Highways in Canada

[SignalHillHiker]

Yeah, the province's assessment was practical but not feasible.

HOWEVER, that was before we were doing about... (this is a personal estimate, so who knows) 25% of the work anyone to dredge the straight and lay a concrete tunnel for the Muskrat Falls cables.

[Dado]

Originally Posted by Innsertnamehere

Ontario seems interested in extending the 417 to Renfrew:

http://www.insideottawavalley.com/news-s...l-party-support-for-highway-17-twinning/

How typical for the Ottawa Valley/Renfrew County.

Everyone supports it (for God knows what reason, as if four lanes of asphalt back to Ottawa will deliver some kind of salvation to the county), but everyone wants someone else to put up the cash. Oh, and they'll all make political hay about how all the other politicians aren't committed enough, when in truth they're all equally committed to the same level of buck-passing non-committedness.

It's this same idiocy that ended up with the Ottawa Valley losing both railways running through it in a space of two years. Except that also had the added wrinkle that they didn't want saving the railways to take precedence over Hwy 17 getting twinned. How's that working out for you, Renfrew County?

[eternallyme]

Originally Posted by Dado

How typical for the Ottawa Valley/Renfrew County.

Everyone supports it (for God knows what reason, as if four lanes of asphalt back to Ottawa will deliver some kind of salvation to the county), but everyone wants someone else to put up the cash. Oh, and they'll all make political hay about how all the other politicians aren't committed enough, when in truth they're all equally committed to the same level of buck-passing non-committedness.

It's this same idiocy that ended up with the Ottawa Valley losing both railways running through it in a space of two years. Except that also had the added wrinkle that they didn't want saving the railways to take precedence over Hwy 17 getting twinned. How's that working out for you, Renfrew County?

1) Railways are federal, not provincial, jurisdiction. And they definitely DID try to save them.

2) It is very busy on Highway 17 and accidents, often fatal, happen very frequently. It is Eastern Ontario's most dangerous highway without a doubt.

[Innsertnamehere]

the traffic count on it is way, way higher than it should ever be for a regional 2 lane highway. its at almost 15,000 AADT before the end of the 417, way above when it should be upgraded.

[Dwils01]

417 needs to be extended at least to Petawawa not only to Renfrew.

[Dado]

Originally Posted by eternallyme

1) Railways are federal, not provincial, jurisdiction. And they definitely DID try to save them.

The fact of the railways in question being under federal jurisdiction is irrelevant, a red herring. When railways are abandoned, all levels of government have an opportunity to acquire them, irrespective of jurisdiction. Occasionally, some do. Just not the anti-rail Province of Ontario and its Ministry of Cars and Trucks and occasionally Buses-but-only-because-we-have-to.

As for "they" trying to save them, if you consider politicians of all levels of government demanding that politicians of the other levels of government get those other levels of government to put up the money rather than doing so themselves, then yes, I suppose you could argue that "they" did try to save them. But I suspect the average person would conclude that none of them actually did anything much.

2) It is very busy on Highway 17 and accidents, often fatal, happen very frequently. It is Eastern Ontario's most dangerous highway without a doubt.

While Hwy 417 might get extended to Renfrew/Hwy 60 in the relatively near future, it's going to be a good long time before it gets extended any further, to Pembroke and Petawawa, so all these problems of a "dangerous" highway are also going to remain for a long time. Moreover, the insistence on freeways-or-bust will undoubtedly make any twinning of Hwy 17 several times more costly than it needs to be.

Sooner or later, someone is going to have to admit that driving too fast is the principal cause of all these accidents on these well-built highways with generous sightlines and long curves but which are somehow, nevertheless, deemed to be "dangerous".

[sonysnob]

Originally Posted by Dado

The fact of the railways in question being under federal jurisdiction is irrelevant, a red herring. When railways are abandoned, all levels of government have an opportunity to acquire them, irrespective of jurisdiction. Occasionally, some do. Just not the anti-rail Province of Ontario and its Ministry of Cars and Trucks and occasionally Buses-but-only-because-we-have-to.

How you can continue to advocate that a government currently $176 billion dollars in the hole, should be bailing out an unbelievably profitable railway is laughable. Railway abandonment issues are federally regulated. It is fiscally irresponsible for any level of government to pick up the liability of an under-performing railway just so a private entity can turn an even larger profit.

