CFL in Ottawa: Ottawa RedBlacks - Page 6

Kitchissippi · #**101** Posted **Dec 14, 2012, 6:17 PM**

Team names without a distinctive plural don't sound right, especially if they end in a "sh" sound. Saying the possessive is also awkward, i.e. the "the Rush's defence".

KHOOLE · #**102** Posted **Dec 14, 2012, 7:40 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kitchissippi

Team names without a distinctive plural don't sound right, especially if they end in a "sh" sound. Saying the possessive is also awkward, i.e. the "the Rush's defence".

I concur.
Phonetically, it is a bad word. the plural and the possessive could cause awful tongue slips and you better not have a beer-induced slur.
More over, rushes are what you find in bogs and wetlands and allusions to such areas when things are slow on the field are to be expected.
Also, there could be another interpretation of rush-hour as in slow-moving traffic.
"rush" says absolutely nothing of Ottawa and is no one will be able to associate with it.
I believe that Raftsmen is the best we have and, as I said before, that name can appeal to the entire area, eastern Ontario and western Quebec.
And that's no bull-rush.

AuxTown · #**103** Posted **Dec 15, 2012, 4:12 AM**

What about Ottawa NIMBYs? We can have J Martin or Diane Holmes as our mascot!

But seriously too many potential issues with rush, let's put it to bed. Raftsmen is best so far.

kilroy · #**104** Posted **Dec 16, 2012, 6:37 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by matty14

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Lions_%28peaks%29

Specifically:

The Toronto Argonauts are named after a local rowing club from the late 19th century. The Alouettes are named after a popular French-Canadian children's song. The Stampeders are named after a local... well, stampede.

I'm finding this hard to believe.

Please, since you're SO experienced and SO professional, what are some team names YOU think would work? Or are you just here to puff your chest out and tell us how wrong we all are?

Great, three examples. Well, count me completely defeated. I'll NEVER question your superiority EVER again. Reductio ad absurdum. A TINY portion does not discount my point, and you know it.

What I think will work are ENTIRELY irrelevant.

OSEG's fascination with Ottawa Rush proves exactly what I was talking about. I.E. It's an name that has NOTHING to do with the history of the city, has some natural marketing potential and matches the football history this city has cultivated. And, no, I don't like it either. It's just too... I dunno. Strange?

kilroy · #**105** Posted **Dec 16, 2012, 6:39 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acajack

OK, how about the Ottawa Bievers, then? And if you pronounce the V the Spanish way, it sort of sounds like a B! Even more cool, awesome, panache-y!

That's never been and never will be cool, and you know it.

eemy · #**106** Posted **Dec 16, 2012, 1:26 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by kilroy

Great, three examples. Well, count me completely defeated. I'll NEVER question your superiority EVER again. Reductio ad absurdum. A TINY portion does not discount my point, and you know it.

CFL Teams with local and/or historic links in their name:
Vancouver Lions
Calgary Stampeders
Saskatchewan Roughriders
Toronto Argonauts
Montreal Alouettes

5/8 (a tiny portion apparently)

NHL Teams with local and/or historic links in their name:
New York Islanders
New York Rangers
New Jersey Devils
Toronto Maple Leafs
Montreal Canadiens
Ottawa Senators
Winnipeg Jets
Florida Panthers
Carolina Hurricanes
Washington Capitals
Tampa Bay Lightning
Chicago Blackhawks
Colorado Avalanche
Dallas Stars (sort of)
Edmonton Oilers
Phoenix Coyotes
San Jose Sharks

17/30 (a tiny portion)

Just because you don't know the history behind a name, doesn't mean there isn't one.

KHOOLE · #**107** Posted **Dec 16, 2012, 6:40 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeremy_haak

CFL Teams with local and/or historic links in their name:
Vancouver Lions
Calgary Stampeders
Saskatchewan Roughriders
Toronto Argonauts
Montreal Alouettes

5/8 (a tiny portion apparently)

NHL Teams with local and/or historic links in their name:
New York Islanders
New York Rangers
New Jersey Devils
Toronto Maple Leafs
Montreal Canadiens
Ottawa Senators
Winnipeg Jets
Florida Panthers
Carolina Hurricanes
Washington Capitals
Tampa Bay Lightning
Chicago Blackhawks
Colorado Avalanche
Dallas Stars (sort of)
Edmonton Oilers
Phoenix Coyotes
San Jose Sharks

17/30 (a tiny portion)

Just because you don't know the history behind a name, doesn't mean there isn't one.

and the Rough Riders (Roughriders in Saskatchewan) probably have the most history.
"rough riders" are horse riders who could ride in the "rough" or, as we would say, through the bushes and all kinds of terrains in the woods. They were a sort of cowboy that were prevalent in the western parts of North America when provinces like Manitoba and Saskatchewan and states like Montana and the Dakotas did not exist.
U.S.President Theodore Roosevelt hired a whole bunch of them to help him invade Cuba and expel the Spaniards from that country. There was a Battle of San Juan Hill in 1898 in which the "Rough Riders" mercenaries were involved
and that's very likely how the Ottawa football team got its name.

