stal̕əw̓asəm (Riverview) Bridge (Pattullo Bridge Replacement) | U/C

[cornholio]

I agree with everyone else here that this is a ploy to put pressure on the Province and Feds to step in.The timeline places the expenditures (and the 🞵🞵🞵🞵 storm it would generate) just before the next Federal election and at the start of the run up to the Provincial election, the timing is logical and can't be more effective imo. This also coincidentally came right after the Massey tunnel announcement by the Province, which can be coincidence but I doubt it. The Province will eventually use the safety word in regards to the Massey tunnel to sell the project because the tunnel will collapse in a earthquake, and how can you argue against that? Once they do translink only needs to point out Pattullo and the Province will need to step in otherwise they would risk being hypocrites.

As a side benefit it can shift some liability off of translink. When people continue to get killed on that thing eventually it will reach a point when a family of some one will be able to make a case that they can push all the way to the supreme court, and win. Of course this also applies in the event the bridge collapses in a earthquake or for some other reason. If the bridge is in that bad of a shape, and it can be replaced, which it can, but due to incompetence the decision is dragged on for decades then eventually you cross a line when it becomes negligent and someone ends up civilly or even criminally responsible.

What people have to forget is that unlike a bridge that has reached its capacity, this bridge is a actual death trap. The bridge is unsafe for its users, the bridge will fall in a earthquake, the bridge is falling apart which can result in any number of bad incidents. The point is that translink is doing all they can, this makes for a decent defense and shifts some if not most of the blame on to the Province/Feds.

[twoNeurons]

We haven't seen this kind of political gamesmanship since Tom Prendergast was head of Translink.

Well played, Translink... well played.

[WarrenC12]

Translink should indicate that if the referendum doesn't pass, the PB will have to close.

[tybuilding]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

Translink should indicate that if the referendum doesn't pass, the PB will have to close.

Yes because even if is tolled it probably wouldn't live up to traffic projections so it too will need to subsidized.

[makr3trkr]

Canada Way at 13th, yesterday afternoon (looking north).

the lineup to get on the Pattullo was **4 km** of truck traffic

Translink/MoT seriously need to consider restricting heavy vehicles from using the bridge during rush hours, and/or slightly lowering the truck toll on the Port Mann.

The bridge simply wasn't designed to handle the volume or the type of traffic it is currently serving as the "toll free" route.

[makr3trkr]

http://www.news1130.com/2013/10/28/netting-used-to-catch-parts-of-crumbling-pattullo-bridge/


Netting used to catch parts of crumbling Pattullo Bridge
Net will be installed in late-March

NEW WESTMINSTER (NEWS1130) – It’s another sign the Pattullo Bridge is acting its age.

TransLink is going to install some heavy-duty netting to catch falling concrete.

TransLink has already been chipping away at the old concrete and patching up the 76-year-old bridge.

Director of Roads Sany Zein says they’re increasingly seeing pieces fall, so they’ll be installing a net under the bridge in the area where the concrete is most at-risk of coming down. “Safety remains our main concern. We are managing the bridge very, very closely and keeping an eye on these issues and taking the necessary steps to keep the public safe.”

The plan is to install the net by late-March.

“The netting is designed specifically to catch the concrete,” says Zein. “It’s put very tight against the bridge structure, so it’s not like the concrete will fall a great distance and then be caught. The netting is right there under the structure.”

Meantime, discussions continue about the future of the Pattullo, and whether to replace it with a new bridge. A final option is expected by fall 2014.

[tybuilding]

Originally Posted by makr3trkr

Canada Way at 13th, yesterday afternoon (looking north).

the lineup to get on the Pattullo was **4 km** of truck traffic

Translink/MoT seriously need to consider restricting heavy vehicles from using the bridge during rush hours, and/or slightly lowering the truck toll on the Port Mann.

The bridge simply wasn't designed to handle the volume or the type of traffic it is currently serving as the "toll free" route.

We know we need a new bridge, Translink needs to spend $300 Million to keep the current bridge going apparently. Why not add a tolling system now? There still are "free alternatives"

[DKaz]

This is why I take the Port Mann Bridge to/from downtown when I do need to drive despite living across the street from Gateway Station.

[twoNeurons]

Toll the Lion's Gate. It is the most convenient bridge with an alternative route. It was upgraded recently. Use the proceeds to fund a new Patullo.

[Smooth]

Originally Posted by twoNeurons

Toll the Lion's Gate. It is the most convenient bridge with an alternative route. It was upgraded recently. Use the proceeds to fund a new Patullo.