CP Rail turned one of its largest profits ever in some of 2013:
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/report-on...rd-third-quarter-profit/article15014715/

[Innsertnamehere]

^ exactly. Passenger rail service on the corridor would never make sense (small populations), and if freight doesn't make sense, why keep it? You are essentially maintaining an expensive piece of infrastructure for no reason other than "maybe we will need it a century from now, maybe".

MTO is also absolutely not road dominated, it has Metrolinx which dominates the ministry today. It just so happens that VIA rail is in federal jurisdiction.

Also expecting the 417 to petawawa isnt too far off I feel, highway 17 has over 8,000 AADT until there which is relatively high, higher than many parts of 69 which is being replaced by the 400 right now. I would be fine with a non freeway dual carriageway past petawawa, but I feel you need a full freeway to Petawawa. You could probably get a lot of money from the Feds, they seem to have a serious project of twinning as much of the trans Canada as possible and this is the next obvious project beyond maybe a Sualt Ste. Marie bypass. They gave out 100% of the funding for the twinning of the T-C from Manitoba to Kenora last year.

[GoTrans]

The MTO may not be auto oriented, which personally I have a hard time believing but most politicians are. All levels of government had opportunity to change the railway map for the better rather than the worse. It is very easy for a railway to May a line look unprofitable by diverting traffic to another line, especially when the line functions as a bridge line. If you are using originating and destined traffic as your rationale for abandoning the line then almost every CN or CP line between Thunder Bay and Sudbury is a candidate for abandonment, especially since CN has alternatives routes through the US. Even if the line in its own right carried insufficient traffic it could have handled both CN and CP trains on a combined route through a cost sharing arrangement. It is time for politicians and the public to realize that railways are a much more sustainable form of land transport than roads.

[middeljohn]

Just went for a nice cruise around Halton. QEW-403 (Mississauga)-401-HWY 6-403 (Hamilton)-QEW. I'm going to miss the GTA's freeway system, nothing else quite like it in Canada.

[Innsertnamehere]

Also a note, Ontario's transportation minister bikes to work. Further proof MTO isn't car dominated.

[vid]

That's because the Ontario Ministry of Transport is Glen Murray, who likely lives just down the street from Queens Park in a certain neighbourhood which I assume is very much relevant to some of his interests.~

[Innsertnamehere]

He said he uses the College street bike lanes which are only on the west side of Bay, so unless he only uses them for a block I doubt he lives in the Gay village. he would probably cut along Wellesley anyway if that were the case, unless he lives on the far southern edge.

Also, Montreal's highway system is rather crazy as well, though not on the sheer scale of roads that Toronto has. (over 60km of express collector system roads.. nuts)

[GreaterMontréal]

Montreal's highway system is not even completed. A-19 extension in Laval, starting in 2016. To join A-640 in Bois-des-Fillions.

http://www.radio-canada.ca/nouvelles/societe/2013/05/24/003-autoroute-19-quebec-confirme.shtml


http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/62/A-19.png/800px-A-19.png

in the future, maybe a new link between A-640(40) and A-30. (tunnel) A-640 and A-40 , near Hudson

[Innsertnamehere]

Hmm I didn't know about that project. Do you know if there are plans to extend the A-640 over the Ottawa river to A-40? That would provide a fairly good northern Montreal bypass to match the A-30 expansion that opened a year or two ago.

[GreaterMontréal]

Originally Posted by Innsertnamehere

Hmm I didn't know about that project. Do you know if there are plans to extend the A-640 over the Ottawa river to A-40? That would provide a fairly good northern Montreal bypass to match the A-30 expansion that opened a year or two ago.

Page 4-7.

http://www.gruhm.org/GRUHM_Download/GTImontrealMETRO-1802.pdf

#18 almost finished
#25 starting in 2016
#26 completed

[Innsertnamehere]

Thanks!

[Innsertnamehere]

407 extension update, apologies for the large image size:



Highway 7 overpass just east of Brock Road. The bridge structure will be for Highway 7, with the 407 running underneath.

The Brock road interchange is starting to come together, now that the snow is melting it is starting to come into view a bit more. the Brock Road realignment around Braugham is completely graded, just waiting for pavement which I presume will not be done for a while now.

And before someone asks, My car was completely stopped in this photo and pulled to the side of a rural road with no traffic. (sideline 16)

[sonysnob]

^ They have really been advancing on the falsework for that new strucutre. I have some pictures that I took in December, just before the snow started to fly:

[FrAnKs]

I miss the smooth pavements of Ontario.