Note also the spelling of the Montreal Canadiens. At the time of Upper and Lower Canada, and possibly before that, residents were known by their ethnic origins : English, Scottish, Irish, Welsh and Americans. The french-speaking dwellers were not known as Quebecers but as "Canadiens" (in the eastern provinces, they were Acadiens). Their other name "Habitant" (the H on their jerseys) is a quasi-derogatory term for a rural resident in popular language.

McC · #**108** Posted **Dec 16, 2012, 10:38 PM**

No, the "H" is for "hockey" because they are "Le Club d'Hockey Canadiens," earlier in their history the H was an A because they were an athletic club; the logo was otherwise basically the same.

KHOOLE · #**109** Posted **Dec 16, 2012, 11:16 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by McC

No, the "H" is for "hockey" because they are "Le Club Hockey Canadiens," earlier in their history the H was an A because they were an athletic club; the logo was otherwise basically the same.

OK I stand corrected.

But, why are they called the "Habs" in a short form?

KHOOLE · #**110** Posted **Dec 16, 2012, 11:28 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by KHOOLE

OK I stand corrected.

But, why are they called the "Habs" in a short form?

In the same vein, why the Vancouver "Lions"?

I've seen sea lions while sea kayaking in the Queen Charlotte Islands.
Are there sea lions off the coast on BC in the Vancouver area?

Or does their name refer to something else?

artvandelay · #**111** Posted **Dec 17, 2012, 12:10 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by KHOOLE

In the same vein, why the Vancouver "Lions"?

I've seen sea lions while sea kayaking in the Queen Charlotte Islands.
Are there sea lions off the coast on BC in the Vancouver area?

Or does their name refer to something else?

Named after 'the Lions' peaks, the logo is a mountain lion which is common in BC.

Acajack · #**112** Posted **Dec 17, 2012, 1:28 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by KHOOLE

OK I stand corrected.

But, why are they called the "Habs" in a short form?

Hab is short for Habitant. But the H on the jersey really does stand for hockey. And there are actually two Cs if you look closely, for the three words: Club de Hockey Canadien.

KHOOLE · #**113** Posted **Dec 17, 2012, 3:31 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acajack

Hab is short for Habitant. But the H on the jersey really does stand for hockey. And there are actually two Cs if you look closely, for the three words: Club de Hockey Canadien.

Got it! Thanks.

phil235 · #**114** Posted **Dec 17, 2012, 5:41 PM**

What about the Ottawa "Rogues"? It's got the coveted "R", and certainly speaks to a long Ottawa tradition.

Ça se dit aussi en français, même si ça n'a pas le même sens qu'en anglais.

McC · #**115** Posted **Dec 17, 2012, 5:46 PM**

might run into trouble with the Olympic Movement's out of control copyright brownshirts for being a homonym of their Dear Leader's name.

phil235 · #**116** Posted **Dec 17, 2012, 6:26 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by McC

might run into trouble with the Olympic Movement's out of control copyright brownshirts for being a homonym of their Dear Leader's name.

Any press is good press.

McC · #**117** Posted **Dec 17, 2012, 6:36 PM**

;-)

VANRIDERFAN · #**118** Posted **Dec 19, 2012, 12:15 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by KHOOLE

and the Rough Riders (Roughriders in Saskatchewan) probably have the most history.
"rough riders" are horse riders who could ride in the "rough" or, as we would say, through the bushes and all kinds of terrains in the woods. They were a sort of cowboy that were prevalent in the western parts of North America when provinces like Manitoba and Saskatchewan and states like Montana and the Dakotas did not exist.
U.S.President Theodore Roosevelt hired a whole bunch of them to help him invade Cuba and expel the Spaniards from that country. There was a Battle of San Juan Hill in 1898 in which the "Rough Riders" mercenaries were involved
and that's very likely how the Ottawa football team got its name.

