont already is. I can't imagine how long it would take someone coming into the city from the East trying to exit onto Circle Dr. North to get through that clusterf*ck during rush hour with even more traffic funneling into the area from Confed/Fairhaven/Parkridge/etc (it is already a huge PITA as it is now). Until there is a better perimeter highway to reduce *some* of the traffic that comes through that intersection, I don't think either of those intersections should be closed.

[North_Regina_Boy]

Originally Posted by Wyku

RE: closing Clancy and Laurier...

Pumping even more traffic to 22nd St. to get on to Circle Dr. North seems like a huge recipe for disaster, which the intersection at Confederation/22nd/Fairmont already is. I can't imagine how long it would take someone coming into the city from the East trying to exit onto Circle Dr. North to get through that clusterf*ck during rush hour with even more traffic funneling into the area from Confed/Fairhaven/Parkridge/etc (it is already a huge PITA as it is now). Until there is a better perimeter highway to reduce *some* of the traffic that comes through that intersection, I don't think either of those intersections should be closed.

Considering that traffic increases in the city will get worse on Cricle Drive as more and more people use the South Bridge. And the Perimiter highway is 10-15 years away.

I feel it would be best to do a trial by using jersey barriers to close the intersections for a month or two in the summer to see how it would affect traffic flows on 22nd, and surrounding area. Then you can get applicable data for permanent changes.

[Wyku]

Originally Posted by North_Regina_Boy

Considering that traffic increases in the city will get worse on Cricle Drive as more and more people use the South Bridge. And the Perimiter highway is 10-15 years away.

I feel it would be best to do a trial by using jersey barriers to close the intersections for a month or two in the summer to see how it would affect traffic flows on 22nd, and surrounding area. Then you can get applicable data for permanent changes.

Seems like a fair idea, but I can't imagine it ending well with citizens in the area .

I can't really remember what 22nd St. and Circle Dr. looked like before the interchange was put in, but I do remember thinking it was a horrible plan for an interchange at the time it was announced--which it has turned out to be. It would be interesting if you could find an aerial shot of what it used to look like and come up with a better interchange for that area now (which does nothing except make us wish for something better (with no chance of it happening) of course, but it would cool to see what could have been anyway).

[North_Regina_Boy]

Originally Posted by Wyku

Seems like a fair idea, but I can't imagine it ending well with citizens in the area .

I can't really remember what 22nd St. and Circle Dr. looked like before the interchange was put in, but I do remember thinking it was a horrible plan for an interchange at the time it was announced--which it has turned out to be. It would be interesting if you could find an aerial shot of what it used to look like and come up with a better interchange for that area now (which does nothing except make us wish for something better (with no chance of it happening) of course, but it would cool to see what could have been anyway).

No I can't imagine it would be either. But something has to be done. And either way it will be annoying. And if you don't test before you might end up with a condition that is worse then it was. Amplifying the issues. Do it right the first time (even if it means annoying some people) and move on.

It was a 90 degree intersection with 22nd. But where the city messed up was not annexing land from the businesses in the immediate area. This I suspect was more political as they didn't want to piss people off. Also a short-term thinking when it came to growth (which Saskatchewan is famous for) those combined contributed to the odd design we have.

I will try and find an old map and do some figuring

[scotty c]

Originally Posted by Wyku

RE: closing Clancy and Laurier...

Pumping even more traffic to 22nd St. to get on to Circle Dr. North seems like a huge recipe for disaster, which the intersection at Confederation/22nd/Fairmont already is. I can't imagine how long it would take someone coming into the city from the East trying to exit onto Circle Dr. North to get through that clusterf*ck during rush hour with even more traffic funneling into the area from Confed/Fairhaven/Parkridge/etc (it is already a huge PITA as it is now). Until there is a better perimeter highway to reduce *some* of the traffic that comes through that intersection, I don't think either of those intersections should be closed.

Couldnt' agree more. I live in fairhaven and avoid that intersection like the plague, it just is really bad.

I think one thing that could help is closing the fairmont portion of the intersection and making it 3 lanes all the way from Diefenbaker. That gives all the WB traffic on 22nd extra time to get into their desired lanes and stops the backup of stop and go traffic letting people merge off of fairmont. Having a full 3 lanes from Diefenbaker means that you can merge free onto 22nd WB as well which would make that intersection flow better at the same time. You can also get rid of that wierd mini barrier currently set up at Fairmont to prevent direct access to Confed.

