Tempe Development Thread

[rocksteady]

Originally Posted by Jjs5056

One of the items on the Tempe development review commission's recent or upcoming meetings was regarding the need for more retail/restaurants to be connected to the waterfront, so I do think we will eventually see at least some improvement that could make a small ferry system worthwhile.

That is great to hear, JJ. Thanks for the info. I would love to see that lake surrounded by nice bars and restaurants with great multi-level patio seating to take advantage of great views and weather. Even better if I could take a ferry from a restaurant on the north shore, to a street car on the south short that connects to the light rail, and then home. One day, hopefully.

It also appears Tempe is much closer to revitalizing and seeing through old pre-recession plans than Phoenix. Obviously a lot aren't as big in scale, but if we could see action at University Square, Hayden Harbor, and the Onyx plot then Tempe is back in pretty good business.

[HX_Guy]

Tempe continuing to kick ass!

Apartment tower, Whole Foods planned for downtown Tempe in $80-100 million project

Kristena Hansen
Phoenix Business Journal



A failed mixed-use project in downtown Tempe that once promised a condominium high-rise and a Whole Foods grocery store is being revived.
Greenwood Village, Colo.-based Alberta Development Partners LLC paid $6.1 million for less than 2 vacant acres at the northwest corner of University Drive and Ash Avenue in a deal that closed this week, according to a statement from CBRE Inc. Brookfield Asset Management was the seller.
The company plans to spend another $80 million to $100 million erecting a mid-rise or high-rise apartment tower there with a ground-level grocery store over the next several years.
Nearly a decade ago, the 1.86-acre parcel was slated for a similar project dubbed Mosaic that called for a high-rise condo tower and ground-level Whole Foods. The developer at the time, KML Development, never got the project off the ground due to the downfall of its lender, the now-defunct Mortgages Ltd.
The announcement of this new project comes at a time when commercial development, especially high-end multifamily, has been exploding in Tempe’s urban core. It would also fill a void for the downtown area’s growing number of residents, who currently do not have a nearby grocery store.
Don Provost, founder and principal of Alberta Development, declined to name the grocer, but sources close to the deal who did not want to be named said Whole Foods has signed letter of intent to occupy the space. Whole Foods representatives did not immediately return an email late Wednesday afternoon about the possible store.
Provost also declined to say how large the retail space would be and whether the grocer would occupy the entire space, so it is unclear whether there will be enough space for a full-scale Whole Foods like those sen in Scottsdale and Chandler. A smaller Whole Foods in Tempe is about four miles from the new project.
Parking for the grocery store will be underground, while residents will have their own garage stacked in between the ground-level retail and the high-end apartments, he said.
Provost said many details — such as the tower’s height and whether the apartments will be self-managed — are still up in the air, noting the deal happened in a brisk 30 days.
Thus, more time is needed to examine the area, particularly the constant growth of the adjacent Arizona State University main campus and other non-university related developments nearby such as USA Place and State Farm Insurance’s regional headquarters.
“There’s a lot of dynamics in that market right now ... it’s a unique opportunity,” Provost said.
Construction on the project — a first in the Phoenix area for Alberta Development — could start this fall and wrap up within two years, he said.
“The property at University and Ash is one of the single most sought-after vacant land parcels in the metro area,” Barry Gabel, a CBRE broker who helped represent the seller, said in a statement. “The site’s downtown Tempe location, adjacency to Arizona State University, current entitlements and frontage along both University Drive and Ash Avenue make it an ideal location for future development.”

[rocksteady]

Great news out of Tempe, once again! Lets hope they go with the high-rise, instead of mid-rise. I think a Whole Foods here, and a less expensive and smaller trader joe's at USA place will serve the area well. I realize they would be close to one another but each would serve two completely different clientele.

[Arquitect]

Originally Posted by rocksteady

Great news out of Tempe, once again! Lets hope they go with the high-rise, instead of mid-rise. I think a Whole Foods here, and a less expensive and smaller trader joe's at USA place will serve the area well. I realize they would be close to one another but each would serve two completely different clientele.

They are almost literally next to each other at the Town and Country shopping center in Phoenix, and they seem to be co-existing pretty well. There are something that one carries that the other doesn't, and the clientele is diverse enough to keep both going.

[Jjs5056]

Wow, that's fantastic news!

