Winnipeg Construction VIII

[Biff]

Originally Posted by DonaldSmith

Are they hotel condos in association with Westin or a stand alone residential portion?

My understanding was that there were proposed 30 units on the top 6 floors. I believe they were/are separate from the hotel.

[oftheMoon]

Originally Posted by Biff

My understanding was that there were proposed 30 units on the top 6 floors. I believe they were/are separate from the hotel.

I've heard some Winnipeg realtors have received basic info on these proposed condos. The plan is to sell the condos as raw space so buyers can develop how they wish. Pricing supposedly north of the $400/sq. ft. mark for this raw space. Condo owners will have full use of the hotel facilities such as concierge service etc.

[steveosnyder]

Originally Posted by Danny D Oh

I just keep wondering what the market for a lot of these condo developments is. I'm a 26 year-old university grad 3 years into a teaching career. Nearly all of my similarly aged friends are also university grads, several from professional programs, and few of us are established in our careers (ranging from Education to Engineering to Nursing and Business) to the point where we could purchase and afford to live in most of these condo developments I take a look at, both in the core and suburbs. I have many friends in their early to mid 30s, some of them could afford it, but aren't really interested in condo lifestyle with young families, especially in the core. I feel that by the time I'm ready to purchase, the housing market will have cooled, I'll likely have a young family that puts me in a spot where living in the exchange is not ideal, and I think that's pretty typical, even among those of us who aren't afraid to live downtown. Basically, at this point in my life living downtown would be great, but by the time I can comfortably afford it I probably won't be interested. Seems like this 25-40 bracket would be the typical age group to live downtown. Are they hoping for a flood of retirees?

I believe it is pretty certain that the housing bubble will pop relatively soon in Winnipeg and Canada as prices and debt continue to rise, and the condo market will be a big part of it. Are supply and demand lining up? Seems like there is trouble selling existing condos (subsidy-gate) and more are proposed.

Studies out of the states show that during the housing crisis houses in the burbs decreased at a rate much higher than those in downtown. While it's not a complete and walkable neighbourhood by any stretch, the studies said that walkability and density had the highest correlation to keeping their value.

By these measures the worst hit places would be Whyte Ridge, Linden Ridge, etc. in the South, not downtown condos, and the best kept values being in the Osborne/Corydon area.

Originally Posted by cheswick

Wasn't there an article a while back in regards to the Portage Place pads. Something about any potential developer wanting access to the parkade but FNP unwilling to give it up cause they get too much revenue from it.

FNP is a parking corporation thinly veiled as a government owned development and holding company.

[The Unknown Poster]

If Weston builds here, NHL and concert people will have to stay there? Even though the Chipman family are developing the ALT project right across the street from the MTSC?

Also Kives is brutal. If you follow him on twitter, he loves a good negative story and will gladly re-tweet all negative remarks and ignore positive ones. If you only followed him during the first couple of IGF events you'd think the parking issue was an historic tragedy.

[DonaldSmith]

Originally Posted by The Unknown Poster

Also Kives is brutal. If you follow him on twitter, he loves a good negative story and will gladly re-tweet all negative remarks and ignore positive ones. If you only followed him during the first couple of IGF events you'd think the parking issue was an historic tragedy.

If I had to report on City Hall everyday, I am sure it would take a toll on me psychologically as well...

[CoryB]

If Fairmont upgrades, Project W is a Westin, Alt is open, SoPo has the planned hotel and the new Convention Centre hotel is also open it is a real tough call were concert acts and NHL teams will stay. If True North can exert any pressure on the matter the hotels they have vested interests in (Alt, SoPo) will be the first choices.

[oftheMoon]

Originally Posted by CoryB

If Fairmont upgrades, Project W is a Westin, Alt is open, SoPo has the planned hotel and the new Convention Centre hotel is also open it is a real tough call were concert acts and NHL teams will stay. If True North can exert any pressure on the matter the hotels they have vested interests in (Alt, SoPo) will be the first choices.

The Fairmont is classed as a 4 star. I assume the Westin will be also. Most Alt hotels in other parts of the country are classed as a 3 star, so again assume Winnipeg's will be also.

I tend to think that while the SoPo, Alt and any of the Convention Centre hotels are in closer proximity to the MTS Centre, class rating will dictate where NHL teams and bands stay.

[trueviking]

starwood has a contract with the NHL and whoever the concert promotions group is...if a 4 star of their brand exists in the city they must stay there...its an NHL contract not an individual team one....chipmans owning a hotel will not matter....if a westin exists here the NHL will stay there....previously starwood did not have a hotel in Winnipeg at a high enough standard so they could stay wherever they wanted.

ALT isn't high enough standard for the NHL anyways....its modern looking but not high level.