Good luck with that Robin Hood tolling technique. As the North Shore municipalities often point out, they pay the most TransLink property tax in the region and get the least in return. If you tried tolling the North Shore bridges to pay for infrastructure in Surrey and New Westminster then you'd likely see the Blue Bus service expanded and the North Shore removing themselves from TransLink.

[makr3trkr]

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-co...up-between-surrey-and-new-west-1.2450872

Pattullo Bridge fight heats up between Surrey and New West

CBC News Posted: Dec 04, 2013 11:06 AM PT

"Some Surrey city councillors are accusing New Westminster of pulling out of negotiations to replace the aging Pattullo Bridge.

In June, TransLink presented six options to replace the 75-year-old bridge, which connects New Westminster and Surrey.

Only two options are still under consideration: a new four lane crossing or a new six lane crossing — which the City of Surrey has endorsed.

But Surrey Coun. Barinder Rasode says New Westminster has pulled out of talks on both.

"We've been waiting a long time and we feel like we are spending a lot of money on a bridge that is unsafe. We need a new bridge, and New Westminster has now pulled out because the option of refurbishing the bridge has been taken off the table."

Surrey argues the delay could force TransLink to spend tens of millions repairing the Pattullo, instead of building something new.

New Westminster Coun. Chuck Puchmayr says the city may one day support a four-lane crossing, but not the six lanes Surrey wants.

Puchmayr says he would rather the crossing be built closer to Coquitlam.

"We have zero capacity to take any extra traffic in New Westminster. We are already seeing massive gridlock from people diverting the Port Mann toll," he said."

==================================================

Just demolish it, and spend the remaining money on the Massey Tunnel project or a crossing at Tree Island.

[GlassCity]

Well they'd likely toll it once they replace it so I don't think it would be used to avoid the Port Mann anymore.

What I find weird is that they're giving the Massey Tunnel replacement a potential ten lanes while this one would only get 6.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by GlassCity

Well they'd likely toll it once they replace it so I don't think it would be used to avoid the Port Mann anymore.

What I find weird is that they're giving the Massey Tunnel replacement a potential ten lanes while this one would only get 6.

No place for 10 lanes to go, especially on the New West side.

Also I consider the GMT 10 lane bridge to be pie in the sky. Remember when Gordon Campbell laid out a $20B skytrain plan in 2007 or so, to be complete by 2020? This seems like the same thing to me.

[GlassCity]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

No place for 10 lanes to go, especially on the New West side.

Also I consider the GMT 10 lane bridge to be pie in the sky. Remember when Gordon Campbell laid out a $20B skytrain plan in 2007 or so, to be complete by 2020? This seems like the same thing to me.

I actually don't remember this, and I'm very glad or else I would be very upset right now.

[Zassk]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

No place for 10 lanes to go, especially on the New West side.

Also I consider the GMT 10 lane bridge to be pie in the sky. Remember when Gordon Campbell laid out a $20B skytrain plan in 2007 or so, to be complete by 2020? This seems like the same thing to me.

It wasn't a $20B SkyTrain plan, it was a $20B transportation plan, and we have gotten a fair ways down the list. Going from memory, I believe it included:

- Sea to Sky highway
- third SeaBus
- Canada Line
- Pitt River Bridge and MHB
- Gateway Hwy 10/13/15
- Port Mann project
- SFPR
- Evergreen Line
- UBC Line
- Surrey extension to Fleetwood
- few small projects

Did not include a Massey Tunnel project, as far as I recall...? and I don't think it counted Translink projects (GEB or Patullo).

Anyway, we are just a couple of big ticket items away from approaching $20B.

[WarrenC12]

Sorry I was too lazy to research but here's a thread right on SSP:

http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=144256

SKYTRAIN EXPANSION:

- $2 billion to construct the new, 19 kilometre Canada Line from downtown Vancouver to Vancouver International Airport in Richmond by end of 2009

- $1.4 billion to build the 11 kilometre Evergreen Line by 2014, connecting Coquitlam Centre to the Lougheed Town Centre Station

- $2.8 billion to build a new, 12 kilometre line from Broadway Station to University of British Columbia by 2020

- $3.1 billion to double capacity on the existing Expo Line, including major improvements to stations starting in 2009 and a 6 kilometre extension in Surrey by 2020. Improvements will include lengthening platforms to handle 6 car trains, additional storage track, upgrades to the control system, vehicle storage depots, maintenance facilities and adjacent transit exchanges.