You are so out to lunch. The Saskatchewan Roughriders and Ottawa Rough Riders have no connection to Teddy Roosevelt.

This is closer to the truth. (Once again Canadians have to get their history from real books and not from Hollywood!

)

Saskatchewan Roughriders:
The NWMP (North West Mounted Police) members who broke horses at Fort Walsh (at the foot of the Cypress Hills);
Western Canadian Mounties and cowboys never fought with Teddy Roosevelt in the Spanish American War because....;
around the same time Lord Strathcona (Donald Smith) raised a Calvary regiment from Western Canadian Mounties, Frontiersmen and Cowboys to fight in the Boer War in South Africa around 1900. They were a rough and tumble group who could ride as hard as the Boers they fought. This regiment remains today in the Canadian Army's order of battle.
http://www.strathconas.ca/regimental-history

Ottawa Rough Riders - Eventhough their old second logo showed a cowboy riding a bucking bronco, the truer rep would be the rivermen who rode the logs during the spring breakup.

Acajack · #**119** Posted **Dec 19, 2012, 3:01 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by VANRIDERFAN

You are so out to lunch. The Saskatchewan Roughriders and Ottawa Rough Riders have no connection to Teddy Roosevelt.

This is closer to the truth. (Once again Canadians have to get their history from real books and not from Hollywood!

)

Saskatchewan Roughriders:
The NWMP (North West Mounted Police) members who broke horses at Fort Walsh (at the foot of the Cypress Hills);
Western Canadian Mounties and cowboys never fought with Teddy Roosevelt in the Spanish American War because....;
around the same time Lord Strathcona (Donald Smith) raised a Calvary regiment from Western Canadian Mounties, Frontiersmen and Cowboys to fight in the Boer War in South Africa around 1900. They were a rough and tumble group who could ride as hard as the Boers they fought. This regiment remains today in the Canadian Army's order of battle.
http://www.strathconas.ca/regimental-history

Ottawa Rough Riders - Eventhough their old second logo showed a cowboy riding a bucking bronco, the truer rep would be the rivermen who rode the logs during the spring breakup.

The local link for Ottawa and Rough Riders is not a bad one, but I am pretty sure they were named that way because someone in Ottawa heard of the exploits of Teddy and his gang and thought it was a cool name.

The Ottawa Rough Riders were founded with that name something like two or three years after Teddy Roosevelt and the Rough Riders became famous.

kilroy · #**120** Posted **Dec 19, 2012, 11:26 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acajack

The local link for Ottawa and Rough Riders is not a bad one, but I am pretty sure they were named that way because someone in Ottawa heard of the exploits of Teddy and his gang and thought it was a cool name.

The Ottawa Rough Riders were founded with that name something like two or three years after Teddy Roosevelt and the Rough Riders became famous.

It seems the origin is a bit more... muddy.

Prior to the name change to Rough Riders they were simply the Ottawa Football Club and adopted the Rough Riders moniker on September 9th 1897, which lines up neatly with Roosevelt's exploits in the Spanish-American War. It should be noted that Roosevelt's regiment disbanded about 6 days later and that the unit was extremely popular and regularly featured in media sources of the time.

It seems no one knows for certain (the original documents for the name changes were lost for both teams) why BOTH Ottawa and Saskatchewan adopted Rough Riders as their name, but in Ottawa's case, there is simply no evidence of any connection with logging history or any local history prompting the name change. Heck, they even briefly adopted the name Ottawa Senators in the mid-twenties and won two Grey Cups with that name.

For Saskatchewan, it's seems plausible and quite likely that the name is connected with the Northwest Mounted Police, but there's no concrete evidence to support this.

CBC's A Not-So-Brief History of Ottawa Football web page has this to say on the origin of the Ottawa Rough Riders name (although without any proof):

"The Ottawa Football Club is renamed the Ottawa Rough Riders and adopts red and black uniforms to honour the Canadian Regiment fighting in the Spanish-American War."

However, there's a major problem with this, namely that there was no Canadian Regiment in the Spanish-American War.

As far as I can tell, there's zero evidence (besides anecdotal) of any connection of the Ottawa Rough Riders with Ottawa's logging history. Heck, I can't even find any concrete evidence that term Rough Riders was ever used as a name for log drivers at all. I can only find mentions by modern sports fans on forums referring to the Ottawa CFL franchises, past and future.

The best anyone can say for certain is that the origin of the Ottawa Rough Riders name has been lost to history.