PITTSBURGH | Development Rundown II

[Private Dick]

Originally Posted by BrianTH

Of course the ALMONO site actually has an existing neighborhood to integrate with. And the part closer to Downtown without such a neighborhood to integrate with doesn't seem all that different to me than the PTC.

True, although I do think closer connection with Oakland could be accomplished because of the university/research affiliations, and the southside directly across the river is a natural neighborhood connection... particularly based on the research facilities over there and the pedestrian Hot Metal Bridge.

I think the main difference with the Almono segment closest to downtown (adjacent to the PTC) is in its planned inclusion of residential with the office/biotech buildings and with its reconnection to the river via creation of a public linear riverfront park.

[Austinlee]

Originally Posted by Private Dick

I think the main difference with the Almono segment closest to downtown (adjacent to the PTC) is in its planned inclusion of residential with the office/biotech buildings and with its reconnection to the river via creation of a public linear riverfront park.

See Mr Dick, that's where I think your critic of the PTC doesn't work; How many developments do you see that mix biotech and residential?


And check out that walking trail!

[Austinlee]

But the land use argument is real; A line from the URA's report, pararaph titled "Obstacles & Lessons Learned"

As originally planned, this riverfront office park was essentially suburban in nature in an urban setting that did not take full advantage of the site. In 2007 the URA initiated a more urbanized development of PTC, investing $18.1 million to accommodate up to 1 million square feet of additional lab, research and office space.

http://www.ura.org/working_with_us/brownfieldProjects/PTC_BrownfieldBrief.pdf

[BrianTH]

Yeah, the PTC is really more a natural extension of the South Side than anything else, but even that is not the same as actually being able to plug into a full street grid. I do think knowing what we know now, some residential would be nice, but I also think to be fair, that is with the benefit of hindsight. Of course it is great they decided to densify the plan, and I think it has promise as a transit node (say for urban gondolas on their way from Oakland to the South Side).

By the way, are those riverfront walkways public? It is a bit of a moot point right now, but eventually I would hope they could be integrated into a continuous riverfront park system.

Edit: A quick check of a satellite image indicates those walkways aren't even continuous within the site, so that continuous riverfront park idea may be a stretch.

[Private Dick]

Originally Posted by Austinlee

See Mr Dick, that's where I think your critic of the PTC doesn't work; How many developments do you see that mix biotech and residential?


And check out that walking trail!

Huh? Not sure what you're saying. The Almono site includes residential in its plans at the center of the office/biotech portion of the site -- the segment from around Greenfield Ave to the PTC.

It's not like condos would be inside biomedical/pharma research lab buildings or anything, if that's what you're suggesting. And fyi, Boston, Baltimore, Houston, North Carolina (that I know of.. there are numerous other locales I'm sure) all have residential development that goes right along with their bio research facilities. It's not uncommon at all.

As for that walking trail... those 3 represent 30% of the total number of people to have "used" that trail.

[Private Dick]

Originally Posted by BrianTH

Yeah, the PTC is really more a natural extension of the South Side than anything else, but even that is not the same as actually being able to plug into a full street grid. I do think knowing what we know now, some residential would be nice, but I also think to be fair, that is with the benefit of hindsight. Of course it is great they decided to densify the plan, and I think it has promise as a transit node (say for urban gondolas on their way from Oakland to the South Side).

By the way, are those riverfront walkways public? It is a bit of a moot point right now, but eventually I would hope they could be integrated into a continuous riverfront park system.

Edit: A quick check of a satellite image indicates those walkways aren't even continuous within the site, so that continuous riverfront park idea may be a stretch.

Gondolas to Oakland would be awesome. Really awesome.

I don't think the walkways are public, but specifically for the tenants in the buildings. Though I don't think anyone cares. I've checked the "trails" out before on my bike on a lunch hour... I was literally the only person out there on a nice day. There's no attraction to do so unless you worked there and went out there for a smoke break. As you said, the trails don't connect to each other at all... and it is still largely undeveloped. The rail line isn't used, yet it blocks all access to the river -- hopefully the rail line can be converted to a recreational trail and connect to the Almono park.

The way they built the newest building's mechanical facilities practically right up to the river's edge bugs me.

[Austinlee]

Originally Posted by Private Dick

It's not like condos would be inside biomedical/pharma research lab buildings or anything, if that's what you're suggesting. And fyi, Boston, Baltimore, Houston, North Carolina (that I know of.. there are numerous other locales I'm sure) all have residential development that goes right along with their bio research facilities. It's not uncommon at all.

Maybe so. To be honest, I just haven't seen it and can't think of any examples. It wouldn't be the first time I was wrong about something.

[Private Dick]

Originally Posted by Austinlee

Maybe so. To be honest, I just haven't seen it and can't think of any examples. It wouldn't be the first time I was wrong about something.

