Calgary Public Transit II

[fusili]

Check out the TransitCamp Network plan and how it compares to the Route Ahead plan:

http://transitcamp.ca/2012/10/04/the-transitcamp-network-plan/

[UofC.engineer]

LRT Functional plan from Saddletown'e' to Stoney Trail

http://agendaminutes.calgary.ca/sirepub/...yamlzuq20u45/12921510052012080818423.PDF

[mersar]

Originally Posted by UofC.engineer

LRT Functional plan from Saddletown'e' to Stoney Trail

http://agendaminutes.calgary.ca/sirepub/...yamlzuq20u45/12921510052012080818423.PDF

Cool. Some notes:

• At grade station at 88th Ave (including possible airport linkage) and 500 park n ride
• Below grade station at Country Hills Blvd at 60th (underneath the roadway, similar to 69th Street)
• At grade station on 128th in Redstone with 200 park n ride stalls
• Final station roughly where Barlow Crescent NE is west of 32nd Street in Stonegate, to be called Stoney Station with 100 park n ride stalls (will mostly be a destination rather than origin station)
• Eventually the next phase would cross Stoney Trail if its ever needed

All these stations except the last one would be side load, Stoney would be centre loading as its terminus. Country Hills may also be centre loading if the extension is phased and its terminus for a while.

Travel time would be roughly 13 minutes from Stoney to Saddletown

Ridership estimates are lower than most of the existing stations, but considering little of that area is built out by the time the line is built and the residential is built that may change.

Also included is a study of options for linking the NE LRT to the airport. Recommendation is start with buses and see how that works, but they evaluated possible options of both a spur and people mover from 88th Ave station.

And the estimated cost if it were to be built today? A cool $355 million ($46M of that is contingency)

[Aegis]

When would the NE LRT extension be built? I couldn't find a recommended date in the report.

[You Need A Thneed]

Also, the line is proposed to go over Airport Trail, under Country Hills Blvd, under 128th Ave, and over Metis Trail. No level crossings with major roads, although I suppose 88th ave might be called a major road, as it will be 4 lanes with a median.

The Country Hills Blvd station is right in the heart of the future town centre, zoned to have 20+ story buildings. I wonder if the city might want to make that station a subway, completely underground, rather than trenched like 69th Street.

[You Need A Thneed]

Originally Posted by Aegis

When would the NE LRT extension be built? I couldn't find a recommended date in the report.

The 128th Street station will be completely built around in ~5 years, the Stoney Station may be completely built around in 10 years, the CHB station will be built up on one side in 10 years, and the 88th Street station is built up 3/4 of the way around now, with no one having an idea when the other quarter will be built out.

Political will will be a big factor in when it gets built. I think you could make a case for it to be built around 10 years from now, but I suspect that its more in the 15-20 year timeframe.

Of course, if money limitations carry on as they do now, it could be longer than that. I don't think it's going to be built before a good portion of the SE and NC line is built.

[Aegis]

Originally Posted by You Need A Thneed

The 128th Street station will be completely built around in ~5 years

Are you sure? A timeline that short implies that funding already exists.

[You Need A Thneed]

Originally Posted by Aegis

Are you sure? A timeline that short implies that funding already exists.

Sorry, confusing wording on my part. The area around the future station will be built out in around five years. The area would be ready for a station in about 5 years, but it will take much longer than that for the LRT to get there, if for nothing else, the fact that the stations in between wont be ready for LRT until later.

[mellbell416]

With Imperial Oil moving to QUarry Park in a couple of years, I have been hunting for reasonable transit options from the NW, but nothing works unless you hook up with the 201 from DT, and it makes for a loooong commute when you combine that with another bus leg (an hour or more depending on distance from the core ) - ridiculous! I did some investigation into trying to get to QP from a local LRT and it was hilarious to see the results - all pathways headed north to DT and then back down the 201! If the city really is serious about setting up these suburban cores, this is a huge black eye on transit planning...

Really, the best thing to do is to have a quick connection from a nearby LRT station and IOl has talked about setting up bus shuttles either on their own or in conjunction with the city. Of course, this would only work if they were frequent- I would say that it would have to be one every 10 minutes or it would be useless. They have talked about connecting to a 'hub' (I interpret that to mean an LRT station, but maybe I am wrong) in NW W, or SW. My guess is that the best LRT to connect to would be Chinook since it is so close to Glenmore.

