Canadian Retail Thread

[SignalHillHiker]

Originally Posted by trebor204

Target to open 9 more stores in Canada in 2014

http://pressroom.target.ca/news/targ...ansion-in-2014

Spring 2014:

The Stockyards, Toronto, Ontario
Kingsway Mall, Edmonton, Alberta
Hillside Centre, Victoria, British Columbia

Summer 2014

Erin Mills Town Centre, Mississauga, Ontario
Park Place, Barrie, Ontario
Carrefour Candiac, Candiac, Quebec

Fall 2014:
St. Laurent, Ottawa, Ontario
Sheridan Centre, Mississauga, Ontario
Polo Park, Winnipeg, Manitoba

Their store in St. John's was a disappointment. I wouldn't be surprised if it closes.

People were expecting the difference between it and Walmart to be grand, but it's not at all.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by SignalHillHiker

Their store in St. John's was a disappointment. I wouldn't be surprised if it closes.

People were expecting the difference between it and Walmart to be grand, but it's not at all.

It has become de rigeur for people around here to trash Target. I don't get it... I love the place. Far nicer merchandise than Walmart but at comparable prices.

What is the big beef that people have with Target? Does the clothing selection not offer enough "Taz" or UFC prints like at Walmart? Are there too many design items for sale in the housewares department instead of ones that were created by some random factory in Zhengzhou? Are the Archer Farms food products not plain enough for our collective tastes? What is it?

[miketoronto]

Originally Posted by Acajack

One of the reasons for this is that rents are cheaper in the suburbs, whereas as downtown rents climb, increasingly it is only the big guys (chains) are able to pay them.

Which squeezes the mom and pops more and more out of the central city and pushes them to the outskirts.

To an extent. But we were able to maintain diversity in offerings before. It is not like downtown is only now popular.

Also other world cities are able to keep unique things in their cores. Part of this has to do with the city not protecting things, and over expansion by chains who just don't know when to stop.

London and other European cities have had market districts in the exact same place for hundreds, and in some cases a thousand years. I think Toronto and North American cities can maintain similar districts if they want. We just don't care, and are too obsessed with these stupid condos. People will start to care when they are faced with a boring downtown with nothing but condos and Loblaws, and not much more to offer.

[GreaterMontréal]

I think Toronto and North American cities can maintain similar districts if they want.

In Montréal we have

http://www.heritagemontreal.org/en/c...et-definition/

[Retail-Insider]

We just wrote an article on Eataly, an Italian food concept retailer that will open its 1st Canadian location in Toronto: http://www.retail-insider.com/2014/0...nnovative.html

[Proof Sheet]

Originally Posted by Retail-Insider

We just wrote an article on Eataly, an Italian food concept retailer that will open its 1st Canadian location in Toronto: http://www.retail-insider.com/2014/0...nnovative.html

They have an olive oil section so all is good.

[Ramako]

Madonna's Hard Candy Fitness club has opened at Aura: http://www.torontolife.com/style/tor...na-hard-candy/

Apparently it's the first one in North America.

[eternallyme]

One thing I notice is that smaller cities get no respect in the retail world these days...they may be about to fall behind...

[SpongeG]

Originally Posted by Ramako

Madonna's Hard Candy Fitness club has opened at Aura: http://www.torontolife.com/style/tor...na-hard-candy/

Apparently it's the first one in North America.

people had to pay $400 just to go to watch her open the gym! rip off

[MolsonExport]

Old leathery Madonna is really not something I need to see at the gym. Sounds like a Bari-style moment. No wonder the malls are dying. Time to stop the condo boom in downtown Toronto and force people to shop only at independent stores, but only those downtown. Down with the chains and up with the artisanal Olive Oyl Shoppes

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by eternallyme

One thing I notice is that smaller cities get no respect in the retail world these days...they may be about to fall behind...

There's always Walmart I guess.

One thing that bothers me is that while Target has assumed most of the Zellers leases in large or medium sized Canadian cities, the Zellers in smaller cities and towns have been cast by the wayside.

