Hwy 99 Fraser River Tunnel (George Massey Replacement) | Proposed

[Stingray2004]

Originally Posted by Spork

I believe that it would be prudent to get agreement from the CoV to expand the Oak Street bridge with an additional lane in each direction (or two?) before embarking on an expansion at the GMT.

As I previously stated above, the final project scope down the road will likely also include either widening the OSB (economically feasible?) or an OSB replacement as well. That's included in the GVGC report from 2003.

http://www.gvgc.org/pdf/MCTS_EconImpAnalys_appendR.pdf

BTW, BC MoTI has complete RoW jurisdiction up to Oak Street and West 72nd Ave. No agreement with the CoV is required.

[Spork]

Originally Posted by Stingray2004

As I previously stated above, the final project scope down the road will likely also include either widening the OSB (economically feasible?) or an OSB replacement as well. That's included in the GVGC report from 2003.

http://www.gvgc.org/pdf/MCTS_EconImpAnalys_appendR.pdf

BTW, BC MoTI has complete RoW jurisdiction up to Oak Street and West 72nd Ave. No agreement with the CoV is required.

Does the jurisdiction include all connections to the street grid as well, strictly the straight on RoW?

[tybuilding]

I liked this post. Why not have scenario 1 with expanded transit or a transit and active transportation only expansion? Even this will give the existing traffic more space as transit would use the expansion.

http://pricetags.wordpress.com/2013/03/2...rnment-what-he-thinks-and-so-should-you/

It seems that it is time to push the transit and active transportation agenda again.

Maybe the message should be that the billions the government will spend into putting more road lanes across the South Arm of the Fraser should go into transit and light rail transit in Delta, Richmond, into Surrey, to Tsawwassen ferry terminal, and to the US border first. Then the potential for mode conversion to transit will be understood before road expansion capacity is considered.

Maybe the scenario that should be pursued is a modified MOTI’s Scenario 1 – Maintain Existing Tunnel (which includes improved earthquake protection) plus transit investment.

There are options for bus service expansion. Additional transit scenarios that may eliminate need for additional lanes and are worthy to investigate include light rail solutions including LRT, extending the Canada Line, and fast commuter trains to the border.

[Metro-One]

Extending the Canada line would be a waste of money, so much farmland it would have to travel through.

A good transit alternative will still include more lanes, for example HOV / Rapid Bus lanes. Also commercial traffic only lanes could be built.

In the end, I think a CD system akin to the Port Mann with a rapid bus system would be the best solution (and have such rapid bus lanes able to be converted to LRT in the future).

[makr3trkr]

http://www.southdeltaleader.com/news/199626541.html



The George Massey Tunnel is gridlocked for the third time this week as drivers eager to get home in the sunny weather have caused numerous fender benders.

A four car accident northbound in the only counterflow lane at 4 p.m. soon led to a six-car pileup as emergency crews try to scramble around the chaos.

[makr3trkr]

http://www.cknw.com/news/vancouver/story.aspx/story.aspx?ID=1919900

B.C. Trucking Association fed up with Massey Tunnel congestion
Richmond/CKNW (AM980)
3/24/2013

Following a rough week at the George Massey Tunnel in which it was closed three times, including twice on Friday, the B.C. Trucking Association is calling for the installation of a bridge, "it may just be a bit of an inconvenience on one day, but if you add up all of the total costs of congestion, it's a significant amount and its an amount that needs to be absorbed by customers eventually, so it costs all of us."

President Louise Yako says the Trucking Association has been involved in consolation talks regarding the future of the tunnel.

If a bridge is built, Yako says the tunnel should close permanently rather than co-exist with a bridge, as she says it would slow traffic.

[tybuilding]

Originally Posted by Metro-One

Extending the Canada line would be a waste of money, so much farmland it would have to travel through.

A good transit alternative will still include more lanes, for example HOV / Rapid Bus lanes. Also commercial traffic only lanes could be built.

In the end, I think a CD system akin to the Port Mann with a rapid bus system would be the best solution (and have such rapid bus lanes able to be converted to LRT in the future).