Does anyone else have different thoughts on this? How long would it take to drive the shuttle from Chinook LRT to QP during rush hour? Google Maps says 10 minutes, but that is only likely during off peak....

[andasen]

Originally Posted by mellbell416

With Imperial Oil moving to QUarry Park in a couple of years, I have been hunting for reasonable transit options from the NW, but nothing works unless you hook up with the 201 from DT, and it makes for a loooong commute when you combine that with another bus leg (an hour or more depending on distance from the core ) - ridiculous! I did some investigation into trying to get to QP from a local LRT and it was hilarious to see the results - all pathways headed north to DT and then back down the 201! If the city really is serious about setting up these suburban cores, this is a huge black eye on transit planning...

Really, the best thing to do is to have a quick connection from a nearby LRT station and IOl has talked about setting up bus shuttles either on their own or in conjunction with the city. Of course, this would only work if they were frequent- I would say that it would have to be one every 10 minutes or it would be useless. They have talked about connecting to a 'hub' (I interpret that to mean an LRT station, but maybe I am wrong) in NW W, or SW. My guess is that the best LRT to connect to would be Chinook since it is so close to Glenmore.

Does anyone else have different thoughts on this? How long would it take to drive the shuttle from Chinook LRT to QP during rush hour? Google Maps says 10 minutes, but that is only likely during off peak....

What about taking the 302 from downtown? It now has two stops in Quarry Park plus one another that functionally serves a bit south of Quarry Park on 18th. In terms of local bus service the 136 provides the connection to Chinook during peak hours. At the current levels of build out in Quarry Park this is technically sufficient. I have my suspicions that once the condos along the river start being occupied that will be when the finalized routes start materializing.

Chinook Station to Quarry Park is more in line with 15 minutes express during optimal trafffic conditions. During rush hour make that 20 minutes and on the truly aweful days 25.

[Ferreth]

Originally Posted by andasen

What about taking the 302 from downtown? It now has two stops in Quarry Park plus one another that functionally serves a bit south of Quarry Park on 18th. In terms of local bus service the 136 provides the connection to Chinook during peak hours. At the current levels of build out in Quarry Park this is technically sufficient. I have my suspicions that once the condos along the river start being occupied that will be when the finalized routes start materializing.

Chinook Station to Quarry Park is more in line with 15 minutes express during optimal trafffic conditions. During rush hour make that 20 minutes and on the truly aweful days 25.

That's a 1 hour ride to Chinook from the deep NW, plus call it 30 minutes with transfer to Quarry Park. I'd be looking for another job if I was faced with that. If IOL wanted to reduce the sting of that a bit, they should open an employee coffee shop downtown right by their shuttle pickup, which should be located within a block of 7th Ave stations. That way you can at least grab a coffee, and the shop can announce when the shuttle is leaving / any delays etc. I'd still run a small shuttle from Chinook for everyone coming in from the south too. Being IOL, I suspect they will just run a shuttle from Chinook and expect anyone far away to move closer to work.

[mellbell416]

Ye gods - a 15 -25 minute ferry just from CHinook alone? God, that just makes any journey from the NW a hellish long ride.. And I did mean the 302, not the 201 (sorry for the confusion)...A buddy and I did a drive along the 302 route to Quarry Park today from DT and it made for a damn depressing ride through the industrial sector and nowhereville. Quarry Park itself is pretty bizarre - gleaming office buildings surrounded by fancy row houses and ton of giant dig sites. I am sure that it will look nice once it is done, but it is SO different from the DT life that we are all used to, and I don't think that IOL has a clue how bad the attrition will be. Once people get a sense of the horrible commutes by either car or bus by checking it out for themselves, it's going to be a really tough sell. It reminds me so much of Houston...

IOL has made a big deal about QP having great transit, but the exact opposite is true. If they ran a shuttle from DT, that would be a lot better, but I think that they would make the argument that there is already the 302 shuttle..

Sigh...I really don't want to quit, but they don't seem to be leaving me with much choice.