For example, the mall in Amherst NS (about 45 minutes from Moncton) is like a tomb now. It used to be anchored by both a Zellers and a Sears store and used to be moderately bustling, but both are gone now and about 80% of the storefronts in the mall are now vacant. It is very sad. Sure, Moncton isn't very far away,but the residents of Amherst certainly deserve much better.

Hopefully Target will gradually infiltrate into small town Canada over time. Walmart needs some competition in rural Canada.

[Trevor3]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

There's always Walmart I guess.

One thing that bothers me is that while Target has assumed most of the Zellers leases in large or medium sized Canadian cities, the Zellers in smaller cities and towns have been cast by the wayside.

For example, the mall in Amherst NS (about 45 minutes from Moncton) is like a tomb now. It used to be anchored by both a Zellers and a Sears store and used to be moderately bustling, but both are gone now and about 80% of the storefronts in the mall are now vacant. It is very sad. Sure, Moncton isn't very far away,but the residents of Amherst certainly deserve much better.

Hopefully Target will gradually infiltrate into small town Canada over time. Walmart needs sole competition in rural Canada.

I found the Amherst mall wasn't in that bad shape. Obviously Zellers being gone took a lot of traffic away but it's well occupied from the Tim Horton's entrance all the way down to Sobey's. It's only from Eclipse up to the Zellers that has been wiped out, which is 4-5 store fronts? There are a few other empty slots but they have a really good selection for a small town, places like Marks, a Coles Bookstore, Bluenotes, etc... Pretty good for them, it may not be much but it's a solid selection for a town that size.

Just Googled it and looks like Giant Tiger is taking a portion of the Zellers space but won't be connected to the mall. I hate when malls allow that.

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by Trevor3

I found the Amherst mall wasn't in that bad shape. Obviously Zellers being gone took a lot of traffic away but it's well occupied from the Tim Horton's entrance all the way down to Sobey's. It's only from Eclipse up to the Zellers that has been wiped out, which is 4-5 store fronts? There are a few other empty slots but they have a really good selection for a small town, places like Marks, a Coles Bookstore, Bluenotes, etc... Pretty good for them, it may not be much but it's a solid selection for a town that size.

Just Googled it and looks like Giant Tiger is taking a portion of the Zellers space but won't be connected to the mall. I hate when malls allow that.

Good to hear about Giant Tiger, but I agree with you about it being a bad decision to allow it not to be connected to the rest of the mall.

Just out of interest, when were you last at the mall? I was there just before Christmas and it was really hurting then, especially when you compare it to what it was like five years ago. In particular, the end of the mall closest to the old Zellers location was virtually empty.

This is in stark contrast to the mini power centre across the street with Superstore, Walmart and Kent. One side of the street the parking lot was full, the other side the parking lot was empty……...

[Nouvellecosse]

When I was growing up, Amherst had TWO bustling malls, the older mall was called the Cumberland Mall (which is now just a mostly dead strip mall) and the current Amherst Centre Mall. The old mall was anchored by the Zellers and a Save Easy, and the new Mall was anchored by Sobeys and Kmart, a Bi-way, and had numerous other stores.

There was never an actual Sears dept. store though, always just a Sears furniture store and catalogue outlet, which is still there today.

The really surprising thing is that we still have our downtown dept store Margolians (which is now called Dayles).

Although I must say I find it rather ironic that urban enthusiasts on SSP would be lamenting the demise of suburban-style shopping malls and big box stores. I suppose it's rather telling about the state of things in Amherst that no one even mentions the fate of downtown, and that the best case scenario is to maintain the health of a shopping mall when even it is struggling...

[Trevor3]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

Good to hear about Giant Tiger, but I agree with you about it being a bad decision to allow it not to be connected to the rest of the mall.

Just out of interest, when were you last at the mall? I was there just before Christmas and it was really hurting then, especially when you compare it to what it was like five years ago. In particular, the end of the mall closest to the old Zellers location was virtually empty.

This is in stark contrast to the mini power centre across the street with Superstore, Walmart and Kent. One side of the street the parking lot was full, the other side the parking lot was empty……...

