Metro Vancouver Transit Discussion

[queetz@home]

Originally Posted by xd_1771

Who knows what's the real motivation towards LRT and from SkyTrain, whether it's really a resignation.... what most of the public should know is that SkyTrain, according to Surrey's politicians and spokespersons, splits and destroys communities. I will never stop going back to those words and I will never stop putting pressure on them for that.

I know we disagreed in the past but I do admire your dedication to the issue. Hopefully they would listen, but you should also keep an open mind if there is a possible compromise of sorts (i.e. Skytrain for one route, LRT for the rest, etc).

[tybuilding]

Originally Posted by xd_1771

Who knows what's the real motivation towards LRT and from SkyTrain, whether it's really a resignation.... what most of the public should know is that SkyTrain, according to Surrey's politicians and spokespersons, splits and destroys communities. I will never stop going back to those words and I will never stop putting pressure on them for that.

The politicians do change their minds from time to time. A few years ago when Dianne Watts was interviewed for the opening of the Pioneer overpass she was very much against Vancouver style separated bike lanes. No one is planned for King George in Whalley.

Speaking of skytrain the Mark 1 car renovations, do bikes fit in to the flex space? Is there room away from the doors built now for bikes like the Canada line at one side of the train?

[GlassCity]

I don't know, to me it seems pretty clear that Surrey is the next priority following Broadway. Either way we can't settle on good enough, because once the tracks are in place there is no chance that it will ever be upgraded.

[Gordon]

Could Translink use bi-articulated buses (CApacity >170 pass. to increase capacity along Broadway?

[xd_1771]

Speaking of Mark I renovations, I got to ride 063 today at Patterson! These trains look seriously renewed up-close.


The interior colour scheme makes the car feel so much more spacious and friendly, let alone the removed seating. I wish that 063/064 had the redone lighting like 011/012 though. The redone lighting completes the deal.

----

On the Surrey issue, the RRT1A option is actually a great compromise - the capital cost is the same as LRT1. I do think that, on the community-level, a few tweaks will need to be made, particularly where the BRT ROW comes in (i.e. little actual transit improvement to be enjoyed on 104 Ave with the ROW; also, the BRT ROW must not impede on a future SkyTrain upgrade as needed to meet RTS goals).

There's also the possibility of a separate SkyTrain line altogether with shorter stations and potentially more areas serviced, that hasn't been looked at. I reckon a single line extending 104th, 152nd and Fraser ,creating improvements for Guildford AND Langley, using 2-car trains rather than 5-car trains, and with a future Newton extension potential could cost similarly to the current proposal - but I haven't checked the numbers. Not enough time for that.

[Zassk]

Originally Posted by Gordon

Could Translink use bi-articulated buses (CApacity >170 pass. to increase capacity along Broadway?

The buses on Broadway already come almost as often as possible, and are frequently bunched together. Basically, the road is full. A longer bus will just take the same road space as two existing buses. Short of closing the road to all cars, it's not feasible to add more bus capacity to the road.

[GlassCity]

Originally Posted by xd_1771

There's also the possibility of a separate SkyTrain line altogether with shorter stations and potentially more areas serviced, that hasn't been looked at. I reckon a single line extending 104th, 152nd and Fraser ,creating improvements for Guildford AND Langley, using 2-car trains rather than 5-car trains, and with a future Newton extension potential could cost similarly to the current proposal - but I haven't checked the numbers. Not enough time for that.

Funny you say that, that's the alignment I've been thinking of ever since I saw the plans. Having to transfer is one of the worst parts of transit and combining the 104st line with the Fraser line would eliminate that completely, at the cost of only a couple minutes.

I agree that it's a good compromise as King George Boulevard really doesn't "need" rail transit right now. It could easily be upgraded later now.

[proudcanuck]

Originally Posted by jsbertram

I'll say full on Sept 3rd.

The South Surrey Park And Ride expansion at capacity??? At this rate... I would say never.

The most vehicles I have seen in there is 5.
99.9% of the time it is completely empty. Although last week I did see 1 car in there. As of right now it seems like a waste of $4.5 million dollars. I can only hope that it improves.

[whiteshadow]

Originally Posted by proudcanuck

The South Surrey Park And Ride expansion at capacity??? At this rate... I would say never.

The most vehicles I have seen in there is 5.
99.9% of the time it is completely empty. Although last week I did see 1 car in there. As of right now it seems like a waste of $4.5 million dollars. I can only hope that it improves.

With Translink now putting a parking charge on the South Surrey P&R, few people are parking in there and instead lining KGB up from Crescent Road to 152nd to get free parking. Not sure if I should be surprised Translink didn't see this as a result of the parking charge.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by whiteshadow

With Translink now putting a parking charge on the South Surrey P&R, few people are parking in there and instead lining KGB up from Crescent Road to 152nd to get free parking. Not sure if I should be surprised Translink didn't see this as a result of the parking charge.