[trueviking]

Originally Posted by oftheMoon

I've heard some Winnipeg realtors have received basic info on these proposed condos. The plan is to sell the condos as raw space so buyers can develop how they wish. Pricing supposedly north of the $400/sq. ft. mark for this raw space. Condo owners will have full use of the hotel facilities such as concierge service etc.

this seems right....which is why I would not be surprised if it didn't happen....I have a hard time believing that creswin will build $15m worth of floor space without it being previously sold....they are risk averse to put it mildly.

the original plan was to start selling them last February....I have never understood why the sales have not been made public...doesn't jive with the schedule for the hotel.

[Wigglez]

Originally Posted by trueviking

this seems right....which is why I would not be surprised if it didn't happen....I have a hard time believing that creswin will build $15m worth of floor space without it being previously sold....they are risk averse to put it mildly.

the original plan was to start selling them last February....I have never understood why the sales have not been made public...doesn't jive with the schedule for the hotel.

So assuming that the condos do not go forward. Does that mean that the top 6 floors will be chopped off the existing design? AND assuming the office space does not go forward as well, will they also hack off a few more floors?

If the answer is yes to one or either of those, then they're going to turn a boring high rise at portage and main into a terrible midrise?

[trueviking]

I would think so....office would be 4-5 floors I would think.....about 40000 s.f.

I would be ok with an 18 storey building there to be honest.

[bomberjet]

Originally Posted by trueviking

the original plan was to start selling them last February....I have never understood why the sales have not been made public...doesn't jive with the schedule for the hotel.

So how would they sell condos without making it public? Just start asking all his rich buddies if they want to buy condo space? Maybe that's their problem.

[trueviking]

i think that actually was kind of the plan.

[lilwayne]

i think most of these projects will proceed. i mean the person who wrote the article is a complete moron

d condos is over 50 percent sold its proceeding

glasshouse sold frickin 30 percent of its units in the first few weeks from i remember its proceeding

alt hotel and herritedge are already off the ground


westin hotel is moving forward theyve spent enough money on it already... nothin in this city gets built over night... but it should be off the ground next summer

and Fortress project has 90 percent chance of moving forward i mean if this didnt go through this would be a huge blow to thier reputations.. THey wouldnt put themselves out there like this create all this hype if they werent for real.. U think they would risk embarassment by hyping a project and stating confidently that once they decide to do a project they always follow through... THIS PROJECT WILL HAPPEN the scale of it is anyones guess though.


so po and convention center hotel will move forward...aswelll.. ppl are just to impatient and that article was complete joke.

[armorand93]

I walked by what used to be Silver Heights collegiate today... duplex/condo construction is well underway, along with road layouts, and ripping out the old school foundations as well. Mount Royal and Ness - no action yet.

[JamieDavid Exchange]

Fortress has, or is very close to, purchased the surface lot. I do not think they are in the business of buying surface lots just to collect montly rent. OBVIOUSLY something will be built there. As long as it includes a grocery store, I'm very happy.

[Cyro]

Originally Posted by hexrae

He has a vested interest in the Winnipeg mentality - Link

This does put some perspective on the most recent article and gives us an idea on the opinions/feelings the writer is most comfortable and familiar with when writing about "some, but not all", constuction, urban planning or developemnt issues from the 90's onward in the City.

From Link Above:

"an uncertain if optimistic future."

? This is a text book definition of a safe quote.

[pegcityfan]

"Winnipeg’s only true 4 star branded hotel" - soposquare.com

True Viking is right though; If NHL has a deal with Starwood, wouldn't all teams would eventually stay at project W.

I sometimes have a hard time believing there will be two hotels across from the Delta. I wouldn't be shocked if Longboat moved the hotel off SoPo Square and onto the Carlton Inn lot. Skywalk would go from WCC > Carlton Inn lot Hotel > Sopo > CityPlace > MTS Centre.

[pegcityfan]

Originally Posted by trueviking

don't believe everything you read on twitter.

My guess is they will announce that they purchased the land.....any images will be pretend...something cut and pasted from somewhere else likely.

my money is they will not show anything....they have not even really started the process beyond due diligence on the land.

We'll have to agree to disagree. I believe they'll reveal a render, additional info, details on the name... Just my guess.

[bomberjet]

Originally Posted by pegcityfan

"Winnipeg’s only true 4 star branded hotel" - soposquare.com

True Viking is right though; If NHL has a deal with Starwood, wouldn't all teams would eventually stay at project W.

I sometimes have a hard time believing there will be two hotels across from the Delta. I wouldn't be shocked if Longboat moved the hotel off SoPo Square and onto the Carlton Inn lot. Skywalk would go from WCC > Carlton Inn lot Hotel > Sopo > CityPlace > MTS Centre.

Did I miss something or have they changed the concept? I didn't think there was a hotel as part of SoPo. Thought it was the two ten story office buildings (MPI and Liquor & Lotteries) and the parkade.