Atlanta Project Thread IV

[smArTaLlone]

Originally Posted by echinatl

Looks like they've town down the Mexican restaurants exterior seating area at the CNN center and are replacing it with something bigger (and hopefully better). This was the spot 5 guys was going to occupy but I read they backed out. I'm not sure if something else is taking their place, but it's the only restaurant space that has outside access.

I read about what was going there somewhere but I can't remember what. I'm thinking its a local chain.

[Atlanta3000]

http://www.tonetoatl.com/2013/04/breaking-news-f2o-2-go-downtown.html

[echinatl]

That's actually in the spot next to it and already open. It's pretty good too; they did a nice job on the inside.

[Tuckerman]

What is the status of Tower Place Drive Northeast in Buckhead? At present this private road is closed (especially sometimes at rush hour). The maze of streets around Tower Place, Doubletree, Buckhead Church and the shopping area with BBB and TJ's is very busy and has become more complicated with the addition of the new Terminus construction and the entrances off of Peachtree and Piedmont. It seems to me that the addition of the ped. bridge over 400 to Marta will further complicate both vehicular and pedestrian traffic.

[smArTaLlone]

[smArTaLlone]

http://www.bizjournals.com/atlanta/real_talk/2013/12/amli-to-develop-more-buckhead-apartments.html

AMLI Residential has scooped up another high-profile intown site where it plans to develop more apartments.

AMLI purchased about 7 acres in Buckhead at Roxboro and East Paces Ferry roads, a site that several years ago was planned as an over-the-top $2 billion condo project. Instead, AMLI will develop at least 640 apartment units.

The property is considered one of the top development sites in Buckhead because of its location next to Lenox Square and the Lenox MARTA station.
The project is also a chance for Buckhead to continue shedding its suburban image. The master plan requires the developer to set the buildings amid parks and a grid-like layout that would promote more walkability.

Architects would likely attempt in their designs some sort of connectivity to Lenox Square and MARTA.

[bryantm3]

Originally Posted by smArTaLlone

http://www.bizjournals.com/atlanta/real_talk/2013/12/amli-to-develop-more-buckhead-apartments.html

the thing i don't like about development going to buckhead is their lack of interest in enforcing zoning codes regarding urban development— in buckhead it's totally okay if you build a parking deck fronting the street, an entire development with no retail, etc. they don't seem to care.

[Libertarian]

You don't understand something - retail is dying. The traffic and profit margins are being squeezed for most types and they're going out of business left and right. So why would a developer want to incorporate retailing in a project other than in very limited locations of which there are only a handful in Atlanta? Why would the city want another empty storefront? It's actually inhibiting by adding one more risk. What am I missing here?

[L.ARCH]

Originally Posted by Libertarian

You don't understand something - retail is dying. The traffic and profit margins are being squeezed for most types and they're going out of business left and right. So why would a developer want to incorporate retailing in a project other than in very limited locations of which there are only a handful in Atlanta? Why would the city want another empty storefront? It's actually inhibiting by adding one more risk. What am I missing here?

One could argue (as many in academia do) that street level retail activates streets and makes areas more attractive from a pedestrian perspective, which makes these urban places that are emerging feel more "livable" which drives demand for more housing, which creates more demand for retail development, and eventually after reaching a so called "critical mass" of density, you create a place that caters to the needs and desires of those of us that want to live in urban places that are filled with life and activity and walkable destinations, which you are correct in staying currently "there are only a handful in Atlanta."

Should these existing "successful" areas be the only ones that have retail? I would say absolutely not... You have to start somewhere, especially when you are building up all these areas from scratch, which is more or less what we are doing down here in Atlanta (unlike other older more developed cities). You just cant start this cycle of demand and development without creating the types of places people want to live. Now there are definitely places where retail wont be needed. It's not like every street everywhere must have retail, but this is one of the only places in Buckhead that has a chance at becoming something closer to what has been traditionally classified as "urban" with an actual street grid and real pubic greenspaces and therefore they should be attempting to create an active pedestrian experience as much as currently feasible in order to get the development cycle going and make this a more attractive area to live in.

I also understand that 20-30-50 years from now, we might not ever go to a brick and mortar store to purchase goods, but we will still need active streets and I think the importance of a pubic component in ground level spaces will remain. Whether or not its a bookstore or an internet café or an art galley, I don't think really matters... what matters is the activation and stimulation that it provides and the chance to connect with other people which is why we choose to live in cities in the first place.

[Terminus]

Originally Posted by bryantm3

the thing i don't like about development going to buckhead is their lack of interest in enforcing zoning codes regarding urban development— in buckhead it's totally okay if you build a parking deck fronting the street, an entire development with no retail, etc. they don't seem to care.

