South Fraser Perimeter Road/Highway 17 Extension | Completed

[cabotp]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

I'm not sure what to believe about truck drivers these days. I've heard on the news all of the drivers are taking the Patullo because they are being paid so little, it's worth all of their extra time to do so. And then there's this...

There are some good drivers, but there are also some horrible drivers as well.

A big factor can come down to whether a driver is an owner operator or whether they are driving for a fleet. Fleet driver's in a lot of cases get paid by the hour, as far as I know. So there is no incentive to rush each deliver. While owner operators get paid by the delivery so there is an incentive to rush each delivery. Since that means more money in their pocket.

Now with all the curves it does make the highway more dangerous. I do though feel that it is a bit of a cop out. Since we live in mountainous province and curves on a highway have been around us for years.

[jlenko]

Given that the majority of the SFPR route is not illuminated.. It surprised me when I first drove it, the centre divider is so low and the lights from oncoming traffic at night (both cars and big rigs) blinds me every time.. and I'm just in a regular car. I can't imagine if I was driving my lowered car...

[cabotp]

Originally Posted by jlenko

Given that the majority of the SFPR route is not illuminated.. It surprised me when I first drove it, the centre divider is so low and the lights from oncoming traffic at night (both cars and big rigs) blinds me every time.. and I'm just in a regular car. I can't imagine if I was driving my lowered car...

The Jersey Barrier on the SFPR should be the same height as the Jersey Barrier on the East-West Connector.

[East Van]

I second that given that it supposed to be a truck route. I've seen a medium size sedan push a half dozen out of interlock, on other hand I've seen a dump truck blow out over a dozen. With the lack of lighting this route should also be covered in reflectors & cat eyes especially on corners. But hey, at least we got a new 'highway'. With the poor weather we usually get here half the year, you'd think they would be everywhere.

[jlenko]

The other thing I've noticed.. they put those 'slats' to block headlight glare on some of the side streets.. the same type as on the Ironworkers Memorial and up the centre of the cut. But they are not in the middle of the SFPR (where they should be), but between the SFPR and side roads, eg. 116th Avenue between 130A and 132nd Streets..

Problem with this.. the slats face the wrong way! They're meant for between standard lanes of traffic, not the outside lanes. They would need the slats facing the opposite way to be fully effective.

[GMasterAres]

Originally Posted by jlenko

Given that the majority of the SFPR route is not illuminated.. It surprised me when I first drove it, the centre divider is so low and the lights from oncoming traffic at night (both cars and big rigs) blinds me every time.. and I'm just in a regular car. I can't imagine if I was driving my lowered car...

It sucks. My car is a good foot lower than even a Ford Focus (which is a small car) and I get blinded near constantly by lights especially those in pickups or trucks whose headlights are at perfect eye level for where I am situated in my car. It did point out to me though last week how dirty my windshield was so I had to windex it all because on the way home one night every light made my windows just appear to be a pile of smudges from dirt and grime. :|

It does suck though. I would have prefered the walls be another 1 or 2 feet higher. Then again there is the opposing thought that higher walls (with a small buffer in some areas) can make some drivers more nervous. Just in this thread you have some saying they felt nervous driving in the left lane with the narrow buffer. I drive a vehicle probably half a foot wider than them much lower down and have never felt nervous. So some people are just more prone to those feelings and a higher wall gives them a "tunnel" feel.

If I had my way though, barricades would be tall enough that a) you can't see oncoming headlights up close and b) they obscure crashes from the opposing lane so when emergency vehicles are present, you can't actually SEE the accident so idiots don't slow down to 10kph to lookyloo.

I still find it ridiculous how sometimes I get on the highway and we'r ejust poking along at 20kph, then 25 minutes later I find it is because there is an accident on the opposing side that has NOTHING to do with the flow of traffic I'm in and there is NO reason we should be going so damned slow other than because people have to slow and look.

Giant walls so they can't see and blamo you'd solve probably 25% of our traffic flow problems instantly. But that's a different rant in a different thread.

[Mininari]

delete: wrong thread

[Cypherus]

Originally Posted by jhausner

I still find it ridiculous how sometimes I get on the highway and we'r ejust poking along at 20kph, then 25 minutes later I find it is because there is an accident on the opposing side that has NOTHING to do with the flow of traffic I'm in and there is NO reason we should be going so damned slow other than because people have to slow and look.

Is that a BC thing? Countless times I have experienced such slows downs on the TCH for similar reasons. Unless the accident spews over into our lane (which a westbound accident did last Friday on the TCH by the Sumas Way exit in Abbotsford), their should be consideration or provisional law to enforce opposing traffic to remain at coasting speed. As the the SFPR, the illumination is terrible, especially at night. There were times you couldn't see any lane markings or reflectors, especially when opposing headlights were bright. Such conditions would have me shine my high beams just to see where I am going but that would easily blind oncoming traffic since the barriers are too low. So we're stuck with another BC highway with non-reflective lane markings and scarce use of reflectors where they are actually needed (on the lanes, not on top of the barriers).

[Porfiry]

Originally Posted by Cypherus

Is that a BC thing? Countless times I have experienced such slows downs on the TCH for similar reasons.

No, it happens everywhere.

[moosejaw]

Originally Posted by Porfiry

No, it happens everywhere.

Agreed...worldwide issue.

[GMasterAres]

Then I stick to my opinion that they should just put up giant walls.