It doesn't solve the root of the problem (lights before the exits onto Circle) but makes navigating that section a lot easier.

[North_Regina_Boy]

Originally Posted by scotty c

Couldnt' agree more. I live in fairhaven and avoid that intersection like the plague, it just is really bad.

I think one thing that could help is closing the fairmont portion of the intersection and making it 3 lanes all the way from Diefenbaker. That gives all the WB traffic on 22nd extra time to get into their desired lanes and stops the backup of stop and go traffic letting people merge off of fairmont. Having a full 3 lanes from Diefenbaker means that you can merge free onto 22nd WB as well which would make that intersection flow better at the same time. You can also get rid of that wierd mini barrier currently set up at Fairmont to prevent direct access to Confed.

It doesn't solve the root of the problem (lights before the exits onto Circle) but makes navigating that section a lot easier.

I would agree with that statement. Then having people coming off Circle go to Fairmont go west on Fairlight to Diefenbaker then make the right onto 22nd.

[Wyku]

Originally Posted by scotty c

Couldnt' agree more. I live in fairhaven and avoid that intersection like the plague, it just is really bad.

I think one thing that could help is closing the fairmont portion of the intersection and making it 3 lanes all the way from Diefenbaker. That gives all the WB traffic on 22nd extra time to get into their desired lanes and stops the backup of stop and go traffic letting people merge off of fairmont. Having a full 3 lanes from Diefenbaker means that you can merge free onto 22nd WB as well which would make that intersection flow better at the same time. You can also get rid of that wierd mini barrier currently set up at Fairmont to prevent direct access to Confed.

It doesn't solve the root of the problem (lights before the exits onto Circle) but makes navigating that section a lot easier.

Yup, I agree with that as well. That Fairmont exit is just brutal!

[North_Regina_Boy]

Originally Posted by Wyku

Yup, I agree with that as well. That Fairmont exit is just brutal!

A fix for the 22nd interchange. Would require a lot of relocation and things but overall, would be much easier to navigate.

[macca]

It would be ideal if the whole city were just expressways, interchanges, flyovers, and overpasses.

Unfortunately we have all these buildings and parks and people in the way.

[North_Regina_Boy]

Originally Posted by macca

It would be ideal if the whole city were just expressways, interchanges, flyovers, and overpasses.

Unfortunately we have all these buildings and parks and people in the way.

We are not asking for these to be moved in all circumstances. But when you have a corner in the city (22nd) with that many vehicles / trucks / buses going through it you might want to look at some drastic measures to fix it. Also public safety is key.

[macca]

Agreed. However, adding additional vehicular capacity is not going to improve safety or congestion.

[North_Regina_Boy]

Originally Posted by macca

Agreed. However, adding additional vehicular capacity is not going to improve safety or congestion.

This intersection isn't about capacity it is about safety. Poor design with lights ahead of ramps and a disconnect of having to drive through a residential area to get back to a freeway is NOT good design. The the residents along Fairmont I am sure still want vehicle zipping through there to get back to 22nd?

This design eliminated criss-crossing and having to brake as much, that in-turn will increase safety and significantly reduce congestion at this intersection.

[macca]

Road 'improvements' of the variety that are typically discussed in this thread will not "significantly reduce congestion" in the long run. Quite the opposite.

[scotty c]

Originally Posted by North_Regina_Boy

This intersection isn't about capacity it is about safety. Poor design with lights ahead of ramps and a disconnect of having to drive through a residential area to get back to a freeway is NOT good design. The the residents along Fairmont I am sure still want vehicle zipping through there to get back to 22nd?

This design eliminated criss-crossing and having to brake as much, that in-turn will increase safety and significantly reduce congestion at this intersection.

Totally agree and assuming that a BRT system is ever created in this city to improve mass transit, one of the end hubs on the 22nd line will either be at Confed Mall or Blairmore. Considering that system will be timing based, having the busses navigate this quagmire of an intersection will throw schedules off on a regular basis I have no doubt.

There are many arguements to be made about the necessity for additional freeways, however utilizing the existing freeways to make them run correctly is just smart planning. You can start with small things like figuring out how to get rid of Clancy and Laurier cutting stopping traffic for left turns without just closing them. Then work your way up to dealing with Circle between Ave C and Warman. It seems like Airport Dr is dealt with in vision, just waiting on finances and timing to line up to make the corrections.