So need a total of 9 lanes then? 5 new?

Here would be my proposal then for any expansion:

Keep 4 existing lanes for SOV, no countra flow
2 commercial / car pool only lanes
2 transit only lanes - with possible conversion to LRT with increased transit service paid by project instead of forcing Translink to fund it.

1 - Active transportation Multi-Use path:

separated, with connections to east and west on both sides of crossing. Active transportation pathway constructed along entire 99 corridor length, possibly using existing corridors such as Shell Road MUP and completed MUP in South Surrey. Improved connections along corridor. Connections to both sides of Oak Street Bridge, Connect to Van Horne Way and Canada Line Bridge

[makr3trkr]

Richmond opposes George Massey Tunnel plan

Richmond city council is urging the province to drop a proposal to replace the aging George Massey Tunnel with a new crossing that would cut through the municipality’s farmland.

The B.C. Ministry of Transportation released a report Monday outlining five scenarios for the future of the tunnel that connects Richmond and Delta.

But Richmond city council passed a motion later that evening opposing one plan calling for a new bridge to be built along No. 8 Road, an agricultural area in between the Massey tunnel and the Alex Fraser Bridge.

Mayor Malcolm Brodie said he’s still examining the four other proposals, including plans to build a bridge over the tunnel. But for now, his city will be writing the B.C. Ministry of Transportation to caution against a crossing at No. 8 Road due to negative impacts on farmland.

http://vancouver.24hrs.ca/2013/03/12/richmond-opposes-george-massey-tunnel-plan

[go_leafs_go02]

Originally Posted by makr3trkr

Richmond opposes George Massey Tunnel plan

Richmond city council is urging the province to drop a proposal to replace the aging George Massey Tunnel with a new crossing that would cut through the municipality’s farmland.

The B.C. Ministry of Transportation released a report Monday outlining five scenarios for the future of the tunnel that connects Richmond and Delta.

But Richmond city council passed a motion later that evening opposing one plan calling for a new bridge to be built along No. 8 Road, an agricultural area in between the Massey tunnel and the Alex Fraser Bridge.

Mayor Malcolm Brodie said he’s still examining the four other proposals, including plans to build a bridge over the tunnel. But for now, his city will be writing the B.C. Ministry of Transportation to caution against a crossing at No. 8 Road due to negative impacts on farmland.

http://vancouver.24hrs.ca/2013/03/12/richmond-opposes-george-massey-tunnel-plan

Misleading title.. man oh man. They're opposed to one of the options, one that I certainly don't care for either, but definitely support in some way the other 4 proposals.

[Metro-One]

Yeah, I thought the same thing, such a miss leading headline. Probably done on purpose.

[tybuilding]

Originally Posted by Metro-One

Yeah, I thought the same thing, such a miss leading headline. Probably done on purpose.

Well not quite. It looks pretty accurate to me:

Richmond Coun. Harold Steves said none of the five options are ideal for his city since it would cost a considerable amount and serve mostly the commercial traffic coming and going from the Deltaport terminal.

“If we decide the land should stay as agricultural land to feed ourselves,” he said, “then all we need is a (light-rail transit system) and that would serve the residential population.”

Isn't this old news? We discussed this earlier. It is from the 12th after all.

[makr3trkr]

Originally Posted by tybuilding

Well not quite. It looks pretty accurate to me:

Richmond Coun. Harold Steves said none of the five options are ideal for his city since it would cost a considerable amount and serve mostly the commercial traffic coming and going from the Deltaport terminal.

“If we decide the land should stay as agricultural land to feed ourselves,” he said, “then all we need is a (light-rail transit system) and that would serve the residential population.”

Isn't this old news? We discussed this earlier. It is from the 12th after all.

It is two weeks old but the fact that council passed a motion opposing an 8 road bridge (not just some lone councilor publicly opposing it) seemed noteworthy.

[The_Henry_Man]

Originally Posted by Metro-One

Extending the Canada line would be a waste of money, so much farmland it would have to travel through.