I stop in Amherst whenever I make the trip from Freddy to Newfoundland, so my last stop would have been early January.

I can defintely understand it's probably not what it was, that inevitably happens when an anchor closes up shop but there are still some decent stores that make it worthwhile going into. That mall needs to be marketed well by its owners while there are still some larger chains operating in it. It doesn't have to die, nor should it.

Originally Posted by Nouvellecosse

When I was growing up, Amherst had TWO bustling malls, the older mall was called the Cumberland Mall (which is now just a mostly dead strip mall) and the current Amherst Centre Mall. The old mall was anchored by the Zellers and a Save Easy, and the new Mall was anchored by Sobeys and Kmart, a Bi-way, and had numerous other stores.

There was never an actual Sears dept. store though, always just a Sears furniture store and catalogue outlet, which is still there today.

The really surprising thing is that we still have our downtown dept store Margolians (which is now called Dayles).

Although I must say I find it rather ironic that urban enthusiasts on SSP would be lamenting the demise of suburban-style shopping malls and big box stores. I suppose it's rather telling about the state of things in Amherst that no one even mentions the fate of downtown, and that the best case scenario is to maintain the health of a shopping mall when even it is struggling...

A suburban style shopping mall is a bit different when it's in a smaller centre like Amherst. In a large city like Toronto, a mall such as the Amherst Centre would be part of a sprawling suburb that took shoppers and money away from downtown. In a smaller place like Amherst they bring shoppers into town and are generally beneficial to the community.

[Nouvellecosse]

Sorry, but I don't see it as any different. In fact, I see that type of development as much more justifiable in a large city since it isn't reasonable to expect everyone to travel such a huge distance to get downtown for shopping. But in a place like Amherst, no such issue exists. Downtown is actually more central to the majority of people compared to the malls.

Before those malls and box stores opened in the 70s, shopping was done in downtown Amherst which is now a skeleton of surface parking and closed and struggling businesses. I can still remember when the downtown had three grocery stores (has one now), and was home to the region's Canadian Tire (where I got my first bike) the Maritimes oldest pharmacy (which finally gave up the ghost around 2010), the headquarters of the local paper, the Dairy Queen, the health foods store, etc. and that was after the malls were already open. Now all those things have moved to the character-less fringe. I have no doubt that all those businesses would still be a draw if they weren't in the shopping mall or box box format, and may draw even more people since the town would actually be attractive and interesting.

Stores like Margolians and Dayles are actually unique and interesting. They even advertise as far away as Halifax and are a draw much further than things like Walmart or Zellers. Every town and city has a box walmart et al, so no one is going to come to town for that unless there's no location any closer. And those people would be coming to town anyway because they have nothing where they live.

[MonctonRad]

I hear ya nouvellecosse, and while I theoretically agree with you (I remember downtown Amherst from the 60's and 70's), and there is no doubt that the suburban malls helped to cripple the downtown economy, I think Trevor has a point. it is true that the Amherst Centre Mall has become the de facto retail hub for the town, and it's current sad state is bad for the town.

With Zellers gone, there is really no competition left for the Walmart, and the only real alternative is 45 minutes down the road in Moncton.

While as a Moncton former I welcome our status as a regional shopping hub, I dislike seeing this happening at the expense of outlying regional towns. I think the shopping experience in small town Canada is undergoing a radical shake-up and it isn't a good thing…….

[Nouvellecosse]

What would have been ideal in my mind is if the planned Giant Tiger could be built downtown. GT isn't nearly as big as Walmart or even Zellers so I see no reason why they couldn't have found any number of places to put it. Maybe not as cheaply or conveniently, but not everything is about the cheapest and most convenient option.

The only new store to open downtown in recent years is the new Lawtons, which built a new stand-alone building only a block from the old one.

I just wish it had been a Shoppers as I've never been a big Lawtons fan.

We need a new Shoppers anyway, as our current one sucks and is way too small and closes at 9 on weekdays and 6 on weekends. I want one of the full size 12am ones like in the HRM. And even if not downtown, I would at least like to see the malls area better organized and not so completely desolate and auto-oriented in design. Maybe they could build the new shoppers on the old Cumberland Mall's parking lot which is way bigger than needed now that the mall is basically closed.

