Calgary Public Transit II

[andasen]

Originally Posted by DizzyEdge

Transit question: What other bus routes have similar intensity of service as the #3 (ie busses every 10 mins most of the day?

Ya the 3 reigns supreme in terms of frequency at all time. Runners up would be the 7, 20 and 301/300 (combined) with the 27 and 85 getting honourable mention. (27 doesn't run on Sundays or Saturday evening but has reletively great frequency otherwise while the 85 maintains 15 minutes frequencies during midday but doesn't get any thing extra during peak)

[armorand93]

Originally Posted by frinkprof

None.

I was lucky to get 30 in Calgary, nevermind 10!

[ByeByeBaby]

Calgary Transit runs only 3 routes with 15 minute or better service all day, all week. Two of them are the C-trains (201/202). The third? No, not the #3. The only bus-based Frequent Service route in the city is the 506, the Chinook Centre Shuttle. 15 minute service, 7 days a week.

[armorand93]

Too bad everything has to be loops with a majority of the bus system. Imagine how much better it'd be if there was direct A-to-B lines... I know suburbia makes this difficult, but a small bus loop isn't that hard to build or service.

[mellbell416]

Interesting that Centre St. is really the only area with such intense service apart from the LRTs - it makes me understand better why there is talk of accelerating the N -C LRT. I would argue, though, that the buses already do an awesome job of servicing this area whereas the SE is just a disaster at the moment.

I don't think that Centre St. Is the only street with strong bus service - there are others where I haven't had problems grabbing a bus in or out of town -it's just that it is a mix of bus numbers.

[frinkprof]

Originally Posted by ByeByeBaby

Calgary Transit runs only 3 routes with 15 minute or better service all day, all week. Two of them are the C-trains (201/202). The third? No, not the #3. The only bus-based Frequent Service route in the city is the 506, the Chinook Centre Shuttle. 15 minute service, 7 days a week.

Not sure if you legitimately count the 506. Not because the route is comically small in scale or anything like that, but the fact that Chinook Centre pays for the operating cost of it (or at least some of it).

[CTrainDude]

Originally Posted by frinkprof

Not sure if you legitimately count the 506. Not because the route is comically small in scale or anything like that, but the fact that Chinook Centre pays for the operating cost of it (or at least some of it).

I wonder what happens to the 506 when Chinook station closes in January.....will they move it to Heritage, or will it still run to a station with no LRT service...?

[Bassic Lab]

Originally Posted by mellbell416

Interesting that Centre St. is really the only area with such intense service apart from the LRTs - it makes me understand better why there is talk of accelerating the N -C LRT. I would argue, though, that the buses already do an awesome job of servicing this area whereas the SE is just a disaster at the moment.

I don't think that Centre St. Is the only street with strong bus service - there are others where I haven't had problems grabbing a bus in or out of town -it's just that it is a mix of bus numbers.

There is a legitimate danger that either the Centre Street Bridge or the downtown street network will become overburdened by North Central busses prior to the planned construction of the NC LRT. I previously worked out how many busses cross the Centre Street Bridge into downtown during the peak hour and it is approaching the maximum level that the city estimated could be handled.

Beyond the #3(~16), #301 (~12), and #300 (~2), there is also the #2 (~10), #62 (~5), #64 (~10), #109 (~5), #116 (~8), and #142 (~5). So roughly 73 busses use the Centre Street Bridge to access downtown Calgary between ~7:00 AM and ~8:00 AM.

I think a strong case could be made that if the SE LRT precedes the NC LRT, then the SE LRT should immediately terminate at 16 Ave N instead of Eau Claire. That would at least allow some flexibility should the Centre Street Bridge become seriously overburdened.

edit: I forgot the #17 with 2 busses. So it's 75 busses.

[DizzyEdge]

Originally Posted by Bassic Lab

There is a legitimate danger that either the Centre Street Bridge or the downtown street network will become overburdened by North Central busses prior to the planned construction of the NC LRT. I previously worked out how many busses cross the Centre Street Bridge into downtown during the peak hour and it is approaching the maximum level that the city estimated could be handled.

Beyond the #3(~16), #301 (~12), and #300 (~2), there is also the #2 (~10), #62 (~5), #64 (~10), #109 (~5), #116 (~8), and #142 (~5). So roughly 73 busses use the Centre Street Bridge to access downtown Calgary between ~7:00 AM and ~8:00 AM.

I think a strong case could be made that if the SE LRT precedes the NC LRT, then the SE LRT should immediately terminate at 16 Ave N instead of Eau Claire. That would at least allow some flexibility should the Centre Street Bridge become seriously overburdened.

edit: I forgot the #17 with 2 busses. So it's 75 busses.

Also keep in mind that construction of a NCLRT might cause lane closures which would quickly take "almost at capacity" to over capacity

[Bassic Lab]

Originally Posted by DizzyEdge

Also keep in mind that construction of a NCLRT might cause lane closures which would quickly take "almost at capacity" to over capacity

I can't imagine there not being a painful phase to the construction but if Centre Street south of 12 Ave N isn't touched then it should be manageable. North of 12 Ave there are enough parallel routes that busses should be fine. It is the bridge that forms the real bottleneck for NC busses. I have no idea how we would cope if it were to be shut down for an extended period again.

[mellbell416]

Wow I never realized that so many buses crossed Centre St. Bridge during rush hour... That is actually a good idea to take the SE LRT up to 16th Ave N - I could never really understand the attraction of the Eau Claire start station, unless your prime focus was on the hotel stayers and the millionaires who live in the nearby condos...has this idea been floated with the council?