Many biomedical/pharma firms have been building in cities near university research centers lately rather than out on large gated campuses, for the specific reasons mentioned in this thread... opportunity for increased connection and collaboration.

The Maryland Biotechnology Center in Baltimore now under construction by Johns Hopkins is probably the best example in similarity to Pittsburgh's property.

Building new residential and rehabbing older existing residential and integrating it into the biotech center, along with supporting services. The main biotech street thru the development below...

[Austinlee]

^Nice but it looks like a pretty standard city street grid.

[Private Dick]

^ Yeah, it is part of the street grid in Baltimore. Built on vacant lands adjacent to Johns Hopkins. It just displays how biotech/research facilities don't necessarily have to be isolated from the rest of a city... that other land uses can be perfectly compatible and complementary to medical research facilities. I'm not suggesting that the PTC site is a similar layout (because there is obviously no grid to integrate with, but the main residential portion of the Almono site plans to fully connect to the Hazelwood street grid.

[BrianTH]

Random comment:

The "Kashi" building being renovated at Fifth and Wood is looking really nice. With the grime blasted off it is a very attractive grey, and it has somewhat subtle but interesting and dignified ornamentation.

I take this as more proof that a lot of the buildings in the Fifth/Forbes corridor have great potential, if they are given a little TLC. I'm looking forward to that whole stretch of Wood eventually being redone (many buildings are already in progress).

[glowrock]

I have no doubt that the PTC could have been much more integrated into the surrounding neighborhood, IF there was a surrounding neighborhood to connect to! Put the PTC say in East Liberty on the site about to become Bakery Square II, and I have no doubt it would have been properly incorporated into the grid/neighborhood. But in the location it's in, there's nothing to connect to, that's the problem.

Aaron (Glowrock)

Originally Posted by Private Dick

^ Yeah, it is part of the street grid in Baltimore. Built on vacant lands adjacent to Johns Hopkins. It just displays how biotech/research facilities don't necessarily have to be isolated from the rest of a city... that other land uses can be perfectly compatible and complementary to medical research facilities. I'm not suggesting that the PTC site is a similar layout (because there is obviously no grid to integrate with, but the main residential portion of the Almono site plans to fully connect to the Hazelwood street grid.

[Jonboy1983]

You raise the argument about connectivity to other neighborhoods. Suppose there was some way to get Downtown from there, like perhaps on a monorail or on some LRT spur? Didn't Tom Murphy come up with something like this quite a few years ago? His vision had a monorail extend from the 1st Avenue Station down 2nd Avenue and somehow wind up in Central Oakland.

While we're on the topic of land development and public transportation, I'm surprised nobody mentioned this from either the PG or the Trib. According to the Trib, such an agreement was reached between Port Authority and Allegheny County regarding this project:

Massaro Dawson wants to build a massive residential complex pretty much right next to the South Hills Village T stop.

http://triblive.com/news/allegheny/26323...ark-village-agreement-deal#axzz26wrNRB00

[BrianTH]

Street grid continuity and transit/trail connectivity are two different sorts of issues. The former was never really an option, but it should not be too late for the latter, although I agree the one mechanicals-section seems in the way of a riverfront trail (worse case scenario, though, you should be able to build something to get around that).

I'd still suggest the #1 transit priority is actually getting a real transit link to Oakland, rather than Downtown. I also think how it interacts with the ALMONO development will be worth watching, and if that development matures well then I could see how a transit link from Downtown through the PTC to ALMONO would start becoming a top priority.

[Found5dollar]

i was on campus yesterday at CMU walking from one building to another and I noticed they have put up a huge banner where the new nanotechnology building is going. I'll see if i can snap a picture one of these upcoming days.

[KINGPIN]

Long-delayed project in Oakland takes step closer to construction
About Sam Spatter
Tribune-Review Staff reporter Sam Spatter can be reached via e-mail or at 412-320-7843.
TribLIVE Mobile | Contact us
More Tribune-Review Tribune-Review

By Sam Spatter

Published: Saturday, September 22, 2012, 12:01 a.m.
Updated 17 hours ago

Construction could begin next year on an Oakland development six years in the making that would provide office space, apartments and a hotel.

The Oakland Portal, announced in 2006, awaits final approvals from the Pittsburgh Zoning Board of Adjustment and the city Planning Commission, said Lou Molnar, whose L.W. Molnar Associates is the developer.

People can inspect the plan at an Oct. 3 public hearing, at 6 p.m. at Carlow University.

The first of three proposed office buildings would be a 13-story structure with offices in the first six floors and a 124-room hotel above. The building on Fifth Avenue, near Forbes and Craft avenues, and two nine-story structures would have underground garages with capacity for a total of 762 vehicles, Molnar said.

The office/hotel building’s restaurant would have outdoor terrace seating.