Oh and speaking of Moncton, it seems like it's suffering a similar fate. There are big suburban shoppering areas around Champlain Place and up on Mountain Rd. but downtown, there doesn't seem to be much other than a few bars and restaurants. I walked all around downtown last night and didn't notice much in the way of actual stores other than a couple small speciality boutiques, convenience stores, and news stands. And away from Main St. the parking is horrendous - almost as bad as Amherst. When I was a kid there was a full size downtown dept. store (the Bay I believe) which anchored a downtown shopping center full of stores. That seems to be gone now.

Maybe there is stuff downtown that I missed?

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by Nouvellecosse

Oh and speaking of Moncton, it seems like it's suffering a similar fate. There are big suburban shoppering areas around Champlain Place and up on Mountain Rd. but downtown, there doesn't seem to be much other than a few bars and restaurants. I walked all around downtown last night and didn't notice much in the way of actual stores other than a couple small speciality boutiques, convenience stores, and news stands. And away from Main St. the parking is horrendous - almost as bad as Amherst. When I was a kid there was a full size downtown dept. store (the Bay I believe) which anchored a downtown shopping center full of stores. That seems to be gone now.

Maybe there is stuff downtown that I missed?

Champlain Place is the mall that ate Moncton. It is a super regional mall similar to MicMac or Halifax Shopping Centre in HRM. It not only crippled retail on Main Street, it also ultimately destroyed the other malls in the city as well. The competition now is the big box district up around the Trinity Power Centre. We have a lot of the same retail as Halifax, even high end stuff, it's either just at Champlain or Trinity, not downtown.

Main Street is coming back in a sense. There are a lot of new interesting restaurants opening up downtown, and some of the local stores in Champlain Place that were kicked out when Cadillac Fairview decided to go upscale (like Colpitt's Mens Wear) have transitioned back to Main Street with good results.

Highfield Square downtown is where the Bay (and formerly Eaton's) was located. It closed for good last year and will be demolished this year. This is where the proposed downtown events centre (a new arena with 9-10,000 seats) is proposed to be built. It is hoped that it will revive the DT in a manner similar to the downtown arena in London ON did.

[Trevor3]

The way I look at it is that any town with some shopping/retail sector is a service centre for its region. That sector is drawing in people who don't live there but live in the greater area for shops and services that they don't have. People can either have a Walmart in their town and draw in people from neighbouring communities, or watch as though people drive elsewhere to get to Walmart. If Amherst didn't have a decent mall or the assortment of big box stores that it has, people would drive 45 mins up the road to Moncton. People can either spend money in your town or the next one, but they will go to where the big boxes and malls are, such is the age we live in.

I try to speak from what I know, so that would be Corner Brook as the hub of western NL and Stephenville as a sub-hub for the southwest coast, and it's quite analagous to Amherst and Moncton, I think anyway. We could either have Walmart in our mall and attract shoppers from the southwest coast to come shop in our town, spend money at our Walmart which employs our people, who in turn spend their money in town, visitors spend money at restaurants, gas stations, check out some of the local shops downtown (this is the biggest difference, our mall is on Main Street). We could have said no to Walmart and watched them set up in Corner Brook and then watch as everyone passes us by, including our own residents, to shop in that city. Then our own downtown would have emptied out, as it stands it is quite vibrant and busy.

The bottom line is, people want those big chains and will drive to find them if they don't have them. Had Amherst not built malls and attracted them, either someone else would have or people would have driven to Moncton. In that scenerio I think business in Amherst would probably have dried up and there would not be any of the service sector jobs that exist now.

The best thing for smaller centres to do is have the mall at the town centre where it can anchor the downtown or at least very near to it, that's what we have and it's very successful. So yes, I definitely understand what you mean, Nouvellecosse, by the fringe bix boxes and malls killing your downtown, but if there is a way to work those amenities into the core of the town/city it doesn't have to be doom and gloom. Though that's not always possible which is too bad.