Olympic Village & Southeast False Creek Updates Discussion

[Vin]

Originally Posted by osirisboy

I'm so sick of tall skinny buildings with those stupid townhouse podiums!

What about short stubby buildings with the same kind of podiums. Would you rather have those?

[Vin]

Originally Posted by squeezied

And is that the developer's fault or the city's for not allowing tall skinny buildings a la Yaletown?

Both. But mostly the city. And I never said it has to be a copy of Yaletown.

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by Laniatus

Everything in the OV looks too much the same, visually it's boring and doesn't draw people in from outside the OV. Beyond the towers, I feel the problem is the storefronts have no personality. I feel like the OV is not meeting its full potential..

Sadly that's the problem with Downtown South, Concord Pacific and all of Vancouver's "instant neighbourhoods". There's been no robust boom-bust cycle to cause a break in architectural typology. If you go back in Vancouver's history you can see where the bust of 1913 brought Edwardian styles to a screeching halt and by the time building resumed in the mid '20's styles were quite different. Same with the Great Depression.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by officedweller

Report regarding SEFC Neighbourhood Energy Utility:

http://former.vancouver.ca/ctyclerk/cclerk/20131210/documents/cfsc1c.pdf

Wow - base charge (capital and operating costs) will be $0.50 per sq metre per month, then energy usage is charged on top of that.

So if I were in SEFC instead of Yaletown, my 869 sq ft condo would be 80.7 sq metres = $40 per month base charge.
That seems pretty high.

Wasn't the base charge supposed to get less as the system expands? There doesn't seem to be any mention of that in the report.

Although it does look like the rate per kWh is only 4.1 cents after that, which is low.

We live in Yaletown as well, around 800sf, and we use about 400 kWh/month, however all hot water and heating are baked into the strata fees, so it's hard to estimate what we might use in SEFC.

Is every development in SEFC on this NEU? Edit: I see the map now So i guess the city forces developments on this NEU if they are in the area?

[jlousa]

How do you get to 400Kwh? I live in a large 2bd and usually hover around the 75kwh mark and only get up to about 100kwh some months. I did switch all my lighting to led but that shouldn't make a large difference, I still have a large tv, home theatre system and gadgets galore that are used a lot. I did replace the standard washer and dryer with a 2 in 1 that is much more efficient but I can't see that making up the missing difference. My brother has a similar sized unit rented out and he's only ~100kwh every month too.

The heating rates at SEFC seem like a strange blend of very high base rates and low consumption rates. Not sure why they went this route instead of vice versa. Are their still the high administration billing charges on top of those fees as well?

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by jlousa

How do you get to 400Kwh? I live in a large 2bd and usually hover around the 75kwh mark and only get up to about 100kwh some months. I did switch all my lighting to led but that shouldn't make a large difference, I still have a large tv, home theatre system and gadgets galore that are used a lot. I did replace the standard washer and dryer with a 2 in 1 that is much more efficient but I can't see that making up the missing difference. My brother has a similar sized unit rented out and he's only ~100kwh every month too.

The heating rates at SEFC seem like a strange blend of very high base rates and low consumption rates. Not sure why they went this route instead of vice versa. Are their still the high administration billing charges on top of those fees as well?

We must be energy hogs... We have CFL throughout most of the home now, at least one computer on all the time, and there's three of us (baby), so laundry done in the dryer. I think we have an inefficient fridge but we're renting, so not replacing it any time soon. We also have a small deep freeze.

We're thinking about moving, and the OV is a possible destination. I'd rather not get blindsided by higher energy bills.

Edit: Looking over my bills we are 300-400 per month...

[SpongeG]

Originally Posted by whatnext

Sadly that's the problem with Downtown South, Concord Pacific and all of Vancouver's "instant neighbourhoods". There's been no robust boom-bust cycle to cause a break in architectural typology. If you go back in Vancouver's history you can see where the bust of 1913 brought Edwardian styles to a screeching halt and by the time building resumed in the mid '20's styles were quite different. Same with the Great Depression.

i think concord also wants people to say "this must be a concord development"... brand/bland identity

[sacrifice333]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

We must be energy hogs... We have CFL throughout most of the home now, at least one computer on all the time, and there's three of us (baby), so laundry done in the dryer. I think we have an inefficient fridge but we're renting, so not replacing it any time soon. We also have a small deep freeze.

