London Roads

[Pimpmasterdac]

Adelaide SB @ Commissioners is a double-left too, though I believe that's due to Adelaide never being extended in Westminster Ponds, rather than a foresight in planning..

Though in general London needs a lot more double-left turn lanes. I don't know whether it's a lack of space in some areas to implement them, or a lack of foresight, but there are lots of intersections that could use it.

Two that could use it ASAP
-Wellington SB @ Commissioners could use one, whole intersection is a gong show.
-Baseline WB @ Wellington, area is backed up heavily cause of the hospital.
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Unfortunately I don't believe that those intersection improvements are going to be implemented with Southdale widening @ Wharncliffe this year. The design plans I've seen leave the intersections as is, guess it would be too logical to do them at the same time.. Hope I'm wrong, but knowing London they won't do it this year.

Southdale Widening: http://www.london.ca/Tenders_and_RFPs/Tender2013/T13-32Add2.pdf

[ssiguy]

Originally Posted by manny_santos

For the volume of traffic in London, there is a surprising lack of double left turn lanes at major intersections. Virtually all major intersections in Kingston have them, and have had them for decades.

I understand that London is planning on bringing in 14 double left-hand turn lanes...............right after they finish the Ring Road.

[MrSlippery519]

Originally Posted by Pimpmasterdac

Unfortunately I don't believe that those intersection improvements are going to be implemented with Southdale widening @ Wharncliffe this year. The design plans I've seen leave the intersections as is, guess it would be too logical to do them at the same time.. Hope I'm wrong, but knowing London they won't do it this year.

Southdale Widening: http://www.london.ca/Tenders_and_RFPs/Tender2013/T13-32Add2.pdf

It's London...why would they do it now? Makes much more sense to tear up the road again next year to add this

[haljackey]

Originally Posted by ssiguy

I understand that London is planning on bringing in 14 double left-hand turn lanes...............right after they finish the Ring Road.

If I could like/upvote/give karma to this post, I would.

[MolsonExport]

SARNIA ROAD. WESTERN ROAD. these are horrible at rush hour.
yes, I work at UWO.

[K85]

I can think of at least 5 dual turn lanes.

Wellington / Commissioners
Fanshawe / Highbury
Fanshawe / Wonderland
Wilton Grove / Highbury
Adelaide / Commissioners

I am also pretty sure there are two I'm missing. I do a lot (stupidly, but I like to randomly drive) of driving in the city. There are no less than 10 intersections that could use double turn lanes.

[Whisper09]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

...yes, I work at UWO.

Don Wright by any chance?

[MolsonExport]

nope.

[haljackey]

Oh the Fanshawe/Highbury reconstruction features a double left? Cool! Too bad one of the lanes won't get used much until Fanshawe is widened to Adelaide.

Some of the busiest left-turns that I typically drive. Each should have double-lefts.

-Wonderland SB to Southdale EB
-Horton WB to Warncliffe SB
-Commissioners WB to Warncliffe SB
-Exeter EB to Wellington NB
-Sarnia WB to Wonderland SB
-Oxford EB to Highbury SB
-Wonderland SB to Exeter WB
-Western NB to Sarnia WB, Sarnia EB to Western NB
-Horton in both directions at Wellington
-Warncliffe in both directions at Wonderland
-Oxford in both directions at Richmond
-Southdale/Warncliffe (every direction except SB to WB)
-Fanshawe/Richmond (should be a 4-way double left)
-Oxford/Warncliffe (should be a 4-way double left)
-Oxford/Adelaide (should be a 4-way double left)
-Oxford/Wonderland (should be a 4-way double left)
-Bradley/Wellington (should be a 4-way double left)
-Southdale/Wellington (should be a 4-way double left)

Hyde Park will need some too once it gets double-laned.
Interchanges on VMP instead of double-left intersections
High-capacity roundabouts could work for some of the junctions too.

[haljackey]

Southdale is a slow mess between Warncliffe and Wonderland now - avoid at all costs.
-Nice to see full construction now taking place however.

Many people are taking Commissioners as a alternate but it's only 2 lanes between Viscount and Wonderland so it is quite slow too.

[manny_santos]

Has any of the Bradley extension gotten under way? I noticed a section west of Wharncliffe now appears on CityMap, though the aerial image isn't from this year yet.

[haljackey]

I went down Warncliffe this weekend and was wondering what they were doing. I said to myself that that the road under construction is awfully close to where Bradley should be and I guess that's because it is the road.

OK so looking at Citymap now and I see a stub of Bradley west of Warncliffe. That stub then bends to the north and feeds into a roundabout under constructing in a new suburb. I'm assuming this 'bend' will be a side street later on, and this stub is only being built for residents of this subdivision to access Warncliffe.

I've also recently driven on the stretch of Bradley west of Wonderland. It is crazy narrow (curbs and everything so no easy widening) and seems to be just an access route for people and trucks to get to the back of the Warncliffe/Southdale Power Centre.

One could get mad at just how and peacemeal the Bradley extension is getting done, but at least it is slowly starting to take shape.