And agree on the reflector thing. Maybe everyone here should write into the ministry and CC CKNW, and the company responsible for the SFPR and voice their complaint regarding the reflectors and ease of seeing lanes.

[makr3trkr]

http://www.vancouversun.com/Video+Wildli...Fraser+Perimeter+Road/9414133/story.html

Video: Wildlife in danger of roadkill near South Fraser Perimeter Road

At least 10 deer have been killed in collisions with vehicles since the $1.3 billion highway opened last month. The province is conducting further monitoring and is looking at measures such as fencing and removal of grass to curb roadkill.

[trofirhen]

It seems to me that Vancouver - or at least the suburban areas - is underlit.
I don't think that if the equivalent of the SFPR expressway were in Toronto or Montreal, it would be the same.
There, the lighting seems brighter, the lights more closely spaced, and the lighting poles and related street-furniture more "upgrade," somehow, than here.
Has anyone else noticed this?

[moosejaw]

Originally Posted by trofirhen

It seems to me that Vancouver - or at least the suburban areas - is underlit.
I don't think that if the equivalent of the SFPR expressway were in Toronto or Montreal, it would be the same.
There, the lighting seems brighter, the lights more closely spaced, and the lighting poles and related street-furniture more "upgrade," somehow, than here.
Has anyone else noticed this?

No they cant do that. It would look somewhat like a freeway then. Same with the signage, and the traffic light intersections........And that wont sit well with the treehuggers.

[moosejaw]

Originally Posted by makr3trkr

http://www.vancouversun.com/Video+Wildli...Fraser+Perimeter+Road/9414133/story.html

Video: Wildlife in danger of roadkill near South Fraser Perimeter Road

At least 10 deer have been killed in collisions with vehicles since the $1.3 billion highway opened last month. The province is conducting further monitoring and is looking at measures such as fencing and removal of grass to curb roadkill.

Definitely not good.
Who makes these decisions anyways regarding the value engineering of these projects? Is there really that much money to be saved?

[makr3trkr]

http://www.vancouversun.com/technology/S...+dead+deer+with+video/9414140/story.html

"Described by the province as a “game-changer for industry, commuters and tourists” when it opened just one month ago, the South Fraser Perimeter Road has become a highway of death for black-tailed deer living along the fringe of the $1.3-billion project.

Raccoons, birds and a beaver have also been killed, although an exact tally of the carnage has yet to be released.

The B.C. government confirms that at least 10 deer have been killed by traffic despite efforts to reduce roadkill through measures such as wildlife corridors.

“We don’t want any collisions, obviously,” Geoff Freer, project director for the highway, said in an interview Tuesday. “But collisions happen on all highways across the province.”

The difference with the South Fraser Perimeter Road is that the province spent at least $30 million specifically on wildlife initiatives, including about 25 tunnels and bridges (some over creeks) that allow for passage of deer. Freer said at least as many more corridors serve smaller wildlife.

Wildlife corridors were sited based on the best advice of biologists and further monitoring is underway, including with cameras, to better determine wildlife movements and create a mitigation plan, he said.

Mitigation measures might include reflectors, fencing to better funnel the deer to the crossings, and changes in roadside vegetation to discourage deer from crossing the highway.

The province is committed to monitoring the highway’s impact on wildlife for five years.

Freer accompanied The Vancouver Sun to one underpass, an approximate two-metre-diameter culvert located immediately north of Highway 99 freeway next to Burns Bog.

Deer droppings were widespread along the east side of the highway, evidence that grasses used to firm up the ground are also an attractant. “They definitely go for the green grass,” said Freer, noting that farm fields offer similar food for deer in Delta.

Coyote tracks appeared to be visible in the mud on the west side of the highway.

Deer roadkill on the highway has mostly occurred in the vicinity of Burns Bog in Delta and east of the Port Mann Bridge in Surrey."

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by moosejaw

No they cant do that. It would look somewhat like a freeway then. Same with the signage, and the traffic light intersections........And that wont sit well with the treehuggers.

Are you saying they can't light up the road better because it will annoy the treehuggers?

What about people who put passenger safety and lives first, as a priority? Sounds crazily Brirish Columbian.

[DKaz]

BCMazda3's SFPR cruise:

• Video Link

[moosejaw]

Originally Posted by trofirhen

Are you saying they can't light up the road better because it will annoy the treehuggers?

What about people who put passenger safety and lives first, as a priority? Sounds crazily Brirish Columbian.

Im saying that's one of the reasons, but of course the the most obvious reason is the expense. It was like only ten years ago they put up lights on the TCH? And to this day BC99 is mostly unlit.

If BC really cared about making this highway safe, they would construct highways with the safety of its users in mind. Thermoplastic striping, RPMs, wildlife barriers, and correctly sized signage with the right fonts would be used. There's no reason why BC couldnt rip a few pages out of the TXDOT highway construction standards and made it similar. To be honest with you it doesnt have to look "American" even "A" Road standards in England would have sufficed.

I have no doubt at one time, the grand lux version of the SFPR had fully separated intersections, lights, gantries with signage spread throughout and animal protection. No doubt some bean counter put the stops to this.

Remember there was a really big push to stop this project. And i honestly believe that the scope of SFPR was reduced not only to save $$$$ but also so it didnt look like the big LA style freeways that Stop the Pave folks were eluding to.

[makr3trkr]

Thanks for the video



I noticed this section between Tilbury and Sunbury

The shoulder here is wider than the lanes, and is painted, too.

I'm wondering if it's just for speed enforcement, or if it has something to do with the contaminated sites, or what..