DENVER | Transportation Thread

[awholeparade]

I don't think I've ever seen a bike cop wait through a red light. And as someone that's received 2 tickets for stopping, waiting a few seconds, and then continuing through a light with NO CAR in sight, it always pisses me off.

[Cirrus]

Is biking on the sidewalk legal in Denver? That tends to vary city by city. I don't have a problem with it, provided sidewalk cyclists go at pedestrian speeds and always always always yield to peds.

[bobg]

Originally Posted by RyanD

You know how we all say we should utilize streets on our bikes and stay off the sidewalks? Well I was enjoying a pleasant walk down 20th when these idiots blew past me shouting "Coming through". THESE people out of everyone else should be setting the example.. I jogged toward them while launching my camera app just to get a picture to prove the story to be true. They were hauling ass weaving in and out between people..

Denver Revised Municipal Code
Sec. 54-576. Riding on sidewalks.

(a)
Riding bicycles or electrical assisted bicycles upon or along sidewalks, whether on public property or private property opened for use by the general public, shall be unlawful except:
(1)
When the operator or rider thereof is a uniformed city employee or uniformed state employee or uniformed federal employee, which are working as part of their official duties and are riding a bicycle or electrical assisted bicycle or a police officer riding a bicycle or electrical assisted bicycle that is a marked or unmarked official police bicycle or electrical assisted bicycle or while engaged in the discharge of his or her official duties; or
(2)
When the operator or rider of a bicycle thereof is engaged in the delivery of newspapers;
(3)
Where the sidewalk is part of a designated bicycle route; or
(4)
When the operator or rider thereof is preparing to dismount and park the bicycle or electrical assisted bicycle at a location on the block on which the bicycle or electrical assisted bicycle is being operated, or the operator has just mounted and has not yet crossed a street or alley.
(b)
Bicyclists shall yield the right-of-way to pedestrians on the sidewalk.
(c)
Riding electrical assisted bicycles upon or along sidewalks shall be unlawful, except as provided for in this section above.

If cops can use (a)(1) I have no problem using (a)(3) and (a)(4) on a daily basis. There's exceptions to riding on the sidewalk and just working for the government in an official capacity is one of them. Police, meter maids, etc. get numerous exceptions while operating motor vehicles as well, and if we used how police drive cars as examples of acceptable behavior none of us would have passed our driving tests at 16.

[Zmapper]

I had the chance to visit the Fort Collins Archives (in the Museum north of the transfer center) and looked through the old phone books, knowing that bus information could be found in the "local" pages. The oldest map of Transfort I could find was from 1989. I traced the routes out on Google Maps so you all can take a look.

http://goo.gl/maps/DhonJ

In short, Fort Collins once had a grid system! Sure, the frequencies were 1-2 buses per hour, and connections likely weren't timed very well, but we had a route structure that Transfort is moving in the direction of (and for good reason).

[Wizened Variations]

Originally Posted by bunt_q

Exactly. That was sort of my point in a reply to Wizened that I think got lost/never posted. But it's odd to be that we'd assume the solution to a poor India-like society is more transit, when the best transit in the world seems to be associated with the wealthy. (Although, even then, probably not the top-10%... the uber rich are a different breed altogether.)

I think a lot of that assumption comes from Wizened's view of the Delhi Metro as some sort of gold standard for effectively and comfortably moving the destitute masses. Which is a characterization that still astounds me.

No. The point is that EVEN the new Delhi metro is better than Fastracks will be.

The Gold Standard is in Japan, which built much of it's system when it was rather poor.

My point has been all along that a large(r) percentage of transportation planning needs to deal with preparing for the "possibility" of whatever.

Here is a basic paper on US population projection and public transportation.

www4.uwm.edu/cuts/2050/demo2050.pdf

where the high versus low projection for 2050 varies between 314.7 million and 553 million for 2050. A middle projection of 404 million is discussed.

In addition, current population demographics and public transit usage are discussed.

My point here is the requirement to plan more for the maximum, as public transportation planning for that maximum will increase system efficiency regardless of what the population turns out to be in 2050. In addition, the lower the eventual population turns out to be, IMO, the higher the percentage of the population that will use it.

Now, cross correlate that with the (good) possibility that a significant percentage of whatever the population is in 2050, will have less money to spend on transportation. This illustrates the (likely) possibility that the percentage of population using public transportation in 2050 will likely be larger than in 2013, so the range of possible usage is even greater than defined by 314.7 - 553 million.

I have my opinion, as do we all.

[PLANSIT]

15th St. Protected Bike Lane Phase I started today. Sorry, crappy photo.

[OneWay]

Does anyone know if the current RTD commuter rail system could/will be a faster speed service? The commuter trains seem quite slow compared to BART trains (in my limited experience). Not sure what kind of changes would be required or if it's even planned.