A good transit alternative will still include more lanes, for example HOV / Rapid Bus lanes. Also commercial traffic only lanes could be built.

In the end, I think a CD system akin to the Port Mann with a rapid bus system would be the best solution (and have such rapid bus lanes able to be converted to LRT in the future).

I definitely see 2 CD systems potentially applied in any Hwy 99 project: Hwy-17/Steveston Hwy through the new tunnel, and the one at Sea Island/Bridgeport interchange.

[officedweller]

Originally Posted by tybuilding

Richmond Coun. Harold Steves said none of the five options are ideal for his city since it would cost a considerable amount and serve mostly the commercial traffic coming and going from the Deltaport terminal.

But it's not all about [Richmond].

That's why you need regional and Provincial levels of government - to break through the self-centred attitudes of the municipal politicians (i.e. a natural perspective for the smallest governmental division).

[EastVanMark]

Originally Posted by makr3trkr

http://www.southdeltaleader.com/news/199626541.html



The George Massey Tunnel is gridlocked for the third time this week as drivers eager to get home in the sunny weather have caused numerous fender benders.

A four car accident northbound in the only counterflow lane at 4 p.m. soon led to a six-car pileup as emergency crews try to scramble around the chaos.

Where's the traffic?
Perhaps they should implement some traffic calming measures or reduce some of those lanes to "unicycles only" so people will "get the message" that they shouldn't drive their cars.

[EastVanMark]

Originally Posted by officedweller

But it's not all about [Richmond].

That's why you need regional and Provincial levels of government - to break through the self-centred attitudes of the municipal politicians (i.e. a natural perspective for the smallest governmental division).

You're absolutely right but unfortunately those in power at the local level are stuck in their own make-believe ideological world where they just ignore such problems as shown above to further their irrational agendas.

What's even worse is the blatant hypocrisy. Harold Steeve's family enriched themselves by selling off their farmland that was developed yet years later, all of a sudden he's become a champion for "protecting our food source." What a load of BS!

[huenthar]

Don't think anyone posted here, but they are consulting for Phase 2 of the study right now. Looking for general feedback on the project scope and feelings re. the five options:

http://engage.gov.bc.ca/masseytunnel/

Fill out an online feedback form before April 2! Share your thoughts on the project.

[Mininari]

Originally Posted by huenthar

Don't think anyone posted here, but they are consulting for Phase 2 of the study right now. Looking for general feedback on the project scope and feelings re. the five options:

http://engage.gov.bc.ca/masseytunnel/

Fill out an online feedback form before April 2! Share your thoughts on the project.

Seems that this process is moving fairly quickly. Too bad its going to end without any action when the NDP gets in. Despite them backing off on their initial opposition to this project, you can bet they're just watching what they say since the election is around the corner.

[The_Henry_Man]

Originally Posted by EastVanMark

You're absolutely right but unfortunately those in power at the local level are stuck in their own make-believe ideological world where they just ignore such problems as shown above to further their irrational agendas.

What's even worse is the blatant hypocrisy. Harold Steeve's family enriched themselves by selling off their farmland that was developed yet years later, all of a sudden he's become a champion for "protecting our food source." What a load of BS!

BTW, Harold Steves is the only council member of COR that's a NDPer. He's the Richmond version of Mayor Greggy. Speaks volumes. Thank goodness we haven't imported much of COV's radical hippy environmentalist agenda lunacy to my city.

[The_Henry_Man]

Originally Posted by Mininari

Seems that this process is moving fairly quickly. Too bad its going to end without any action when the NDP gets in. Despite them backing off on their initial opposition to this project, you can bet they're just watching what they say since the election is around the corner.

It's really hard to say. NDP hasn't refused any highway/freeway projects in the past. Don't forget the Hwy 19 highway project from Nanaimo to Campbell River back in the 1990s. It was built under their watch. But whether the freeway improvement projects are implemented at the right place, the right scope and not based on political lines that's a different story.