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  #3081  
Old Posted Apr 7, 2013, 10:47 AM
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Its understandable that you feel passionate about it, but you have no idea what is being proposed and your whole argument is based on the what citifront has come to be. that being the case we should just shut the door on any propososed project why even plan or propose anything if we are going to base its succes on the failures of what has been developed across the street from it, now that's the mentality that fustrates me. Just because these houses fit your idea of historical nothing should be developed? Relax comrade I'm not saying bulldoze the houses but ill keep an open mind. If it was up to me I would prefer it be proposed somewhere along north temple further west.
come on historical.

Last edited by gusam26; Apr 7, 2013 at 11:14 AM.
     
     
  #3082  
Old Posted Apr 7, 2013, 11:02 AM
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And maybe I don't feel passionate as you do for these houses because I am not from here and I really don't see anything special about them, so maybe I see them from the outsiders perspective. I do respect your point of view I just have a different opinion.

Last edited by gusam26; Apr 7, 2013 at 1:29 PM.
     
     
  #3083  
Old Posted Apr 7, 2013, 11:26 AM
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Gusam, I appreciate your post with pics. Clearly, some of those homes are not of a salvageable value. However, some
are. The problem is their location in what has now become a street with infrastructure set up for high density. Aren't
the majority of those homes owned by one specific owner? Obviously, whoever owns those homes and lots is going to
make a pretty profit. At the very least, the city should enforce a certain physical standard for high density replacement.

What about incorporating those homes of historical, architectural charm physically, literally into the base of the mid-rise
apartment? The towers themselves should also incorporate the same style, brick finish palette and materials,
with authentic elements, applied correctly.

If progressive officials in Park City can do it, so can officials in Salt Lake. Salt Lake City must place the same value on
it's CBD as Park City does. Downtown Salt Lake City has incredible potential for visitor financial return. Much more than
most cities. That visitor return is going to be compromised if Salt Lake doesn't adopt a consistent quality attitude
throughout the CBD as it has with many of it's civic and retail projects lately. That 600 W. location is now of such a
value that stricter standards will by no means inhibit the streets development. The term 'GATEWAY' should mean
something above the norm. Much more than cheap looking stucco storefronts and apartments, that it would seem are
often very pooly managed.

C'mon Salt Lake officials. There are developers with excellent track records, who will invest in a more attractive
complex, with adequate security surveillance and responsible management enforcement.

I'm glad to see the Gateway Center making some improvements at the street level. Hopefully, they will see the need
to upgrade their finishes throughout. Examples: IMO, the clock tower is a pathetic faux imitation. The visual finish
and elemental treatments of the immediate Northgate apartments could be so much more attractive and indicative of
the quality that is present with the Union Pacific and Rio Grande Depots. The Miller theater street engagement on Rio
Grande is dishearteningly sterile and cold. The Gateway district should be filled with inviting visuals and charm.
Not Disneyesque, amusement park tacky, That has it's place, but not in Downtown Salt Lake City. The Gateway
District should be dripping throughout with the same authentically finished charm as The Commercial Club,
The Devereaux, The Depots, The Dakota, The Crane, Beehive House, the old Daynes Music front, etc.

IMO, the massing and arrangement here is visually excellent. Though, I would have wished for a more iconic size to the
clock tower. However, the finish materials and elemental details used on pretty much everything in these two pics is
sooo subpar.


For me, the only finishing elements about this street scene that are salvageable is the street lighting. Even the
pavement feels unfinished. While utilitarian, it is cold and uninviting.



One by one, even if just one specific frontage at a time, Gateway should make it's massing finishes more organic.
One by one, convert a front here and a store there into something thoroughly Jacobian, Victorian and Edwardian. Do
it exactly in the same manner as would be visually confronted from a time proven stunning square in London, or even
a lost street from 19th Century Salt Lake. Do it with a focus toward a three dimensional depth of finish. Certainly not
a flat, one dimensional finish as with the Gateway Six.

Now, if the same quality of finish and elemental details were used above as in this proven stunner below, think how
much more inviting and enticing Gateway could be. The styles don't all need to be Chateauesque, but we all get
the picture.


http://upload.wikimedia.org

Last edited by delts145; Apr 7, 2013 at 2:02 PM.
     
     
  #3084  
Old Posted Apr 7, 2013, 4:46 PM
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This is completely off topic (again) and I apologize, but the Salt Lake Tribune ran a story on my Muppet LEGO proposal last Wednesday: http://m.sltrib.com/sltrib/mobile3/56096018-219/com-cuusoo-idea-ideas.html.csp ...if you're interested check it out.

To minimally connect it to some kind of development related discussion, I did talk up the upcoming LEGO Store to the reporter, but she seems to have not written it all quite the way that I would have written it if was...writing it.

It's a good thing I didn't write it.
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  #3085  
Old Posted Apr 7, 2013, 5:10 PM
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I am totally ok with the houses along 600 west being demolished for an apartment complex. The photos shown are actually out of date. The building on the corner has since started to collapse. It is connected to a house that really does not look all that good. There are plenty of areas in salt lake with well preserved historic houses. The houses along 600 west with acseption of 1 "maybe" 2 are not worth saving. And even the others are no huge loss. The houses are really out of place, are not particularly well kept, and basically detract from the area. When I drive down that street... Which is often. I can't help but think how getto that strip of houses make the area seem.