[andasen]

Originally Posted by mellbell416

Ye gods - a 15 -25 minute ferry just from CHinook alone? God, that just makes any journey from the NW a hellish long ride.. And I did mean the 302, not the 201 (sorry for the confusion)...A buddy and I did a drive along the 302 route to Quarry Park today from DT and it made for a damn depressing ride through the industrial sector and nowhereville. Quarry Park itself is pretty bizarre - gleaming office buildings surrounded by fancy row houses and ton of giant dig sites. I am sure that it will look nice once it is done, but it is SO different from the DT life that we are all used to, and I don't think that IOL has a clue how bad the attrition will be. Once people get a sense of the horrible commutes by either car or bus by checking it out for themselves, it's going to be a really tough sell. It reminds me so much of Houston...

IOL has made a big deal about QP having great transit, but the exact opposite is true. If they ran a shuttle from DT, that would be a lot better, but I think that they would make the argument that there is already the 302 shuttle..

Sigh...I really don't want to quit, but they don't seem to be leaving me with much choice.

If you look up the transit service for today for an something that is 1-2 years out you're going to have a bad time. This is a growing area with growing service. Just think of all the planned changes to the network coming in the next year. Though I guess no matter how you slice it if you're coming from the deep NW you're going to have a bad time

[mellbell416]

Ok, I am not willing to give up yet.

If the SETWAY gets built, that would speed up the travel time from DT - the 302 presently would take 35 minutes to QP from Centre/9th Ave S, which is far too long if you have another leg before that. Does anyone have any idea of what the travel time would be if you used the SETWAY instead?

I have seen build dates for the SETWAY pegged both at 2014 and at 2019 - has anyone seen any recent info on when it is likely to be in place?

[mellbell416]

Ack - it isn't going to work either - only saves 5-10 minutes if a new SE transitway is in place. Just shows you why we really need that SE LRT but I will be lucky to be alive when that thing finally reaches QP...

[You Need A Thneed]

Originally Posted by mellbell416

Ok, I am not willing to give up yet.

If the SETWAY gets built, that would speed up the travel time from DT - the 302 presently would take 35 minutes to QP from Centre/9th Ave S, which is far too long if you have another leg before that. Does anyone have any idea of what the travel time would be if you used the SETWAY instead?

I have seen build dates for the SETWAY pegged both at 2014 and at 2019 - has anyone seen any recent info on when it is likely to be in place?

The SeTWAY probably won't start construction until 2014.

[armorand93]

Originally Posted by mersar

Cool. Some notes:

• At grade station at 88th Ave (including possible airport linkage) and 500 park n ride
• Below grade station at Country Hills Blvd at 60th (underneath the roadway, similar to 69th Street)
• At grade station on 128th in Redstone with 200 park n ride stalls
• Final station roughly where Barlow Crescent NE is west of 32nd Street in Stonegate, to be called Stoney Station with 100 park n ride stalls (will mostly be a destination rather than origin station)
• Eventually the next phase would cross Stoney Trail if its ever needed

All these stations except the last one would be side load, Stoney would be centre loading as its terminus. Country Hills may also be centre loading if the extension is phased and its terminus for a while.

Travel time would be roughly 13 minutes from Stoney to Saddletown

Ridership estimates are lower than most of the existing stations, but considering little of that area is built out by the time the line is built and the residential is built that may change.

Also included is a study of options for linking the NE LRT to the airport. Recommendation is start with buses and see how that works, but they evaluated possible options of both a spur and people mover from 88th Ave station.

And the estimated cost if it were to be built today? A cool $355 million ($46M of that is contingency)

Thanks for sparing me the 20 mB download!

That'd be pretty nice to see! Wonder if Airdries ICE would be re-directed to the "new" NE terminus in the future, to increase ridership until residential development starts getting built? I'd ask in CPTDB, but I'm already on thin ice with the moderators and some users there (I'll explain in a message, as they are well aware of Calgary SSP, but rarely ever check on Winnipeg SSP apparently). Good thing I'm on good terms with all the moderators and users on this forum.

[DizzyEdge]

Transit question: What other bus routes have similar intensity of service as the #3 (ie busses every 10 mins most of the day?

[frinkprof]

Originally Posted by DizzyEdge

Transit question: What other bus routes have similar intensity of service as the #3 (ie busses every 10 mins most of the day?

None.

[DizzyEdge]

Interesting. Centre street really is the only non-LRT corridor that approaches LRT service with the combination of the 3, 301, 300 then I guess.