[BG918]

Originally Posted by PLANSIT

15th St. Protected Bike Lane Phase I started today. Sorry, crappy photo.

Awesome. As a bike commuter that usually accesses the CBD via the Cherry Creek trail this gives me a more protected second option via Bannock to 15th (northbound), which I assume it will connect to the cycle track there somehow. Will this run all the way from Colfax to the Platte River?

[PLANSIT]

Originally Posted by BG918

Awesome. As a bike commuter that usually accesses the CBD via the Cherry Creek trail this gives me a more protected second option via Bannock to 15th (northbound), which I assume it will connect to the cycle track there somehow. Will this run all the way from Colfax to the Platte River?

Cleveland to Lawrence/Larimer

Remember, 15th curves into Blake, therefore the bike facility has to go from left-side to right-side at Lawrence. After that it becomes a shared facility for the time being. Further study is needed to figure out 15th up to the Highlands.

[bunt_q]

Originally Posted by Wizened Variations

where the high versus low projection for 2050 varies between 314.7 million and 553 million for 2050. A middle projection of 404 million is discussed.

Irrelevant, unless those people live within a finite distance of a transit station. I don't care if the U.S. has 700 million people. If they are living at less than, say, 10 dwelling units per acre, transit is not going to be truly viable, no matter how nice you build it. That's not opinion, that's fact.

[CharlesCO]

Originally Posted by OneWay

Does anyone know if the current RTD commuter rail system could/will be a faster speed service? The commuter trains seem quite slow compared to BART trains (in my limited experience). Not sure what kind of changes would be required or if it's even planned.

From what I've read, the top speeds of the Silverliner V will be 79mph, according to RTD's documents. I believe that's the same speed that SEPTA is using, though clearly both RTD and SEPTA will be using a governor to attain that speed, as Hyundai says the maximum operating speed is 99mph.

BART's cars can reach up to 80mph in the Transbay Tube, though that's rare. Their usual operating speed elsewhere in the system is somewhere between 60 and 70. Their new fleet coming in 2017 will run at the same speed.

By comparison, RTD's current Siemens LRVs run at a maximum speed of 55mph, while Muni's Breda LRVs run at 35mph (thank you nimbys).

Of course, all these speeds are significantly reduced when you include the time lost when stopping at stations.

[OneWay]

Thanks for the information. Im curious if existing lines are capable of/planned to be increased in speed. I've heard some complaints about how slow the W line is...not sure if the design is a limiting factor or if there is a plan to upgrade in the future.

[Scottk]

So I just got back from Italy and have some comments about the transit there, and some of the things RTD does right in comparison.

I always hear people on this forum complaining about the seat setup on the light rail in denver. All of The trains I rode in Italy had the exact same shitty setup. The only exception was the metro in Milan. I think that rtd has chosen this setup because it is the most efficient??

Trains in Italy have much better right of ways, and run more frequently than rtd.

But, at least RTD has trains that run usually on time. In Italy the trains were never on time. They were frequently disgustingly dirty and graffiti covered. One particularly nasty train that I rode had "welcome to hell" spray painted on the side. RTD is much better about making sure that riding the train is a pleasant experience.

The metro in Milan was heavily used, but full of pick pockets in the station. I have never felt as unsafe in a metro station than I have in Milan. I have ridden metros all around the world, but Milan central seemed downright dangerous. At least most of the RTD stations are safe.

Sorry if this doesn't fit here... Just wanted to post some random thoughts I had

[LAM]

Originally Posted by Scottk

So I just got back from Italy and have some comments about the transit there, and some of the things RTD does right in comparison.

I always hear people on this forum complaining about the seat setup on the light rail in denver. All of The trains I rode in Italy had the exact same shitty setup. The only exception was the metro in Milan. I think that rtd has chosen this setup because it is the most efficient??

Trains in Italy have much better right of ways, and run more frequently than rtd.

But, at least RTD has trains that run usually on time. In Italy the trains were never on time. They were frequently disgustingly dirty and graffiti covered. One particularly nasty train that I rode had "welcome to hell" spray painted on the side. RTD is much better about making sure that riding the train is a pleasant experience.

The metro in Milan was heavily used, but full of pick pockets in the station. I have never felt as unsafe in a metro station than I have in Milan. I have ridden metros all around the world, but Milan central seemed downright dangerous. At least most of the RTD stations are safe.

Sorry if this doesn't fit here... Just wanted to post some random thoughts I had

The thing I don't like about the light rail seating is that the seats face each other and on too many occasions, I see some unsavory looking person sitting with their feet on the seat across the way and people feel uncomfortable sitting there. That behavior is up there with parking in bike lanes for completely unacceptable. I just prefer to stand.

