Mountain West Microbrew: Chit chat and irrelevancy - Page 62

Stenar · #**1221** Posted **Feb 12, 2014, 6:38 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by RyanD

Your lack of research is getting really annoying. Try again.. We have plenty of resorts that are well within an hour from Denver. Also, we don't NEED to escape to the mountains since we have a city that can entertain us too. The mountains are a nice amenity but they're not something we need to sell Denver with. Denver does fine on its own.

The nearest one is over an hour. 90 minutes from the airport.

I have actually done my research. On a previous thread, we were discussing infrastructure for Denver and SLC to host Olympics. I made a chart of every single ski resort in the Denver area and SLC area, with distance of each from Denver or SLC respectively and from that figured the average distance. Here's info I came up with after that research. Some of these are out of date because SLC has built several hotels since then.

RyanD · #**1222** Posted **Feb 12, 2014, 3:24 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stenar

The nearest one is over an hour. 90 minutes from the airport.

I have actually done my research. On a previous thread, we were discussing infrastructure for Denver and SLC to host Olympics. I made a chart of every single ski resort in the Denver area and SLC area, with distance of each from Denver or SLC respectively and from that figured the average distance. Here's info I came up with after that research. Some of these are out of date because SLC has built several hotels since then.[/IMG]

Good Morning!!

I'm going to give you the city / airport to ski resort times. I hate our airport being used in that stat but it does prove a valuable point and ours is just so far out east, it does add a lot of travel time. Worth a mention though, DIA always ranks in the top 10 if not top 5 for best airports in the world. Anyways, gold star for SLC for closer ski resorts. That's a great stat to have for a nice ski city..

Convention Center, the numbers check out. Our entire convention center, which is one building, is 2.2 million square feet total. Cool. We're about the same there.

Development, the more important conversation, is a fun one because I know for a fact SLC isn't developing as rampant as Denver right now. Let's talk about 2012-2014.

Let's start with hotels.. Denver has, now, 8,800 rooms according to our Downtown Denver Partnership report with 850 hotel rooms under construction.. We're pushing over 10,000 rooms because there are even more rooms on the development board.. Also, according to that report, the occupancy for hotels in Downtown Denver is 73.4%.

On that report, it shows Denver having a 5% apartment vacancy rate. According to DenverInfill, there are 7,388 units that are either U/C or complete since 2012. There are also 2,952 units proposed. This is all within 1.5 miles from the most central point downtown. That is a total of 51 buildings either U/C or completed in the past 2 years. See for yourself..

Side note, we pretty much have under 30 condos left in our Downtown core to sell and need to build them desperately.. I know you guys are having a difficult time selling condos, esp. at CCC. 500-unit, 42-story tower? Sold out in less than 3 years. It's easy here in Denver. Must tell you people want to move and settle here if they're buying up the units..

That's just residential.. We already talked about hotels, so let's talk about office now..

The same DDP report states: in the same radius as the apartments, there is 1,220,000 square feet of office under construction right now with 645,000 square feet on the boards. So ~1.8 million square feet of office space is expected to come to Denver by 2015..

I'm very curious about what's going on over there in SLC. Please backup your statments with credible sources.

bunt_q · #**1223** Posted **Feb 12, 2014, 3:52 PM**

Seriously, it is 55 minutes from my house (in Denver proper) to Loveland, where I ski most often. My #2 Winter Park is 1:35. Keystone and Copper, if those are your thing, are each right at 1:20.

Chop 15 to 20 minutes if you live in the west suburbs, where I would say a lot of avid skiers choose to live.

wong21fr · #**1224** Posted **Feb 12, 2014, 3:53 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by RyanD

G
Convention Center, the numbers check out. Our entire convention center, which is one building, is 2.2 million square feet total. Cool. We're about the same there.

