Time for Vancouver to Tear Down Its Viaducts?

[jlousa]

Wayne Gretzky once said the key to his success was that he would go to where the puck was heading not to where it was. Same thing applies to Real estate. Those that bought at Woodwards and in Crosstown have faired much better then those in Yaletown over the last 5yrs. Chinatown is the next spot to dump some money into.

[Steveston]

Was walking along Pacific east of the stadium yesterday after the Lions game, and noticed some bits of concrete on the sidewalk. Looked up and saw a significant amount of spalling on the underside edge of the viaduct.

If we wait a couple of years, the issue of demolishing the viaducts will become moot, as they simply fall apart.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by jlousa

Wayne Gretzky once said the key to his success was that he would go to where the puck was heading not to where it was. Same thing applies to Real estate. Those that bought at Woodwards and in Crosstown have faired much better then those in Yaletown over the last 5yrs. Chinatown is the next spot to dump some money into.

I know you have a vested interest in the Woodwards building, but they are hardly gaining in value. IMO those will be the first to fall if/when RE slides more than it already has.

[spm2013]

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[Zassk]

Originally Posted by Steveston

Was walking along Pacific east of the stadium yesterday after the Lions game, and noticed some bits of concrete on the sidewalk. Looked up and saw a significant amount of spalling on the underside edge of the viaduct.

If we wait a couple of years, the issue of demolishing the viaducts will become moot, as they simply fall apart.

This seems unlikely to me. Burrard Bridge, yes - a perfect example of a concrete structure with insufficient maintenance - yet look how long it has lasted, and how the city has no plans to replace it. The viaducts, by comparison, should have as long a useful lifespan as Burrard Bridge, if properly maintained. The viaducts are 40 years younger than Burrard Bridge. The viaducts should be good for at least 40 more years in the absence of earthquakes (as with Burrard Bridge).

[spm2013]

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[logan5]

Originally Posted by makr3trkr

The I-405 in LA was closed for over a year, and people managed, but only because Caltrans prepared for over a year for that in a media blitz.

Just because traffic moves somewhere else or some people don't drive doesn't mean it's the end of the story.

The Powell St. closure seems like a pretty good test for the eventual dismantling of the viaducts. I think the city added a left turn lane and tinkered with traffic signals in order to accommodate the extra volume diverted from Powell St. The underutilized viaducts would be replaced by a rebuilt Pacific Blvd and connecting streets. A much more substantial countermeasure to what was done for Powell St.

All the proponents of the viaducts seem to be conveniently ignoring the Powell St. closure. If you view the cities decision making process in an unbiased manner then you have to look at the Powell St. example and conclude that maybe the closure of the viaducts will not be a disaster like some are predicting.

Originally Posted by spm2013

I'm just hoping for Carmageddon in September...

I think this is a common attitude. An opportunity to bash certain policy makers supersedes common sense and the chance to improve the livability of our city.

[Alex Mackinnon]

Originally Posted by Steveston

Was walking along Pacific east of the stadium yesterday after the Lions game, and noticed some bits of concrete on the sidewalk. Looked up and saw a significant amount of spalling on the underside edge of the viaduct.

If we wait a couple of years, the issue of demolishing the viaducts will become moot, as they simply fall apart.

It doesn't look too bad for concrete that's 40 years old. Look at most weathered concrete and you will see some cracks and spalling. There's also some on top by the sidewalks. Neither would be expensive to patch.

The Powell St. closure has been a rather large annoyance for me lately. At rush hour there's basically no way out of Strathcona that's not congested. I've been waiting 5+ minutes to get through the light at Clark and Hastings so I can head to my work on the North Shore for night shift.

Normally I would take Powell from Raymur, but sadly no longer.

[logan5]

Originally Posted by jlousa

You obviously don't drive, have you seen what's happened to Hastings since Powell closed down?
If that's what they want to use as an example then good on them

I'm more than willing to look at any numbers you have regarding increased travel time for commuters since the Powell street closures. Emoticons are pretty weak evidence.

Keep in mind practically nothing was done to accommodate higher traffic volumes from Powell street, while there would be major reconstruction of the streets below the viaducts.

[Alex Mackinnon]

Originally Posted by logan5

I'm more than willing to look at any numbers you have regarding increased travel time for commuters since the Powell street closures. Emoticons are pretty weak evidence.

Keep in mind practically nothing was done to accommodate higher traffic volumes from Powell street, while there would be major reconstruction of the streets below the viaducts.