[CharlesCO]

Originally Posted by OneWay

Thanks for the information. Im curious if existing lines are capable of/planned to be increased in speed. I've heard some complaints about how slow the W line is...not sure if the design is a limiting factor or if there is a plan to upgrade in the future.

I don't know the specifics (and I've admittedly never ridden the W— no reason for me to ever go west), but I believe they reduced the speed on much of it to 35 mph in order to appease neighbors. So theoretically, they could increase the speed on that line.

As for the others, the central loop from underneath the Colfax viaduct through downtown is slow. I think it could be improved if the trains were given better signal priority over auto traffic, though I also think part of it is a design flaw. Any time that you make in the suburbs on a light rail line with its own ROW is irrelevant as long as it shares ROW in a downtown loop.

I think the southeast and southwest lines are fast though, once you are south of the Broadway station. I think the light rail vehicles are faster than driving portions of Santa Fe and I-25 in rush hour traffic.

[seventwenty]

Originally Posted by CharlesCO

I think the southeast and southwest lines are fast though, once you are south of the Broadway station. I think the light rail vehicles are faster than driving portions of Santa Fe and I-25 in rush hour traffic.

I got bored on the E line last week and used my bike riding app to see how fast the train went. From Lincoln to Union Station, the average speed was 31.7 mph, with the fastest speed of 65.9 mph.

[CharlesCO]

Originally Posted by seventwenty

I got bored on the E line last week and used my bike riding app to see how fast the train went. From Lincoln to Union Station, the average speed was 31.7 mph, with the fastest speed of 65.9 mph.

Huh, interesting. Where was the 65.9mph speed? I know the Siemens vehicles have an actual top speed of 65mph, but I was under the impression that most agencies (including RTD) governed them at 55.

I suppose your numbers also show that our light rail system maybe isn't that bad compared to driving speeds.

[seventwenty]

Originally Posted by CharlesCO

Huh, interesting. Where was the 65.9mph speed? I know the Siemens vehicles have an actual top speed of 65mph, but I was under the impression that most agencies (including RTD) governed them at 55.

I suppose your numbers also show that our light rail system maybe isn't that bad compared to driving speeds.

Before I-225. I think between County Line and Dry Creek. Someone else should "MapMyRide" the train, just to verify my numbers. While I recall 65.9 mph as the high, my phone stated that the "real" high was 647 mph, all because the software lagged and tried to catch back up. Or some other techno reason. Also, looking at the route map now, it looks like the line I traveled doesn't follow the tracks to a T. So that may explain why the speed is higher than it should be.

[CharlesCO]

Meanwhile, in Boulder:

Company pitches Diagonal Highway monorail to ease Boulder-Longmont commute
...

SkyTran commuters ride inside small, futuristic three-person pods that can be called on demand, 24/7, for nonstop service to their destination. The three-person seating capacity reflects the U.S. DOT's finding that the average commuter vehicle now contains 1.2 passengers, down from 1.5 passengers five years ago. Regular users could use their smart phone to command a pod that would be waiting upon their arrival at the station.

The two proposed end stations would be located at the RTD Table Mesa Park and Ride off of Highway 36 in Boulder and at the junction of U.S. 287 and the Diagonal in Longmont. Other proposed stations would include the junction of Pearl Street and Foothills Parkway, and stops along the Diagonal at Jay, Mineral, Niwot , and Hover roads.

The monorail guideway system would be elevated between poles inside the highway's median. The pods will be propelled via magnetic levitation, costing one-tenth the power of conventional transit systems, with electricity coming from solar panels on the guideways during the day and from hydrogen fuel cells at night. Williamson said the system will also have the infrastructure to sell excess hydrogen to fueling stations once that technology is commercially available in cars.

...

http://www.dailycamera.com/boulder-count...ould-see-fast-transport-demand#idc-cover

I hate it when this kind of stuff gets reported to the press as if it's a legitimate idea...

[Fritzdude]

Originally Posted by CharlesCO

Meanwhile, in Boulder:



http://www.dailycamera.com/boulder-count...ould-see-fast-transport-demand#idc-cover

I hate it when this kind of stuff gets reported to the press as if it's a legitimate idea...

Why are you so easily dismissive of alternative forms of transportation? If it doesn't raise your tax dollars, then why do you care? It's solving a need by getting people from point A to point B in a quick and inexpensive manner. So, why not consider it? It sure beats paying bicycle taxis $2 per block to slowly wander across town.

It's a niche market, obviously, but assuming they get granted right-of-way access - I bet this idea would become heavily utilized. I know that if I could get across town in 5 minutes for less than 3 bucks, I'd sure as hell use it.