If they make Centre St. into a Transitway (which should be coming fairly soon?), wouldn't that ease the congestion?

[mellbell416]

Two more seconds to think about it - it really would make sense to have a single line that runs from far North Central to deep SE. Wouldn't that be kind of brilliant? It would be viable as a transit line even when only a few stations are built on either side of DT...

[Bassic Lab]

Originally Posted by mellbell416

Wow I never realized that so many buses crossed Centre St. Bridge during rush hour... That is actually a good idea to take the SE LRT up to 16th Ave N - I could never really understand the attraction of the Eau Claire start station, unless your prime focus was on the hotel stayers and the millionaires who live in the nearby condos...has this idea been floated with the council?

If they make Centre St. into a Transitway (which should be coming fairly soon?), wouldn't that ease the congestion?

There is no existing plan to develop a Transitway along Centre Street. I'm not sure if it would really help much. The HOV lane reversal on the bridge can be altered over time as demands necessitate it, from an HOV-2 lane (with two occupants qualifying a vehicle to use it) to an HOV-3 lane to a transit only lane. Better enforcement could also reduce the vehicles using the lane that shouldn't be. Those changes should be sufficient to keep it running.

As for the section north of 16 Ave, the capacity constraint simply isn't there. There are plenty of parallel routes to spread the load around. The next real constraint, after the bridge, is the downtown road network itself. It can also only handle so many busses during the peak.

[DizzyEdge]

Originally Posted by Bassic Lab

There is a legitimate danger that either the Centre Street Bridge or the downtown street network will become overburdened by North Central busses prior to the planned construction of the NC LRT. I previously worked out how many busses cross the Centre Street Bridge into downtown during the peak hour and it is approaching the maximum level that the city estimated could be handled.

Beyond the #3(~16), #301 (~12), and #300 (~2), there is also the #2 (~10), #62 (~5), #64 (~10), #109 (~5), #116 (~8), and #142 (~5). So roughly 73 busses use the Centre Street Bridge to access downtown Calgary between ~7:00 AM and ~8:00 AM.

I think a strong case could be made that if the SE LRT precedes the NC LRT, then the SE LRT should immediately terminate at 16 Ave N instead of Eau Claire. That would at least allow some flexibility should the Centre Street Bridge become seriously overburdened.

edit: I forgot the #17 with 2 busses. So it's 75 busses.

I guessing that also doesn't count extra busses when some routes leapfrog each other due to high demand. Can anyone chime in why the SELRT would end at Eau Claire rather than just continue on as the NCLRT? I suppose with the nose creek alignment joining the two was problematic?

[lubicon]

Going from the NW to Quarry Park is a disaster regardless of whether you take transit or drive yourself. Speaking from experience (our company recently relocated from DT to Glenmore/Blackfoot).....

we lost several people who lived in the NW as they simply could not deal with the commute. Transit was anywhere from 75-90 minutes in the morning (ie when you could time your trip) to 90+ minutes in the PM when you could not. In other words it's not very practical at all and I don't think anyone in our office uses transit from the NW anymore. Driving sucks as well. For me (Tuscany) the mornings are not too bad as I can come in early. It's about 35 minutes in the AM. Afternoons are an absolute cluster f>ck. Normal is 45-50 minutes and often times over an hour to make it home. Last week it was 90 minutes due to an accident on Glenmore.

Methinks IOL is going to lose a lot of employees who live in the NW.

[armorand93]

I've been with my dad commuting from Scenic Acres to the Beltline. He leaves early, but the PM gets messy... 30 minute drive, usually

[Rusty van Reddick]

Originally Posted by armorand93

I've been with my dad commuting from Scenic Acres to the Beltline. He leaves early, but the PM gets messy... 30 minute drive, usually

What sort of masochist lives in Scenic Acres? Regardless- drop him off at Crowfoot Station and have him walk to his office or wherever he works.

[MonctonGoldenFlames]

i admit, i'm not on top of this stuff nearly as much as some people here, but why does the selrt and nclrt always get discussed as 2 distinct projects? why can't they be 1?

what if both were built concurrently. lynwood station would be the south terminus, and continuing thru downtown and north up centre street to about mcknight. this would help service both sides of the debate (north vs south) and as money becomes available, extensions could be built at either end, in similar fashion to the extensions to the ne and nw lines.

i know the 8 ave subway is a lynchpin no matter what to both lines, but am i out to lunch or is this at all a feasible option? has it been discussed much before?

[Doug]

Originally Posted by MonctonGoldenFlames

i admit, i'm not on top of this stuff nearly as much as some people here, but why does the selrt and nclrt always get discussed as 2 distinct projects? why can't they be 1?

what if both were built concurrently. lynwood station would be the south terminus, and continuing thru downtown and north up centre street to about mcknight. this would help service both sides of the debate (north vs south) and as money becomes available, extensions could be built at either end, in similar fashion to the extensions to the ne and nw lines.

i know the 8 ave subway is a lynchpin no matter what to both lines, but am i out to lunch or is this at all a feasible option? has it been discussed much before?

Got a spare $6B kicking around?

[MonctonGoldenFlames]

Originally Posted by Doug

Got a spare $6B kicking around?

just gimme a second to go check the couch.....

i know it's not cheap, but i think building out from downtown slowly in 2 directions is better than further out in 1 direction. since the 8 ave subway is required for either of the 2 lines, it's cost is a moot point isn't it?