The numbers for the conventions centers for SLC and Denver are slightly off. SLC groups its ballrooms with its meeting spaces while Denver separates them. The correct numbers are:

SLC

515,000 sq ft of exhibition space, 115,320 sq ft of meeting space, and 45,000 sq ft of ballroom space

Source:http://www.visitsaltlake.com/includes/content/docs/SPCCfloorplans.pdf

Denver

584,000 sq ft of exhibition space, 100,000 sq ft of meeting space, 85,000 sq ft of ballroom space, and a 5,000 seat theater space

Source:http://denverconvention.com/plan-your-event/event-space/

bunt_q · #**1225** Posted **Feb 12, 2014, 3:58 PM**

And let's not ignore the elephant in the room. The biggest difference between Salt Lake and Denver is having to live under the umbrella of the Mormon church. Not everybody wants that. Salt Lake will never be recognized as a top tier city so long as the state of Utah is thought of as a borderline theocracy.

Not saying I personally feel that way, or would even care, I'm more conservative than most on here. But there is that perception out there, and it is not entirely inaccurate.

PLANSIT · #**1226** Posted **Feb 12, 2014, 4:50 PM**

This is fun.

I'll bite...

Building Heights

Code:

Denver                           SLC
80 > 100ft                       28 > 100ft
41 > 300ft                       10 > 300ft
 7 > 500ft                        0 > 500ft

For being a "city" "almost" as big as Denver, you sure aren't proving it very well.

Source Emporis (yes, I know Emporis isn't the greatest, but it's close enough)

RyanD · #**1227** Posted **Feb 12, 2014, 5:35 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by PLANSIT

This is fun.

I'll bite...

Building Heights

Code:

Denver                           SLC
80 > 100ft                       28 > 100ft
41 > 300ft                       10 > 300ft
 7 > 500ft                        0 > 500ft

For being a "city" "almost" as big as Denver, you sure aren't proving it very well.

Source Emporis (yes, I know Emporis isn't the greatest, but it's close enough)

Now now.. Denver is ONLY 70% larger than SLC in terms of building count..

PLANSIT · #**1228** Posted **Feb 12, 2014, 7:19 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stenar

The nearest one is over an hour. 90 minutes from the airport.

I have actually done my research. On a previous thread, we were discussing infrastructure for Denver and SLC to host Olympics. I made a chart of every single ski resort in the Denver area and SLC area, with distance of each from Denver or SLC respectively and from that figured the average distance. Here's info I came up with after that research. Some of these are out of date because SLC has built several hotels since then.

We all know SLC resorts are closer. That's a given. And trust me, we are jealous of this fact. I-70 is the devil reincarnated.

The Powder Mountain 7,000 acre statistic is bullshit. It includes an unbelievable amount of non-lift access terrain (4,000 acres). That's great and all, but doesn't really tell the whole story. Powder Mountain has 7 lifts (3 tows, 1 quad). Seven! With 144 runs.

True Vertical Drop for Resorts probable for Olympic events (Top 15)

Code:

Colorado
Utah
1. Snowmass - 4,030'
2. Aspen Highlands - 3,572'
3. Beaver Creek - 3,340'
4. Aspen Mountain - 3,267'
5. Snowbird - 3,243'
6. Vail - 3,041'
7. Snowbasin - 2,960'
8. Breck - 2,880'
9. Crested Butte - 2,755'
10. Park City - 2,712'
11. The Canyons - 2,615'
12. Winter Park - 2,574'
13. Steamboat - 2,479'
14. Copper - 2,420'
15. Keystone - 2,362'

Note: Telluride, CO (3,830') is not included as it seems unlikely to host Olympic events (distance).
SOURCE

DenverInfill · #**1229** Posted **Feb 12, 2014, 8:05 PM**

1.5 mile radius of a geographic central point of Downtown Denver
24 months
7,388 units and counting...

Also, this morning at home before I left for work I did a tally of the number of hotel rooms within walking distance of the Colorado Convention Center. Including hotel projects that are currently under construction, it's almost exactly 9,000 (it was something like 8,988).

According to Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_convention_centers_in_the_United_States#By_size) the Colorado Convention Center is the 11th largest in the US. The Salt Palace is 36th.

But, it's all good.

Stenar · #**1230** Posted **Feb 12, 2014, 8:28 PM**

If you have 2.2 million s.f. in your CC, but only 584,000 sf of exhibit space, what is the rest filled up with?

Quote:

Originally Posted by DenverInfill

1.5 mile radius of a geographic central point of Downtown Denver
24 months
7,388 units and counting...