We're thinking about moving, and the OV is a possible destination. I'd rather not get blindsided by higher energy bills.

Edit: Looking over my bills we are 300-400 per month...

I live in the OV. We are 2 people in a 2BR corner unit with far too many windows. Our bi-monthly bills work out to less than $200 (hydro + enerpro). My wife likes our home warm and we definitely do laundry. We don't have a deep-freeze, but we have computers, etc., on far too much.

[sacrifice333]

It seemed appropriate to repost a previous one of mine as mass-confusion still exists WRT to the NEU, Enerpro, Cap Mats, & The Village

There has been a [mis]conception that in spite of all the green and energy saving features utilized in the village that utility prices are high. As such, last night I attended an information session held at The Village for 4 of the stratas in which the various heating, cooling, billing, etc. was addressed.

The speakers included representatives of the NEU, Enerpro, Cobalt Engineering (Cap Mats), and Crosby PM, with additional comments and attendance by E&Y and Hallmark Heating & Air Conditioning (service reps).

No doubt the crowd was tough, but I was incredibly impressed by how each of the speakers handled themselves and treated the question askers, some very uninformed, with the utmost respect.

The key points of confusion for residents of the Village seem to include:

• Multiple Service Providers, Engineers, Etc.
• How Enerpro Works
• Method of Heating The Village

I've largely addressed who the parties involved are above.

As for How Enerpro Works? Enerpro is basically a system by which common strata costs of domestic hot & cold water usage are removed from the Strata Corp.'s General Budget and applied on a direct usage basis to the individual Strata Lots. Enerpro bills on a bi-monthly basis. The collected funds are then remitted back to the strata-corp, less a meter reading administration fee.

The key premise of Enerpro is that if people see their usage and the associated billing, instead of it just being lumped into their monthly strata bill, they will change their habits and use less energy. [Enerpro has examples of building re-fits where this change alone has resulted in >50% reductions in water usage and the associated energy bills!].

The key challenge in this is that people think their utility bills are higher because they've gone from having 2 bills: BC Hydro for Electricity (including Heat) and Strata Fee, to having 3 bills: BC Hydro for Electricity (not including Heat), Strata Fee (no longer including domestic Hot & Cold Water usage), AND Enerpro (covering Heat AND domestic water).

Regarding the method of the heating the village, the cap mats, and the radiant technology was discussed somewhat by Cobalt Engineering. Many complain that the system does not heat the suites to the desired temperatures. The system being radiant-based, is not instantaneous, and has shown some incompetence under extreme weather IMHO. The life of the cap-mat piping was also addressed with the engineering firm claiming similar systems showing 40+ yr lives.

NOTE: Some of the rental buildings are heating via baseboard heaters and thus do not have cap mats.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by sacrifice333

I live in the OV. We are 2 people in a 2BR corner unit with far too many windows. Our bi-monthly bills work out to less than $200 (hydro + enerpro). My wife likes our home warm and we definitely do laundry. We don't have a deep-freeze, but we have computers, etc., on far too much.

Any chance you can post what a typical energy bill looks like?

Based on our usage, our bills are still only in the ~$40 range.

Thanks.

Obvious question would be, do OV condos show lower strata fees? It seems to reason they would (since nothing energy-based is included), but I've heard the opposite.

[officedweller]

OT since I'm not in OV, but I'll have to check my bills - I think I'm (one person) in the 300-400 kW range too for 869 sq ft (light, heat, laundry) but I often fall asleep with multiple lights on (nowhere near the 600 kW threshold for 2nd tier BC Hydro rates). Hot water is in the strata fees. Summer hydro is about $25 (no A/C), winter up to about $50 per month (using heaters sparingly, floor to ceiling windows, but not on a corner).