I would also like to see something done with the NW corner of north temple and 600 west.. It's just kind of an empty lot at the moment... Also.. Hopefully something is done with the old biomat building soon. I would love to see a food establishment of some sort occupy part of the ground floor... I also think it would be fantastic for radio shack to relocate there.. The whole SW corner of north temple and 900west needs to demolished.. and it needs to happen fast.
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  #3086  
Old Posted Apr 7, 2013, 5:18 PM
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Also.. On the UP Depot building... I love that building and it pisses me off to high hell how poorly it is being maintained. They need to fix the roof drainage on the front left side. There is a lot of water running down a small portion of the building... It is rapidly deteriorating the brick... It is starting to look really bad... I wish Boyer or who ever the hell is currently operating the place could be fined.. That is an extraordinarily relevant historic building... If they don't want to take care of it they shouldn't even have it... Sorry for the rant :/
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  #3087  
Old Posted Apr 7, 2013, 5:29 PM
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Please find out who the proper authorities are, and contact them about the needed repairs on the Union Pacific drainage. Then follow up. I've had to do this kind of thing countless times here in L.A. It's amazing how often a responsible procrastinator suddenly wakes up when they know others in the community are noticing and watching. It might take a little follow up also, but it's well worth it. You've noticed it AjiuO, and maybe you're not the owner, but the ball is in your court now. Let us know what happens.

North Temple businesses excited for airport TRAX line

Mary Mellor, Deseret News

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/86557...esses-excited-for-airport-TRAX-line.html

SALT LAKE CITY — As the new TRAX line to Salt Lake City International Airport prepares to open this month, the small businesses that call North Temple home are excited about potential new business...

...The $350 million investment along North Temple already is having a positive impact on businesses, he said. In addition to the TRAX line, the investment included $40 million spent by Salt Lake City on wider streets, wider sidewalks, bike lanes, crosswalks, new streetlights and improved landscaping.

"Property values are going up, business will be stronger, and the street is more attractive," Knowles said.

Another positive effect of the project, he said, is the mitigation of the illegal drug, prostitution and gang activity that has had a presence in the area for years...


.

Last edited by delts145; Apr 7, 2013 at 5:42 PM.
     
     
  #3088  
Old Posted Apr 7, 2013, 5:40 PM
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Maybe I could send some photos to some of the local news places and see if they will run a story.. Get people's attention... I'm sure they don't want any bad publicity.. Especially with so many of the retailers leaving.
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  #3089  
Old Posted Apr 7, 2013, 7:16 PM
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I hope the people of the city are nice to these so that we can continue to have them. :-)




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  #3090  
Old Posted Apr 7, 2013, 7:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ajiuO View Post
I am totally ok with the houses along 600 west being demolished for an apartment complex. The photos shown are actually out of date. The building on the corner has since started to collapse. It is connected to a house that really does not look all that good. There are plenty of areas in salt lake with well preserved historic houses. The houses along 600 west with acseption of 1 "maybe" 2 are not worth saving. And even the others are no huge loss. The houses are really out of place, are not particularly well kept, and basically detract from the area. When I drive down that street... Which is often. I can't help but think how getto that strip of houses make the area seem.

I would also like to see something done with the NW corner of north temple and 600 west.. It's just kind of an empty lot at the moment... Also.. Hopefully something is done with the old biomat building soon. I would love to see a food establishment of some sort occupy part of the ground floor... I also think it would be fantastic for radio shack to relocate there.. The whole SW corner of north temple and 900west needs to demolished.. and it needs to happen fast.
Those photos are from 2011. So, unless we've had some major natural disaster that I forgot, or slept through, the photos being outdated are irrelevant, because I doubt any of those houses have fallen into such disrepair that they need to be demolished.

Hell, those homes are as in good of shape as the homes I see in some neighborhoods around SugarHouse - and more historic.

I'd wager they're more historic than the houses ya'll live in. So, let's demolish your homes and build a cruddy apartment complex!

Granted, that corner building is awful and should be brought down (maybe for a smaller condo project - something with only two units) ... but the rest of the block is charming, quaint and rare in that area. What we're doing is turning the area west of the Gateway into a ghetto. I'm sorry, but that is exactly what is going on with these cheap apartment complexes. Hell, Citifront is barely ten years old, and Bridges isn't even that, and they're already rundown apartments. Are we willing to risk demolishing these homes on the chance the next apartments won't be cheap and tacky?

I don't know about that.

These are good homes that are in so much better shape than Citifront Apartments. Why demolish 'em?

     
     
  #3091  
Old Posted Apr 7, 2013, 8:34 PM
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Aren't those that live in the homes also responsible for blocking the 6th west alignment for the Airport Trax line?
     
     
  #3092  
Old Posted Apr 7, 2013, 8:40 PM
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Yes. Though it wasn't just residents, either, Becker opposed it too. But apparently all the fighting did little, since they're losing their homes even after the city agreed to keep the 400 West alignment.