The type of development you reference is not required by zoning in most of the city - outside of SPIs or the BeltLine Overlay. It's not that the City isn't enforcing the law, it's that there are no laws to enforce. The developments being built are abiding by the zoning districts they lie in.

[bryantm3]

Originally Posted by Libertarian

You don't understand something - retail is dying. The traffic and profit margins are being squeezed for most types and they're going out of business left and right. So why would a developer want to incorporate retailing in a project other than in very limited locations of which there are only a handful in Atlanta? Why would the city want another empty storefront? It's actually inhibiting by adding one more risk. What am I missing here?

i really think you're overestimating the importance of the online marketplace. things like grocery stores, pharmacies, restaurants, markets, bakeries, these are never going to go "online". you're seeing a trend and hyperbolizing it.

[jpk1292000]

Originally Posted by bryantm3

i really think you're overestimating the importance of the online marketplace. things like grocery stores, pharmacies, restaurants, markets, bakeries, these are never going to go "online". you're seeing a trend and hyperbolizing it.

Agree 100%. Even clothing stores will continue to exist. Many people want to try on clothes before buying them.

[AtlantaMustang]

Exactly. Even with things like clothes, furniture, etc. a lot of people still do like to go to a store and see in person what they're buying. Personally with clothes I understand it would be cheaper and way more convenient to buy online, but I like to see, touch, and try them on before I buy. I almost never buy clothing online.

[bryantm3]

Originally Posted by AtlantaMustang

Exactly. Even with things like clothes, furniture, etc. a lot of people still do like to go to a store and see in person what they're buying. Personally with clothes I understand it would be cheaper and way more convenient to buy online, but I like to see, touch, and try them on before I buy. I almost never buy clothing online.

i don't buy clothing online because the sizes are unpredictable. one shop's XL might be another shop's M. even pants sizes, which are supposed to be inch-based, can be completely unpredictable. you have to at least go to the store and try on the clothes. then you can leave and get a better deal online if you want, but most people just give up and buy it instore.

retail outlets in the suburbs and especially in malls are losing popularity because they require you take hours out of your day to go to the mall, and once you're there, you hold everyone in your party hostage since there's no way to leave except by car.

i think people prefer to have stores located in a place that's closer to home and accessible (or nearby) restaurants, hotels, etc. so not everyone is "held hostage" for hours at a time while one person shops.

[Tuckerman]

I think the main challenge of the internet to brick and mortar stores is availability. On the internet everything is available. For example, yesterday I went to Barnes and N in Buckhead in search of a particular book I wanted to buy for a friend. I loved looking at all the books and actually bought one for myself but could not find the one I was looking for. Back home, 2 minutes on Amazon and I had what I wanted and it will be here before Xmas. The question is, do I want to spend the time and money for gas to go to the store knowing the almost certainty that they will not have what I want? However, this really applies, at the moment, to certain kinds of stores and it is clear to me why Borders and other such stores went the way of all flesh. Shopping is to some extant a community experience - there is a certain thrill in being among other people spending time just looking around. Shopping really relates to the aspect of the walkable city. For many people shopping is just looking around and occasionally buying something. One can experience that on the net as well, but without the community aspect.

[micropundit]

Originally Posted by Terminus

The type of development you reference is not required by zoning in most of the city - outside of SPIs or the BeltLine Overlay. It's not that the City isn't enforcing the law, it's that there are no laws to enforce. The developments being built are abiding by the zoning districts they lie in.

Do you believe that this is a step in the right direction?
http://www.bizjournals.com/atlanta/print-edition/2013/12/20/city-aims-to-become-more-walkable.html

[AtlantaMustang]

Originally Posted by micropundit

Do you believe that this is a step in the right direction?
http://www.bizjournals.com/atlanta/print-edition/2013/12/20/city-aims-to-become-more-walkable.html

Great news, thanks for sharing as always micropundit.

[arjay57]

Originally Posted by bryantm3

the thing i don't like about development going to buckhead is their lack of interest in enforcing zoning codes regarding urban development— in buckhead it's totally okay if you build a parking deck fronting the street, an entire development with no retail, etc. they don't seem to care.

Several of the major Buckhead commercial areas (the village, the Lenox corridor, Lindbergh) are covered by SPIs that prohibit that kind of development. Brookwood also has a master plan that won't allow it.

However you can probably still get away with it in areas like WPF/I-75, Roswell road, Howell Mill, Chastain, Piedmont, etc.

[smArTaLlone]

[jpk1292000]

Originally Posted by smArTaLlone

Impressive scene with all the cranes!