Originally Posted by SpongeG

i think concord also wants people to say "this must be a concord development"... brand/bland identity

The Urban Design Panel forced Concord to have all the Marinaside towers look similar - like a "family" of towers.

Note how the "Yaletown Edge" towers and those near the Roundhouse are quite a bit different with more brick.

Beach neighbourhood and Cooper Park neighbourhood are each a bit of a mixed bag.

[sacrifice333]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

Any chance you can post what a typical energy bill looks like?

Based on our usage, our bills are still only in the ~$40 range.

Thanks.

Obvious question would be, do OV condos show lower strata fees? It seems to reason they would (since nothing energy-based is included), but I've heard the opposite.

If comparing apples to apples they might. But this greenification doesn't come cheap, so, no.

I'll try to dig out some bills for ya...

[Jebby]

Originally Posted by sacrifice333

If comparing apples to apples they might. But this greenification doesn't come cheap, so, no.

I'll try to dig out some bills for ya...

I wonder how much the maintenance costs for all the green features, especially the buildings with green roofs, adds to the strata fees.

[officedweller]

Just saw this in today's Metro:

http://metronews.ca/news/vancouver/879575/olympic-village-residents-steamed-over-busted-heating/

[wrenegade]

Originally Posted by officedweller

Report regarding SEFC Neighbourhood Energy Utility:

http://former.vancouver.ca/ctyclerk/cclerk/20131210/documents/cfsc1c.pdf

Wow - base charge (capital and operating costs) will be $0.50 per sq metre per month, then energy usage is charged on top of that.

So if I were in SEFC instead of Yaletown, my 869 sq ft condo would be 80.7 sq metres = $40 per month base charge.
That seems pretty high.

This sounds about right. I've been living in SEFC (James) since October 2012 and my most recently $61 bill is the cheapest I've had. And air conditioning doesn't work in the winter (base water temperature is too high).

[sacrifice333]

Originally Posted by Jebby

I wonder how much the maintenance costs for all the green features, especially the buildings with green roofs, adds to the strata fees.

Most of the green roofs are on the rental, coop, etc. buildings. The market housing buildings generally have private roofdecks for the PH owners.

Originally Posted by officedweller

Just saw this in today's Metro:

http://metronews.ca/news/vancouver/879575/olympic-village-residents-steamed-over-busted-heating/

The system is, frankly, weak. Though it should provide sufficient heat for a reasonable temperature when working and maintained properly. I would not suggest however that one should have to walk around with a winter jacket on, nor would I suggest that one would be able to wear shorts and a t-shirt during the current outdoor temps.

[sacrifice333]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

Any chance you can post what a typical energy bill looks like?

Based on our usage, our bills are still only in the ~$40 range.

Here ya go WC12... 2 bi-monthly (60 day) bills, overlapping-ish. Approx. 1100 sq. ft. unit with basically floor to ceiling windows on 2 walls, 2 walls interior...

BC Hydro

hydro by nate_fri, on Flickr

Enerpro

enerpro by nate_fri, on Flickr

[officedweller]

You forgot to blank out your account number on the EnerPro bill (at the bottom)

Wait a sec - you pay for hot and cold water by the gallon?
Otherwise for 1100 sq ft and 2 months (and keeping warm) - prob not too out of line.

[sacrifice333]

Originally Posted by officedweller

You forgot to blank out your account number on the EnerPro bill (at the bottom)

Wait a sec - you pay for hot and cold water by the gallon?
Otherwise for 1100 sq ft and 2 months (and keeping warm) - prob not too out of line.

YUP. Both H&C. My understanding, correct me if I'm wrong, but at a building level there is a water usage charge. Enerpro is largely an education service whereby this large, lump-sum that would normally register maybe once-a-year while looking through a strata budget becomes a tangible part of your consciousness and thereby you use less water and save more money.

p.s. now you have to pay my bill!

[officedweller]

Ha!
Not involved with my strata, so there could be a building charge that's hidden in my strata fees.