Like I mentioned last week, the sale of the Chase buildings was definitely going to impact this lot since it was owned by the seller of those offices. Glad to see they sold it to someone with actual plans to develop.

Even if it is a midrise, it'll have to be a pretty decent height. I can't imagine the project penciling out with less than 8 stories worth of apartments on that size of a lot, so we'd be looking at an 11-13 story tower at that point when you add in the retail and podium parking. Anything 12+ will be awesome.

Can't wait for more residential downtown, more high rise options, a downtown grocer, retail fronting Ash, and downtown extending west.

[combusean]

I wondered what could happen on that lot for $90 million and this is what I came up with:

Alta Phoenix was built for $40 million in 2009 and has 328 units and is on a similarish size lot. It's about 330000 rentable square feet. Average of 1000 square foot a unit, and $121/leasable sqft construction cost.

44 Monroe was built for $70 million at the height of the market and by my calculations (523,000 total square feet, 130,000 square feet of garage over 7 floors, 393,000 gross rentable sqft - 97,000 sqft of core) - it's around 296,000 rentable square feet and has 202 units at an average of 1500 sqft a unit and $236/leasable sqft construction cost. The small footprint, plus demolition, and higher construction costs (crane woes, etc) drove the cost of this one up.

So let's say it costs $200/leasable sqft to build. $90 million over 200 gives us a 450,000 leasable square foot building. That's between 300 - 450 units, 240 - 160 du/acre (super dense on either end).

The garage for this using 44 monroe's proportions would be about 180,000 square feet, which could stack on top of a 40,000 square foot Whole Foods plus another 15k for back of house and loading. Because the lot is too big for one contiguous tower over one garage like it's occasionally done, I figure a detached Whole Foods below 4 - 5 floors of parking (at least one floor of parking for the whole foods).

The remaining 25,000 square foot parcel (and this is assuming maximum lot usage) is favorable for a highrise tower. With about 80% of that floorplate area going to leasable space, I divide 450000 by 20,000 and get a 22 - 23 story highrise on that lot.

Any surface parking, courtyard space, setbacks, etc. futzes with these numbers substantially. But that would just drive the overall height up. As another caveat, Mosaic was stacked quite well on top of the whole foods/garage area, but it's hard to take prior designs into account when there's a new dollar figure to spend. I should probably better take into account the whole foods cost, but it doesn't seem to matter when working with ballparkish numbers anyways.

[Jjs5056]

Originally Posted by combusean

I wondered what could happen on that lot for $90 million and this is what I came up with:

Alta Phoenix was built for $40 million in 2009 and has 328 units and is on a similarish size lot. It's about 330000 rentable square feet. Average of 1000 square foot a unit, and $121/leasable sqft construction cost.

44 Monroe was built for $70 million at the height of the market and by my calculations (523,000 total square feet, 130,000 square feet of garage over 7 floors, 393,000 gross rentable sqft - 97,000 sqft of core) - it's around 296,000 rentable square feet and has 202 units at an average of 1500 sqft a unit and $236/leasable sqft construction cost. The small footprint, plus demolition, and higher construction costs (crane woes, etc) drove the cost of this one up.

So let's say it costs $200/leasable sqft to build. $90 million over 200 gives us a 450,000 leasable square foot building. That's between 300 - 450 units, 240 - 160 du/acre (super dense on either end).

The garage for this using 44 monroe's proportions would be about 180,000 square feet, which could stack on top of a 40,000 square foot Whole Foods plus another 15k for back of house and loading. Because the lot is too big for one contiguous tower over one garage like it's occasionally done, I figure a detached Whole Foods below 4 - 5 floors of parking (at least one floor of parking for the whole foods).

The remaining 25,000 square foot parcel (and this is assuming maximum lot usage) is favorable for a highrise tower. With about 80% of that floorplate area going to leasable space, I divide 450000 by 20,000 and get a 22 - 23 story highrise on that lot.

Any surface parking, courtyard space, setbacks, etc. futzes with these numbers substantially. But that would just drive the overall height up. As another caveat, Mosaic was stacked quite well on top of the whole foods/garage area, but it's hard to take prior designs into account when there's a new dollar figure to spend. I should probably better take into account the whole foods cost, but it doesn't seem to matter when working with ballparkish numbers anyways.

Thanks for this! Very interesting.