Heading East, it's 5 minutes on a good day. 10 minutes on a poor one. Traffic likes to back up to Heatley on Hastings now. I can't say anything of traffic coming up to that point or turning off of Powell.

From Clark east of Powell there's a lot less traffic now, it's just a pain to turn left off of Hastings.

Heading West you see backups at rather stupid times of day. I've had to wait several lights heading counter flow to on to Hastings from Powell. I don't know about the mornings though.

[spm2013]

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[spm2013]

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[jlousa]

The last 6wks whenever I've tried to get out of town to ride my motorcycle in the evenings I've been stuck in the mess that is Hastings for an extra 10min from Abbott to ~Victoria. 10minutes might not sound like much but when it used to take less then 10min to drive that stretch it's an increase of over 100%. If I drive along Cordova instead then stay right and cut along alleys until Clark like a number of other cars it still costs me about 5-7mins plus I'm putting myself and others at greater risk. Once you get past Victoria it's almost back to normal (but still very busy) as some traffic has cut back to Powell. Sorry don't have all day to sit there and count cars to show you stats, just my personal observations, if your personal observations are different I'd love to hear them.

Is that what the city wants to happen to Chinatown/Hastings/Pacific all day long?

[officedweller]

Can you divert to Terminal Ave instead?

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by jlousa

The last 6wks whenever I've tried to get out of town to ride my motorcycle in the evenings I've been stuck in the mess that is Hastings for an extra 10min from Abbott to ~Victoria. 10minutes might not sound like much but when it used to take less then 10min to drive that stretch it's an increase of over 100%. If I drive along Cordova instead then stay right and cut along alleys until Clark like a number of other cars it still costs me about 5-7mins plus I'm putting myself and others at greater risk. Once you get past Victoria it's almost back to normal (but still very busy) as some traffic has cut back to Powell. Sorry don't have all day to sit there and count cars to show you stats, just my personal observations, if your personal observations are different I'd love to hear them.

Is that what the city wants to happen to Chinatown/Hastings/Pacific all day long?

It's not what they WANT to happen to Chinatown/Hastings/Pacific .... but they're so dogmatic and convinced that they are correct ... they don't CARE if it does ... (or rather, they have deluded themselves that it won't)

[theKB]

Originally Posted by officedweller

Can you divert to Terminal Ave instead?

that main/terminal intersection is a disaster at the best of times.

[officedweller]

I was actually thinking Quebec to Terminal.

[makr3trkr]

Originally Posted by trofirhen

It's not what they WANT to happen to Chinatown/Hastings/Pacific .... but they're so dogmatic and convinced that they are correct ... they don't CARE if it does ... (or rather, they have deluded themselves that it won't)

If case of increased congestion
- increase paid parking window from 10pm to midnight, or make it 24hrs a day
- increase per hour rates to 10 - 20 dollars /hour
- close more lanes
- close city owned parking lots and hand condo developers kickbacks

simples.

/end sarcasm

[logan5]

Originally Posted by jlousa

The last 6wks whenever I've tried to get out of town to ride my motorcycle in the evenings I've been stuck in the mess that is Hastings for an extra 10min from Abbott to ~Victoria. 10minutes might not sound like much but when it used to take less then 10min to drive that stretch it's an increase of over 100%. If I drive along Cordova instead then stay right and cut along alleys until Clark like a number of other cars it still costs me about 5-7mins plus I'm putting myself and others at greater risk. Once you get past Victoria it's almost back to normal (but still very busy) as some traffic has cut back to Powell. Sorry don't have all day to sit there and count cars to show you stats, just my personal observations, if your personal observations are different I'd love to hear them.

Is that what the city wants to happen to Chinatown/Hastings/Pacific all day long?

My observation is that I have not noticed a change on Hastings at all, but observations can be a little distorted or exaggerated. If traffic volumes are higher before Victoria, this means traffic volumes will be less past Victoria. Overall volumes are constant. If volumes are increased in one area, they will decrease in another. So to be fair, how much time savings are there past Victoria?

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by trofirhen

It's not what they WANT to happen to Chinatown/Hastings/Pacific .... but they're so dogmatic and convinced that they are correct ... they don't CARE if it does ... (or rather, they have deluded themselves that it won't)

With all due respect, when's the last time you've been in Vancouver? Your opinions are less relevant than Meggs' pie in the sky visions.