- $1 billion for additional SkyTrain cars

RAPID BUS:

The Provincial Transit Plan calls for $1.2 billion to be invested in RapidBus BC by 2020. RapidBus BC will be available along nine lines in British Columbia:

- From Westbank to the University of British Columbia Okanagan in the central Okanagan

- From Douglas Street in downtown Victoria to Langford on the West Shore

- Highway 1, connecting Lougheed Station to exchanges in Surrey and Langley across the Port Mann Bridge

- Hastings Street from downtown Vancouver to Simon Fraser University

- 41st Avenue from the Canada Line to the University of British Columbia

- Highway 99 from White Rock to the Canada Line in Richmond

- King George Highway from Surrey Centre south to White Rock

- Fraser Highway, connecting Langley to the Expo Line in Surrey

- Highway 7 from the Evergreen Line in Coquitlam across the new Golden Ears Bridge

EXPANDED BUS FLEET

The Provincial Transit Plan will significantly increase the provincial bus fleet to improve service in many communities around the province. By investing $1.6 billion in 1,500 new, clean energy buses and related maintenance infrastructure, and increasing the hours of service, transit riders will have
access to more buses, more often. The new buses will be selected to meet the specific needs of communities in cost-effective, energy efficient ways.

Clean technologies include:
■ Hydrogen
■ Hybrid
■ Electric
■ Natural Gas
■ Low emissions diesel

By this announcement (2008) the Canada Line was already approved and financed. But otherwise, some pretty huge numbers thrown around here... $1B for new cars? $3.1B for the Expo line alone?

There's a great map that looks more like a transit fantasy thread these days.

And this announcement in 2008 had all of the homework behind it that the GMT replacement has: some fancy pictures and a press release.

[SFUVancouver]

Of the $14B in the Provincial Transit Plan, $2B was already announced and committed for the Canada Line and "Of the $11.1 billion in new funding, the Province is committing up to $4.75 billion and is calling on the federal government for $3.1 billion, TransLink for $2.75 billion and local governments for $500 million along with supportive land use decisions."

Source: http://www.th.gov.bc.ca/Transit_Plan/Provincial_Transit_Plan_LR.pdf

It's worth noting as well that the Province called for a 6km extension of SkyTrain in Surrey, so it's incorrect rhetoric to say that South of the Fraser was being ignored.

[Mininari]

Ah yes, Gordon's infamous $14.0B transit plan.
How are we doing on that anyway? I'm guessing we won't see those UBC / Surrey Skytrain extensions by 2020, not if another $3.0B is going into the H99 project (even with tolls). The election cycle in 2015 might help a bit on this front, but I'm not convinced the conservatives have any more money for BC Transit projects. (Too busy funding Rob Ford's Subways! Subways! Subways!).

The final 'test' for the Patullo 'free alternative' is coming on Monday. Back to school, back to work, back to everything. Christmas is over, and the Grinch stole the discounted Port Mann Toll rate. How is a full-price Port Mann Bridge with fully implemented SFPR (minus the not-yet-open Tannery Road Interchange), going to alter traffic patterns. This shall be interesting.

On the bright side, maybe New Westminster should consider allowing streetside vendors to walk up and down the masses of idling trucks and cars waiting to get onto the Patullo, offering them food, coffee, newspapers, or whatever to help pass the boredom in the folly of 'free alternative.' Neither is my time.

[go_leafs_go02]

Originally Posted by Mininari

Ah yes, Gordon's infamous $14.0B transit plan.
How are we doing on that anyway? I'm guessing we won't see those UBC / Surrey Skytrain extensions by 2020, not if another $3.0B is going into the H99 project (even with tolls).

The final 'test' for the Patullo 'free alternative' is coming on Monday. Back to school, back to work, back to everything. Christmas is over, and the Grinch stole the discounted Port Mann Toll rate. How is a full-price Port Mann Bridge with fully implemented SFPR (minus the not-yet-open Tannery Road Interchange), going to alter traffic patterns. This shall be interesting.

On the bright side, maybe New Westminster should consider allowing streetside vendors to walk up and down the masses of idling trucks and cars waiting to get onto the Patullo, offering them food, coffee, newspapers, or whatever to help pass the boredom in the folly of 'free alternative.' Nothing is free. In my books, my time is not free.

Tannery Road interchange is open fully.

[Mininari]

Originally Posted by go_leafs_go02

Tannery Road interchange is open fully.

Oh! Great! Thanks, I didn't know it was. Was it fully open on ribbon-cutting day?
I guess I should have waited for my drive on it later today... oh well, my bad!