One thing to consider is that the article specifically mentioned that WF's parking would be underground with resident parking being stacked above. The trend for Whole Foods nationwide has been underground parking in suburban locations, so I think that's probably going to happen here.

In which case, could the Whole Foods+Parking+Apartments complete one tower, with a shorter, connected mid-rise occupying the rest of the land? I guess that would look a bit weird having the parking podium of the tower adjacent to residential units next door, huh?

See the article below for a photo reminder of how Mosaic did something similar. Though the final plans changed, the concept stayed the same, and I imagine Alberta will need to do this or get creative in order to appease residents, as that was what forced KML into a redesign that pushed the tower piece to the eastern end of the property.

Article: http://vizzdanews.blogspot.com/2014/02/colorado-based-developer-buys-ml.html

[Jjs5056]

Also interesting to note and maybe of use: the previous owner submitted plans for a 35K square foot Whole Foods for the lot in 2011 with 2 floors of parking above.

Interesting in that, while there was news of the owner considering a grocery store, we never heard/discussed this project which went as far as a development agreement with Tempe.

[PHXFlyer11]

Originally Posted by HX_Guy

Tempe continuing to kick ass!

Unbelievable news! One year from now all you are going to see in the Tempe skyline are cranes, everywhere!

- Lofts at Hayden Ferry
- Marina Heights
- Hayden Ferry 3
- USA Place
- Potential apartments on North Side
- Potential 10 story at North Shore
- University House 2
- Always forget the name of the one next to W6 that is under construction
- New Mosaic!!

I really hope this is at least 20 stories. 22 would be great. I think all of this is starting to have a compounding effect and spurring more and more development and demand. I can't wait to see what else the trolley ignites. Hopefully the empty plots east of Rural on Rio bank.

Maybe Onyx and the final parcel at HF that was slated for a hotel will take off next! Fun times in Tempe... but please! Someone build some damn condos!

[Jjs5056]

Originally Posted by PHXFlyer11

Unbelievable news! One year from now all you are going to see in the Tempe skyline are cranes, everywhere!

- Lofts at Hayden Ferry
- Marina Heights
- Hayden Ferry 3
- USA Place
- Potential apartments on North Side
- Potential 10 story at North Shore
- University House 2
- Always forget the name of the one next to W6 that is under construction
- New Mosaic!!

I really hope this is at least 20 stories. 22 would be great. I think all of this is starting to have a compounding effect and spurring more and more development and demand. I can't wait to see what else the trolley ignites. Hopefully the empty plots east of Rural on Rio bank.

Maybe Onyx and the final parcel at HF that was slated for a hotel will take off next! Fun times in Tempe... but please! Someone build some damn condos!

The project next to W6 is Hanover. Which apartments are you referring to on the north part of town? You might be thinking of the two 4-story structures being planned at SouthBank, east of Rural. If so, let's hope that one doesn't happen - it's brown stucco and fake stone, and completely underutilizes what was intended to be a fantastic mix of various high rises.

Also, of all the projects, HF3 has the most history, was the first to announce its plan prior to this new boom, and yet I feel like it just isn't going to happen. That intersection desperately needs attention; it's a shame the design won't help much and that the Mill has never attracted a development.

On the positive side, the Lofts at Hayden Ferry, squished between HFL and Marina Heights, seems to be a go, and as far as I know, the 9-story office building at North Shore is actually already begun. Anyone know?

[mdpx]

Originally Posted by TempeSilverFox

Has anyone heard any more about the vacant lot at Ash and University? It seems to be on and off with the Whole Foods. I personally DON'T want a Whole Foods- I've said this before... WAY too expensive and I feel it's just all wrong for the area. We need a regular grocery store or a place like Trader Joe's or Fresh and Easy where you can get basics at a decent price- and also some groovy already made stuff that you just heat up. I would also love to give Tops some competition on their prices for wine and liquor!

Originally Posted by mdpx

You've heard that the Whole Foods project that never got off the ground years ago is still being considered? Can you shed light on that, because there has not been a word about it in years.

Well I'll be a monkey's uncle! Apologies for questioning Silverfox!

[HX_Guy]

Originally Posted by PHXFlyer11

Unbelievable news! One year from now all you are going to see in the Tempe skyline are cranes, everywhere!