“We expect our potential office tenants to be medical and high-technology users,” he said.

Amid the office buildings is an area for commercial development. A 47-unit apartment building exists in the complex; a second, 47-unit building will be built.

Molnar anticipates opening the new apartment building and the office/hotel tower in April 2014.


Sam Spatter is a staff writer for Trib Total Media. He can be reached at 412-320-7843 or

Read more: http://triblive.com/business/2645565-74/...ent-buildings-construction#ixzz27EYnlvEf
Follow us: @triblive on Twitter | triblive on Facebook

[Buzz Pittsburgh]

Originally Posted by Jonboy1983

While we're on the topic of land development and public transportation, I'm surprised nobody mentioned this from either the PG or the Trib. According to the Trib, such an agreement was reached between Port Authority and Allegheny County regarding this project:

Massaro Dawson wants to build a massive residential complex pretty much right next to the South Hills Village T stop.

http://triblive.com/news/allegheny/26323...ark-village-agreement-deal#axzz26wrNRB00

This looks like a nice use of the space, and a great example of Transit Oriented Development. Do you know what their design is going to be? I was searching online and all I could find was that they are planning 4 buildings with a community center.

I was reading a blog called PerSquareMile, where Tim de Chant references some developments in suburban D.C. where urban density and mix of uses is being built on farmland. It's a favorite blog of mine, and the source article (found here) is interesting in its coverage of reasons for and against such developments. Still, there remains a need for efficient use of the land, wherever that land may be. It's so artificial though. I can't imagine living somewhere like that for long.

[Jonboy1983]

Originally Posted by KINGPIN

Long-delayed project in Oakland takes step closer to construction
About Sam Spatter
Tribune-Review Staff reporter Sam Spatter can be reached via e-mail or at 412-320-7843.
TribLIVE Mobile | Contact us
More Tribune-Review Tribune-Review

By Sam Spatter

Published: Saturday, September 22, 2012, 12:01 a.m.
Updated 17 hours ago

Construction could begin next year on an Oakland development six years in the making that would provide office space, apartments and a hotel.

The Oakland Portal, announced in 2006, awaits final approvals from the Pittsburgh Zoning Board of Adjustment and the city Planning Commission, said Lou Molnar, whose L.W. Molnar Associates is the developer.

People can inspect the plan at an Oct. 3 public hearing, at 6 p.m. at Carlow University.

The first of three proposed office buildings would be a 13-story structure with offices in the first six floors and a 124-room hotel above. The building on Fifth Avenue, near Forbes and Craft avenues, and two nine-story structures would have underground garages with capacity for a total of 762 vehicles, Molnar said.

The office/hotel building’s restaurant would have outdoor terrace seating.

“We expect our potential office tenants to be medical and high-technology users,” he said.

Amid the office buildings is an area for commercial development. A 47-unit apartment building exists in the complex; a second, 47-unit building will be built.

Molnar anticipates opening the new apartment building and the office/hotel tower in April 2014.


Sam Spatter is a staff writer for Trib Total Media. He can be reached at 412-320-7843 or

Read more: http://triblive.com/business/2645565-74/...ent-buildings-construction#ixzz27EYnlvEf
Follow us: @triblive on Twitter | triblive on Facebook

From the looks of the article, this proposal seems different from what we all saw renderings of a few months or so ago that looked like some retirement community. I'm getting a little bit excited about this one.

Originally Posted by Buzz Pittsburgh

This looks like a nice use of the space, and a great example of Transit Oriented Development. Do you know what their design is going to be? I was searching online and all I could find was that they are planning 4 buildings with a community center.

I was reading a blog called PerSquareMile, where Tim de Chant references some developments in suburban D.C. where urban density and mix of uses is being built on farmland. It's a favorite blog of mine, and the source article (found here) is interesting in its coverage of reasons for and against such developments. Still, there remains a need for efficient use of the land, wherever that land may be. It's so artificial though. I can't imagine living somewhere like that for long.

I'm glad you like this proposed use of the land. While I have no idea as to what this development is going to look like, I imagine they'd want to build something a little taller than the parking structure there. Isn't that thing 7 levels tall? Why would you want to have that hideous thing being the tallest structure of any development? Then again, we have the eye vomit that is the parking structure behind the Rivers Casino.

[glowrock]

Wow, I'm all into the Oakland Portal development! It's a great location, and I'll be able to see all of the construction right from my townhouse on the Slopes, since I've got a perfect view of the area!

Aaron (Glowrock)

[Austinlee]

Originally Posted by Found5dollar

i was on campus yesterday at CMU walking from one building to another and I noticed they have put up a huge banner where the new nanotechnology building is going. I'll see if i can snap a picture one of these upcoming days.

Yes please!

Does the rendering still look like this?




http://thetartan.org/2012/2/13/scitech/newbuilding