[Pimpmasterdac]

London really shit the bed with road planning in the Southwest area. First they put those idiotic curb extensions & traffic islands to "calm traffic" in the area before widening any arterial roads. Now they're widening Southdale, which is while much overdue and needed, didn't bother to extend Bradley to Bostwick/Pack Rd. or even Wonderland to give some relief with the construction. As well Commissioners is down to 2 lanes east of Wellington to Wortley, being all torn up for repaving, making east-west travel in the south end challenging right now. Ass backwards planning.

As well still haven't seen any timetable as to when Bradley is going/planned to be extended. I know the city is doing a minimalist approach, whenever they do, widening Bradley to 4 lanes to White Oak Rd, and the rest to west as a 2 lane road, what Southdale is right now... Eventually it's suppose to be a 6 lane road like Wellington, some distant decade away.

[MrSlippery519]

Originally Posted by Pimpmasterdac

London really shit the bed with road planning in the Southwest area. First they put those idiotic curb extensions & traffic islands to "calm traffic" in the area before widening any arterial roads. Now they're widening Southdale, which is while much overdue and needed, didn't bother to extend Bradley to Bostwick/Pack Rd. or even Wonderland to give some relief with the construction. As well Commissioners is down to 2 lanes east of Wellington to Wortley, being all torn up for repaving, making east-west travel in the south end challenging right now. Ass backwards planning.

As well still haven't seen any timetable as to when Bradley is going/planned to be extended. I know the city is doing a minimalist approach, whenever they do, widening Bradley to 4 lanes to White Oak Rd, and the rest to west as a 2 lane road, what Southdale is right now... Eventually it's suppose to be a 6 lane road like Wellington, some distant decade away.

Its plain stupidity quite frankly...I am sure there are legit reasons that we may not know of but from the outside it seems idiotic.

Bradley should have been extended years ago firstly and it should be 4 lanes all the way from Highbury to Wonderland. Once that was done they could have worked on Southdale which like you said is needed but now makes getting east/west from this part of town a joke.

I live in the East end and work right beside the new bus depot on Wonderland...my sons daycare is just off Bradley near Whiteoak road so I deal with this mess on a daily basis unfortunately.

[GreatTallNorth2]

No offense guys, but why are you all getting excited about road building. What a bad investment for London. The city should be throwing every single penny at massive transit improvements.

It's like London is always 30 years behind.

[Blitz]

I don't think that's reasonable given the local culture. Maybe after long-standing traffic issues have been addressed then a greater focus can be directed toward transit.

[manny_santos]

http://www.lfpress.com/2013/06/06/reina-...less-rate-for-18--to-24-year-olds-is-183

Wow...almost 1 in 5. Really sobering.

[GreatTallNorth2]

Originally Posted by Blitz

I don't think that's reasonable given the local culture. Maybe after long-standing traffic issues have been addressed then a greater focus can be directed toward transit.

I think the culture needs to change. Traffic issues will be addressed when the city builds a better transit culture and people think different and change their habits.

[ssiguy]

London's problem is that it has never really had an effective transportation planning dept.

The city, thankfully, declined the freeway route that has destroyed many similar sized cities but the problem was that they never used those saved funds for transit. Instead of doing one or the other, it decided to do nothing and London's traffic woes are the result.

London does need some desperate road improvements but it must also get it's transit up to scratch. That means BRT along the busy corridors with very frequent all day service, later operating hours and especially on Thurs to Sat for the bar crowd, transit priority lanes, more crosstown routes, more bus shelters throughout the city, and creating more transit friendly development.

Despite the bitching, for it's size London actually has quite a decent transit service but it needs to improve it's speed, frequency, comfort, and operational hours to make it a truly viable alternative.

[Pimpmasterdac]

To be fair London's always had a good traffic planning department. There are many comprehensive plans and reports that have been done to solve traffic issues. However, like anything planned by the city, there's significant inertia to pulling the trigger and implementing these changes. People are resistant to change and NIMBYs have stalled/cancelled many projects that would've helped. Status quo of mediocrity remains supreme in London.

As far as London rejecting the in-city Highway 402 route, there was no upside to public transit in its rejection. The province was going to build Highway 402 regardless of what London's council thought, London could've moreless had a ring road paid ~90% by the province. When London dithered and it ultimately decided to go southwest of the city, there was no money waiting to be spent on public transit, it was gone, and province wasn't going to fund any grand public transit projects.

Fast forward to today and it's the same story with public transit plans, that exists for roads. There are good plans on the books, for express routes and ultimately BRT routes. However there's no money for them, and the only way London will get BRT routes is if senior levels of government step up to the plate. It's a bit more possible now that the Liberal Wynne government is considered a province wide 1% HST hike to fund transit in GTA and roads & transit for non-GTA areas. If that were to pass, London would be flush in funding to fix the road network as well as public transit. That's a big if though, whether this tax ever comes..

However I don't know how successful London's BRT plans will be, even if they do get the funding. The North/South route along Richmond & Wellington would require significant property acquisition; basically all the houses on Wellington from Baseline to the Thames, and front lawns, if not whole houses, and businesses on Richmond from Oxford to Thames north branch. That's just the North/South, the East/West route would be another whole ball of wax there. Overall it would probably require more expropriations than were ever planned for the in city Highway 402.

Again London has good plans, but it's ultimately going to rely on London pulling the trigger and implementing them over the objections of those who don't like change and NIMBYs that like the status quo of mediocrity that London is known for!