- Lofts at Hayden Ferry
- Marina Heights
- Hayden Ferry 3
- USA Place
- Potential apartments on North Side
- Potential 10 story at North Shore
- University House 2
- Always forget the name of the one next to W6 that is under construction
- New Mosaic!!

I really hope this is at least 20 stories. 22 would be great. I think all of this is starting to have a compounding effect and spurring more and more development and demand. I can't wait to see what else the trolley ignites. Hopefully the empty plots east of Rural on Rio bank.

Maybe Onyx and the final parcel at HF that was slated for a hotel will take off next! Fun times in Tempe... but please! Someone build some damn condos!

Yeah, if Tempe wasn't already the urban experience of Metro Phoenix, it sure will take the crown now.

[PHXFlyer11]

Originally Posted by Jjs5056

The project next to W6 is Hanover. Which apartments are you referring to on the north part of town? You might be thinking of the two 4-story structures being planned at SouthBank, east of Rural. If so, let's hope that one doesn't happen - it's brown stucco and fake stone, and completely underutilizes what was intended to be a fantastic mix of various high rises.

No, this is the project that we saw on the agenda for the 2/25 DRC meeting. There was alot of speculation on this, I believe you also were part of that discussion. The 2 lots for the one project by the horse property.

Originally Posted by Jjs5056

Also, of all the projects, HF3 has the most history, was the first to announce its plan prior to this new boom, and yet I feel like it just isn't going to happen. That intersection desperately needs attention; it's a shame the design won't help much and that the Mill has never attracted a development.

I think this will happen in time. If it's a year, two years or 5 years. They just will not build until they can sign leases for most of the building. I am not concerned about this one. All the work has been done but to sign tenants. They're all sunk costs now.

Originally Posted by Jjs5056

On the positive side, the Lofts at Hayden Ferry, squished between HFL and Marina Heights, seems to be a go, and as far as I know, the 9-story office building at North Shore is actually already begun. Anyone know?

Yes, looks like HFL Lofts will go soon. As for the 9-story at North Shore, this has not move at all. I think this is similar to HFL3, in that they will first sign leases, then build. There is still an ugly trailer on the property advertising medical condos. lol

[Jjs5056]

Originally Posted by PHXFlyer11

No, this is the project that we saw on the agenda for the 2/25 DRC meeting. There was alot of speculation on this, I believe you also were part of that discussion. The 2 lots for the one project by the horse property.

God, I'm an idiot. I was thinking of NorthShore, which reminded me of ugly stucco, and that was that.

[PHXFlyer11]

Originally Posted by Jjs5056

God, I'm an idiot. I was thinking of NorthShore, which reminded me of ugly stucco, and that was that.

Haha, no worries, in my mind it's a long shot anyways and could be used just to drive up the property value, time will tell.

[phoenixwillrise]

Originally Posted by Arquitect

They are almost literally next to each other at the Town and Country shopping center in Phoenix, and they seem to be co-existing pretty well. There are something that one carries that the other doesn't, and the clientele is diverse enough to keep both going.

Same here in San Diego both in La Jolla Village (near my home) and Hillcrest maybe others they are practically side by side and we often shop at both on the same trip.

[rocksteady]

Originally Posted by phoenixwillrise

Same here in San Diego both in La Jolla Village (near my home) and Hillcrest maybe others they are practically side by side and we often shop at both on the same trip.

I do the same at Town and Country. If I'm shopping for myself I go to Whole Foods. If I'm shopping for 2-3 people I go to Trader Joe's. And if I'm shopping for 10-15 I'll go across the street to Fry's. Having 3 grocery stores next to each other and across the street serves that area very well and I think the same would go for that part of Tempe.

[azsunsurfer]

The office development at north shore has a major tenant talking to them to take the whole building, it will depend if they sign an LOI for the entire building....

[rocksteady]

Originally Posted by azsunsurfer

The office development at north shore has a major tenant talking to them to take the whole building, it will depend if they sign an LOI for the entire building....

Great news! Any news on who?

And I want to see all of these cranes in the air in Tempe and Phoenix ASAP before some unexpected financial fallout scares people again.

[azsunsurfer]

Originally Posted by rocksteady

Great news! Any news on who?

And I want to see all of these cranes in the air in Tempe and Phoenix ASAP before some unexpected financial fallout scares people again.

out of respect for my source, that's none of your business, if it happens it happens. Now the first building is up at Liberty Center, I am still very stoked about this.