Downtown Update

[SteelTown]

Stan Keyes

[HillStreetBlues]

Originally Posted by movingtohamilton

Hamilton likely takes the crown as Canada's number 1 city for payday loan outlets. Doesn't the head of their association live here?

Yes: he is mentioned in this article in the Globe, along with Hamilton.

This is an interesting article, particularly the note about credit unions doing just what you say in Quebec, and supplanting payday loans (with help from provincial regulations).

I've read elsewhere about the huge costs of bad debts to these outfits, so I'm not sure banks would want to take this segment on without some government framework.

The costs of these places is horrendous to people who use them, and can be an important part of the vicious cycle of poverty. In a real way, they really do prey on the poor, and I wonder how we could help educate our neighbours to their ill effects.

[Dwils01]

I'm going to Hamilton this weekend and I'm hoping to take pictures of all the construction projects in the city and I was hoping that you guys could fill me in on some of them that aren't in the database so I don't miss any.

[movingtohamilton]

Originally Posted by HillStreetBlues

...
This is an interesting article, particularly the note about credit unions doing just what you say in Quebec, and supplanting payday loans (with help from provincial regulations).

... In a real way, they really do prey on the poor, and I wonder how we could help educate our neighbours to their ill effects.

I'm fairly certain that poor people know they are being preyed on. What they need is an real alternative (like a credit union). Quebec is leading the way.

[HillStreetBlues]

Originally Posted by movingtohamilton

I'm fairly certain that poor people know they are being preyed on. What they need is an real alternative (like a credit union). Quebec is leading the way.

I'm unsure whether users of credit unions generally know how bad these transactions are for their financial health. I've never used a payday loan or strongly considered using one, so I'm not certain what the decision process might be like. I have known people with credit card debt who only understand in let's say an academic way how expensive the debt really is, and I suspect payday loan users are similar. Of course they probably know it's costly, but I suspect a lot of them don't truly understand how much.

I'm also not sure why you think Quebec is "leading the way." They've prohibited payday loans, apparently, but I now read elsewhere that short term loans are not widely available.

What alternatives? Many of these loans are only days in duration, and the appeal is that there are often no credit checks, and a short processing time. As a member of a credit union, I'm not really sure I'd want it to get involved in these...

[movingtohamilton]

HillStreetBlues, I have no detailed answers to your questions. I've been thinking about the widespread presence of these loansharks in Hamilton, and wondering aloud why there are no options for people who use them. I get that poverty in downtown Hamilton and these companies go hand in hand. I was thinking that a credit union like FirstOntario could walk-the-walk and truly show it is a stakeholder by getting involved. Stan Keyes and his bunch could care less about Hamilton.

[HillStreetBlues]

Originally Posted by movingtohamilton

Stan Keyes and his bunch could care less about Hamilton.

I'd say this is 100% right!

[bigguy1231]

I don't know where you get the idea that these loan places are in such abundance in this city. I did a search for moneymart and they have 9 locations in Hamilton. I also did a search for Edmonton just picking another Canadian city and they have 23 locations with 7 in or near their downtown. We don't have any more here than any other city in the country on a per capita basis. I am sure all of the other payday loan companies are equally well represented in most other Canadian cities as well.

[movingtohamilton]

Originally Posted by bigguy1231

... I did a search for moneymart and they have 9 locations in Hamilton. ... I am sure all of the other payday loan companies are equally well represented in most other Canadian cities as well.

Did you do a search beyond moneymart? You would have found locations for:

Cash Max
Money Direct
Cash Store
Cheque N Cash
Cash Depot
Cash Source
Insta Loan

But so what. My earlier comments were hyperbole. It's not a contest to crown Canada's #1 city for legal loansharks. All these companies benefit from poverty in Hamilton.

[bigguy1231]

Originally Posted by movingtohamilton

Did you do a search beyond moneymart? You would have found locations for:

Cash Max
Money Direct
Cash Store
Cheque N Cash
Cash Depot
Cash Source
Insta Loan

But so what. My earlier comments were hyperbole. It's not a contest to crown Canada's #1 city for legal loansharks. All these companies benefit from poverty in Hamilton.

There is poverty in every city, and it's never going to go away. A certain percentage of the population, usually around 20%, will always be considered to be impoverished.

[SteelTown]

Originally Posted by Dwils01

I'm going to Hamilton this weekend and I'm hoping to take pictures of all the construction projects in the city and I was hoping that you guys could fill me in on some of them that aren't in the database so I don't miss any.

Downtown

Hilton/Condo - Main/Bay
McMaster Campus - Main/Bay
Royal Connaught - lobby restoration
King/Hess condo
James St N/Vine
Main/John - Hamilton Grand
W Lofts - Murray St
City Square - Robinson St
Stinson Lofts

Mountain

St. Joseph's Centre for Mountain Health Services - Fennell
Mohawk College Athletic Centre - Fennell
Hamilton School Board - near Limeridge Mall

And I can't think anymore.

[matt602]

The Pan Am stadium as well but at this point its just a foundation.

[Dwils01]

Originally Posted by SteelTown

Downtown

Hilton/Condo - Main/Bay
McMaster Campus - Main/Bay
Royal Connaught - lobby restoration
King/Hess condo
James St N/Vine
Main/John - Hamilton Grand
W Lofts - Murray St
City Square - Robinson St
Stinson Lofts

Mountain

St. Joseph's Centre for Mountain Health Services - Fennell
Mohawk College Athletic Centre - Fennell
Hamilton School Board - near Limeridge Mall

And I can't think anymore.

Thanks
I made some maps and will put these sites on them. Will be down there tomorrow and should have all these pictures up by next week.

[movingtohamilton]

Originally Posted by bigguy1231

There is poverty in every city, and it's never going to go away. A certain percentage of the population, usually around 20%, will always be considered to be impoverished.

bigguy1231, you describe yourself as a concerned citizen. Clearly, payday loan companies are not a concern to you. So what items of concern are on your list? As a relative newcomer to Hamilton, my list is straightforward.

[SteelTown]

Five (more) things downtown Hamilton needs

More places to live
More shopping for women
A mid-sized concert venue
A hardware store
A facelift

http://www.cbc.ca/hamilton/news/story/2013/07/04/hamilton-downtown-top-five.html

[flar]

Originally Posted by bigguy1231

I don't know where you get the idea that these loan places are in such abundance in this city. I did a search for moneymart and they have 9 locations in Hamilton. I also did a search for Edmonton just picking another Canadian city and they have 23 locations with 7 in or near their downtown. We don't have any more here than any other city in the country on a per capita basis. I am sure all of the other payday loan companies are equally well represented in most other Canadian cities as well.

Edmonton is the only large Canadian city I've seen with a worse downtown than Hamilton

[bigguy1231]

Originally Posted by flar

Edmonton is the only large Canadian city I've seen with a worse downtown than Hamilton

I just picked one city for comparison. Most other larger Canadian cities are similar when it comes to these payday loan places. Where legal they infest the downtowns. But they do pay taxes and provide jobs.

[movingtohamilton]

Bigguy1231, with all due respect you dodge the issue with every reply. I don't get it.

[bigguy1231]

Originally Posted by movingtohamilton

Bigguy1231, with all due respect you dodge the issue with every reply. I don't get it.

Dodge what issue. I am just pointing out that this isn't a phenomena unique to Hamilton.

[movingtohamilton]

With that logic, we should encourage brothels, "gentlemen's clubs", "spas", more bingo halls, etc. to set up on King St near James. They pay taxes and employ people.