Also, this morning at home before I left for work I did a tally of the number of hotel rooms within walking distance of the Colorado Convention Center. Including hotel projects that are currently under construction, it's almost exactly 9,000 (it was something like 8,988).

According to Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_convention_centers_in_the_United_States#By_size) the Colorado Convention Center is the 11th largest in the US. The Salt Palace is 36th.

But, it's all good.

wong21fr · #**1231** Posted **Feb 12, 2014, 8:36 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stenar

If you have 2.2 million s.f. in your CC, but only 584,000 sf of exhibit space, what is the rest filled up with?

Processing facilities for the prisoners that will be housed in DIA's underground prisons by the NWO.

seventwenty · #**1232** Posted **Feb 12, 2014, 8:58 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by wong21fr

Processing facilities for the prisoners that will be housed in DIA's underground prisons by the NWO.

And that's the last time we heard from Wong.

Note that for the Opening & Closing Ceremonies, Corporate Overlords at Mile High holds 30,000 more people than Rice-Eccles Stadium. Plus the torch people can deliver the flame in a unique and fun way.

RyanD · #**1233** Posted **Feb 12, 2014, 9:03 PM**

Why the hell did I not mention the fact that we have 3 F'in major league sports venues totaling 144,577 seats!!!

wong21fr · #**1234** Posted **Feb 12, 2014, 9:04 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by seventwenty

And that's the last time we heard from Wong.

Please. I'll be one of the people doing the roundups. Better to be the one doing the stepping than getting stepped on.

seventwenty · #**1235** Posted **Feb 12, 2014, 9:07 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by RyanD

Why the hell did I not mention the fact that we have 3 F'in major league sports venues totaling 144,577 seats!!!

I think we should do the hockey gold medal games outdoors at Folsom. So there's another 50,000 to 60,000, depending on what CU builds/expands in the next few years. No Crosbys allowed, though.

DenverInfill · #**1236** Posted **Feb 12, 2014, 9:16 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stenar

If you have 2.2 million s.f. in your CC, but only 584,000 sf of exhibit space, what is the rest filled up with?

Back of house functions (storage, kitchens, etc.), the 5,000-seat auditorium, huge lobbies and pre-function spaces, plus the 100,000 sq ft of meeting space and 85,000 sq ft of ballroom space.

RyanD · #**1237** Posted **Feb 12, 2014, 9:21 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by DenverInfill

huge lobbies and pre-function spaces

He's not kidding.. These lobbies are not childs play. They are HUGE, OPEN, WELL LIT, BEAUTIFUL lobbies with a GIANT blue bear watching your every move from the outside..

This is a TINY snippet of what our lobbies in that building are like..

seventwenty · #**1238** Posted **Feb 12, 2014, 9:23 PM**

Nvm. The glory of Denver unites at the Mountain's Edge!

Stenar · #**1239** Posted **Feb 12, 2014, 9:34 PM**

I don't think that lobbies should be counted when comparing convention centers. That list of largest convention centers only lists SLC's exhibit space, not its lobbies, so it appears much smaller than other convention centers.

If you can't exhibit 4x as much as SLC, why list the overall area of the cc? Meeting planners aren't going to necessarily be impressed by large lobbies, but rather by how much exhibition space you have.

Also, not included in SLC's area is Abravanel Hall, which is connected, seating 2,811. Some conventions have even used the 21,000 seat LDS Conference Center auditorium across the street.

seventwenty · #**1240** Posted **Feb 12, 2014, 9:39 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stenar

I don't think that lobbies should be counted when comparing convention centers. That list of largest convention centers only lists SLC's exhibit space, not its lobbies, so it appears much smaller than other convention centers.

If you can't exhibit 4x as much as SLC, why list the overall area of the cc? Meeting planners aren't going to necessarily be impressed by large lobbies, but rather by how much exhibition space you have.

Also, not included in SLC's area is Abravanel Hall, which is connected, seating 2,811. Some conventions have even used the 21,000 seat LDS Conference Center auditorium across the street.

I mean, if you like incomplete data, sure. Oh I see. You're still smaller.