[St. John's] The Official Project Thread - Page 265

SignalHillHiker · #**5281** Posted **Nov 9, 2012, 1:20 PM**

November 9, 2012

351 Water Street from Pleasant Street by Signal Hill Hiker Photos, on Flickr

TD Place from Duckworth Street by Signal Hill Hiker Photos, on Flickr

TD Place by Signal Hill Hiker Photos, on Flickr

351 Water Street from Barters Hill by Signal Hill Hiker Photos, on Flickr

kwajo · #**5282** Posted **Nov 9, 2012, 1:31 PM**

Great photos once again SignalHillHiker! I'm loving the increased activity in the St. John's thread these days, keep it up everyone (as a former Townie, I appreciate the updates)!

statbass · #**5283** Posted **Nov 9, 2012, 1:38 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by christopher_chafe

You are right, but what you will see in those places is a higher rate of people working with decent wages, due to the fact that those cities have a wider variety of industries in their city.

It baffles me to comprehend how people value tourists more than they value their own people.

If you take out the minimum wage jobs here in St. John's you will find that our unemployment rate is not so good after all.

Actually, I believe St. John's has one of the highest proportion of scientists and engineers for cities under 1,000,000 in North America (just do a quick google search).

This is a very contentious issue, I agree that we can't live in the past just for tourists sake, but on the other hand the city's uniqueness is a huge selling point. There needs to be a healthy balance and I don't think it has been met yet. I think we're still a little heavy on the tourist side, but we're getting there!

SignalHillHiker · #**5284** Posted **Nov 9, 2012, 1:42 PM**

I agree that our city can't be designed solely for tourists and I even agree we've done a little too much of that - but this issue, and heritage preservation, are completely unrelated to me.

I want St. John's preserved for me. Everything I missed when I was away, everything that pulled at my heart and made me want to come home, was a part of our heritage. I certainly wasn't missing the Marriott on Duckworth, although I have no complaints about the building. I wasn't missing Cabot Place or TD Place or any of that.

I was missing Water Street, Prescott Street, Gower Street... all of our heritage. That's what makes St. John's the city it is.

I think we've done too much for tourists - we're building too many hotels and not enough condos downtown, for example - but I don't think we're preserving our heritage for tourists. That's for us.

davelane · #**5285** Posted **Nov 9, 2012, 2:55 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by christopher_chafe

It baffles me to comprehend how people value tourists more than they value their own people.

It's not just tourists that a unique cityscape attracts. Many, many skilled people who move here to work have said to me that they were drawn to the place because it's like no other place they've lived.

I think the reason we focus so much on tourists' impressions is because they offer an "outsider's view" that tells us we've got something good. (And they contribute to the economy in a measurable way.)

But there are so many aspects to how our downtown is designed and built that offer major benefits to our community and economy that we can't ignore. People fear tall buildings because they are generally not designed with their surroundings in mind. And it's the entirety of the downtown that encourages networking, shopping, business, play -- all the ingredients of an overall bustling city.

So I agree: we can't get lost in "height is bad" or "our tourists love the old buildings because they're old." Let's start asking more nuanced questions and rewarding creative solutions.

PoscStudent · #**5286** Posted **Nov 9, 2012, 5:10 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by christopher_chafe

You are right, but what you will see in those places is a higher rate of people working with decent wages, due to the fact that those cities have a wider variety of industries in their city.

It baffles me to comprehend how people value tourists more than they value their own people.

If you take out the minimum wage jobs here in St. John's you will find that our unemployment rate is not so good after all.

Wages in St. John's are some of the highest in the country, above Toronto and Vancouver.

niccanning · #**5287** Posted **Nov 9, 2012, 5:40 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by christopher_chafe

It baffles me to comprehend how people value tourists more than they value their own people.

I think this is valid. Residents often turn up their nose to new developments because of the consequence the development will have on tourists. Residents in Quidi Vidi for example, who opposed the condo development or those opposed to the housing development on Signal Hill and almost any proposal downtown. I am sure in cases “tourists” are used as an excuse to mask any individual dislike for a proposed development, but the excuse is used regardless.

SignalHillHiker · #**5288** Posted **Nov 9, 2012, 7:35 PM**

From the City of St. John's on Facebook:

Elizabeth Avenue has reopened to vehicular traffic. The City would like to thank residents for their patience.

Townie709 · #**5289** Posted **Nov 9, 2012, 9:11 PM**

Yay! A job that was supposed to be finished in late August/ early September is finally being finished in mid novermber! Honestly, the pace of these kind of projects astound me.

SignalHillHiker · #**5290** Posted **Nov 9, 2012, 9:13 PM**

Let's just tell ourselves every delay is because there just aren't enough labourers to work on all of our countless big projects.

Townie709 · #**5291** Posted **Nov 9, 2012, 9:22 PM**

Sure, works for me

Architype · #**5292** Posted **Nov 9, 2012, 10:31 PM**

First, great photos again Signal; I especially like the view from Pleasant Street.