I guess some will see it as karma? I don't know. Can't wait until that area becomes a drug infested rathole.
     
     
  #3093  
Old Posted Apr 7, 2013, 9:00 PM
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Speaking of 600 west apartments. Dose anyone know the story with the block between 500-600 west and 300-400 north. I know someone who had to move from that block. Their house was set for demolition apparently to make way for an apartment complex or something.. About half of the block is old industrial.
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  #3094  
Old Posted Apr 8, 2013, 5:20 AM
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What eyesores. Bring 'em down.
     
     
  #3095  
Old Posted Apr 8, 2013, 5:55 AM
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Yes. Though it wasn't just residents, either, Becker opposed it too. But apparently all the fighting did little, since they're losing their homes even after the city agreed to keep the 400 West alignment.

I guess some will see it as karma? I don't know. Can't wait until that area becomes a drug infested rathole.
Isn't that area already a drug infested rathole?
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  #3096  
Old Posted Apr 8, 2013, 6:14 AM
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Only because of Citifront. The street is actually pretty decent for being on the west-side.

I'd love to go into your neighborhood and say 'tear it down'. My guess is none of you live in anything worth saving. So, let's demolish 'it!
     
     
  #3097  
Old Posted Apr 8, 2013, 6:31 AM
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Only because of Citifront. The street is actually pretty decent for being on the west-side.

I'd love to go into your neighborhood and say 'tear it down'. My guess is none of you live in anything worth saving. So, let's demolish 'it!
Sadly we kind of get that a lot with apartments. Renters don't tend to take care of their homes as much as owners do. This is why I wish the Condo market is up, then we would see a lot more Condo developments that in most cases end up looking a lot nicer vs apartments.

As for my neighborhood, parts of it are being torn down to make way for the Fairbourne Station development. For years the city of West Valley have been buying up homes, businesses and land. I'm ok with that since this will really improvo the area.
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  #3098  
Old Posted Apr 8, 2013, 6:47 AM
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Sadly we kind of get that a lot with apartments. Renters don't tend to take care of their homes as much as owners do. This is why I wish the Condo market is up, then we would see a lot more Condo developments that in most cases end up looking a lot nicer vs apartments.

As for my neighborhood, parts of it are being torn down to make way for the Fairbourne Station develop. I'm ok with that since this will really improvo the area.
You're okay with it because it's not your house. Easy to say 'demolish it!' when it's not your home. There is nothing about these apartments that warrant being demolished. If this was in any other area of the city, we'd be appalled - but because it's the poor west side, no one cares. They don't care because it's blight! Except it isn't. These homes look no different than a lot of the older homes you see in Central City and SugarHouse.

But what's worse, we're probably not even talking about a decent development here. We're most likely going to get another crappy, tacky stucco apartment complex that, in five years, is rundown.

You know, it's interesting - you guys have no problem tearing down homes people probably own, homes that have decent yards and are kept up fairly well (probably middle income residents live there - maybe the elderly) and you're fine replacing 'em with apartments that aren't very upscale, will most likely be cheap (unfortunately, it happens with affordable units and special needs) and those units bring in the type of undesirable folk we lament here on the board - and that truly makes a neighborhood run down. We already know Citifront and Bridges have gone down hill since their development - now we're going to add another apartment complex that will take out decent housing and replace it with a development that has the potential of being just as seedy as Citifront.

And that doesn't concern anyone? We're not creating a multi-class neighborhood here. Demolishing homes and opening up apartments that are on the cheap will not improve this neighborhood. But housing does. You said it yourself, people who own housing generally invest more into it than renters. That's why this stretch isn't that bad compared to swaths of the city where it's entirely rental property. Then, ten years from now, we'll bemoan the fact this area has declined so quickly and without a hint of irony.

Now I'm not opposed to affordable or mixed-income developments. I've said in the past I support such movements - but I also support it in a smart, responsible way. If they really want to develop this, go find vacant land where respectable housing isn't located and do it there. But don't demolish homes that have some value to the area for something that, in ten years, won't have any value.

Honest, does anyone really think Citifront was a good project for the city? It brought housing ... but did it improve that area? I don't think so. So, why keep doing what is wrong instead of investing in what is right? These homes might not be the final solution in this neighborhood - but right now they're a helluva lot better than cheap, low income housing that won't bring anything to the neighborhood.

I'm sorry, but I don't see the need to tear these homes down. Not for cheap rental units.
     
     
  #3099  
Old Posted Apr 8, 2013, 7:28 AM
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I'm with Comrade, there are so many empty lots in that area, why not build on one of those. Those existing homes are adorable.
     
     
  #3100  
Old Posted Apr 8, 2013, 7:38 AM
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I'm with Comrade, there are so many empty lots in that area, why not build on one of those. Those existing homes are adorable.
They're very Americana, aren't they? I said quaint, but adorable works too. I would be fine with demolishing these houses if they were really rundown - but if we consider these homes rundown, our perception of what is and isn't needs to be recalibrated.
     
     
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