How much is the charge?

I'm surprised they wouldn't work with the city to have "limit 2 hour 9am-6pm" signs or something similar put up.

[nname]

$2 a day, which is still a bargain compared to most P&R for WCE and SkyTrain stations, which are now at $3/day.

[queetz@home]

Originally Posted by nname

$2 a day, which is still a bargain compared to most P&R for WCE and SkyTrain stations, which are now at $3/day.

But WCE and Skytrain are train services. If I were to park my car to take the bus, why should I pay for crappy transit service? If the transit service was a train of some sort, whether WCE, Skytrain or LRT, sure. But for a bus? Screw that! I'd rather just drive the extra km and park at a train P&R.

[nname]

Originally Posted by queetz@home

But WCE and Skytrain are train services. If I were to park my car to take the bus, why should I pay for crappy transit service? If the transit service was a train of some sort, whether WCE, Skytrain or LRT, sure. But for a bus? Screw that! I'd rather just drive the extra km and park at a train P&R.

Bus departing South Surrey P&R toward Surrey Central/Bridgeport: every 5-10min all day, all night
Train departing WCE station: every 30min peak hour, peak direction only

I'll pick the bus any time

[NathanCH]

Originally Posted by Zassk

The buses on Broadway already come almost as often as possible, and are frequently bunched together. Basically, the road is full. A longer bus will just take the same road space as two existing buses. Short of closing the road to all cars, it's not feasible to add more bus capacity to the road.

It seems to be an issue and with nothing planned for the next 10 years, what can we do about it?

[GeeCee]

The Commercial-Broadway up escalator is now fixed. Translink posted about it on Facebook and as usual people bitched and moaned about it because this is Vancouver and that's what people do about everything.

[GlassCity]

The important thing to remember is that Translink is always at fault for any regional transportation shortcomings and that no other transit agency in the world experiences any problems.

[Millennium2002]

Is that supposed to be sarcastic? lol

[queetz@home]

Originally Posted by nname

Bus departing South Surrey P&R toward Surrey Central/Bridgeport: every 5-10min all day, all night
Train departing WCE station: every 30min peak hour, peak direction only

I'll pick the bus any time

Is that bus the Greyhound types that the WCE uses? Or is it just an ordinary bus that plies most of the regional routes?

Because if its the latter, there is really no value trading it in for the comfort of your own car to get to the train. You are dealing with South Surrey here too, I doubt they would give up their Escalades and Q7s for an uncomfortable, non-airconditioned bus soon...

Originally Posted by GlassCity

The important thing to remember is that Translink is always at fault for any regional transportation shortcomings and that no other transit agency in the world experiences any problems.

I'm sure this is sarcastic but there is a lot of truth to this nonetheless. Some of their decisions are just visibly questionable and provide constant ammo for the likes of Jordan Bateman. I wonder if the agencyis simply being setup to fail by the powers to be and those that are the whipping boys such as the ridiculously large amount of execs who are so visibly overpaid are purposely allowing themselves to be, in exchange for that overpaid compensation...

[Vonny]

Originally Posted by Gordon

Could Translink use bi-articulated buses (CApacity >170 pass. to increase capacity along Broadway?

Originally Posted by Zassk

The buses on Broadway already come almost as often as possible, and are frequently bunched together. Basically, the road is full. A longer bus will just take the same road space as two existing buses. Short of closing the road to all cars, it's not feasible to add more bus capacity to the road.

someone doesn't have to forget that Broadway is 6 lanes width...

Thought, I don't think bi-articulated buses is the right solution for Broadway (even, and especially for a short term fix, see below link for why), something needs to be done for
1/ the next 10 years
2/ West of Arbutus for probably much longer time
...since a subway, will not happen anytime sooner.

this something could look like:

(see also http://voony.wordpress.com/2012/11/09/bus-capacity-some-remarks/ for why the bus capacity is not a linear function of its length)

Bottom line: There is certainly ways to add 20% more bus capacity on Broadway, as well as relieve the pressure on it:
http://voony.wordpress.com/2012/11/12/improving-bus-service-on-broadway-and-elsewhere/

[theKB]

Those buses have been a standard in most of europe for a long time, I am not totally sure why they haven't been added here. Is there some sort of sourcing requirement from that government that New Flyer be the primary manufacturer?

Originally Posted by Zassk

The buses on Broadway already come almost as often as possible, and are frequently bunched together. Basically, the road is full. A longer bus will just take the same road space as two existing buses. Short of closing the road to all cars, it's not feasible to add more bus capacity to the road.

do not give vision vancouver any ideas here