In reference to many of the subjects discussed here in the past few days, I agree that preservation of heritage is important both for tourists and citizens alike. There are always choices to be made, and I think that the consensus of forumers here (mostly) is correct in that the division of heritage areas where no larger scale development is allowed and defined as separate from areas where both heritage and new/modern and higher density development is encouraged is the correct choice.

That being said, the fact that only six people showed up at the recent public meeting to protest the Marriott Hotel can be interpreted as not much interest or opposition to this project rather than the opposite. It is actually questionable whether that particular proposal is the best solution for that site, but it's consequences are not that great, being a relatively small development. I think that public meetings where six people show up is not enough to create public awareness, something needs to be shown online as well for greater community involvement and feedback.

On a related subject, more important than attracting tourists alone, St. John's needs to attract immigrants like the rest of North America in order to stay competitive and maintain it's population in the future. Then other aspects of development, such as modern housing and convenient urban areas become more important than heritage. Immigrants to North America do not come to appreciate the heritage, but for jobs, communities and a better life in a modern country.

Marty_Mcfly · #**5293** Posted **Nov 10, 2012, 11:58 AM**

Well guys, the sad news has finally become official. I'm moving out of St. John's at the end of the month for Charlottetown PEI. I'm going to miss this city and its exciting times, but I leave it up to Signal to make it feel like I never left town :p

SignalHillHiker · #**5294** Posted **Nov 10, 2012, 12:59 PM**

Well, first of all, CONGRATULATIONS on getting the job!

And enjoy Charlottetown. It's a very small but near perfectly beautiful city. And it's still a provincial capital and a relatively popular tourist town, so it offers far more than its population would suggest.

I have a cousin (and her husband, and two daughters) there. He's a doctor, she's a nurse. They love it. And they lived in New Zealand, Australia and a few other places before choosing Charlottetown to settle.

statbass · #**5295** Posted **Nov 10, 2012, 1:18 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marty_Mcfly

Well guys, the sad news has finally become official. I'm moving out of St. John's at the end of the month for Charlottetown PEI. I'm going to miss this city and its exciting times, but I leave it up to Signal to make it feel like I never left town :p

Congrats on the new job, Marty. Charlottetown is a great city, keep in touch on the forums!

SignalHillHiker · #**5296** Posted **Nov 10, 2012, 2:17 PM**

November 10, 2012

St. John's from Signal Hill by Signal Hill Hiker Photos, on Flickr

TD Place by Signal Hill Hiker Photos, on Flickr

Sunrise over the North Atlantic by Signal Hill Hiker Photos, on Flickr

Livingstone Street by Signal Hill Hiker Photos, on Flickr

Queen Street by Signal Hill Hiker Photos, on Flickr

Bally Haly Country Club by Signal Hill Hiker Photos, on Flickr

St. John's Mosque by Signal Hill Hiker Photos, on Flickr

Pleasantville by Signal Hill Hiker Photos, on Flickr

Sunrise in Torbay by Signal Hill Hiker Photos, on Flickr

MrChills · #**5297** Posted **Nov 10, 2012, 4:36 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeddy1989

casino will be impossible.. It's not a municipal issue its actually a provincial ban. and when they talked about this a coupel of years ago the province says it will not entertain the idea of a casino anywhere in the province

What a load of shit. So.. it's okay to have gambling readily available in every nook and cranny of every building that serves alcohol in the province, but having an actual higher class tourism draw through a Casino is not allowed.

I think we should ban the VLT's and have some Casinos in the larger centres in the province.

MrChills · #**5298** Posted **Nov 10, 2012, 4:40 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marty_Mcfly

It just saddens me that when given a chance to begin diversifying the economy of the city someone tries to shut it down. It's the reason why I'll most likely be moving away from St. John's within the next few months, the lack of opportunity during this "boom" is frightening.

I've always thought the same thing about the opportunity during the boom. I lived away from town for seven years in the US and moved back in 2007 (taking a salary cut in half to move back). I knew it would be hard, but thought it would be worth it to move home, and it would be much cheaper to live here, was I ever wrong. Living in St. John's nowadays is just as (or more) expensive than living in most large cities in Canada.

I love the city and province (it will always be home) but after three years back the last go around, I made a decision and left two years ago (making 3 times more money) and living in Edmonton is actually much cheaper than St. John's

SignalHillHiker · #**5299** Posted **Nov 10, 2012, 4:46 PM**

Two thoughts instantly came to my mind reading your post.

1. That is so sad. We're actually driving people who want to be here away.

2. We're worth the premium.

Mostly the first, though.

Townie709 · #**5300** Posted **Nov 10, 2012, 6:27 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marty_Mcfly

Well guys, the sad news has finally become official. I'm moving out of St. John's at the end of the month for Charlottetown PEI. I'm going to miss this city and its exciting times, but I leave it up to Signal to make it feel like I never left town :p

Congrats on getting the job! Be sure to stay in touch on the forums