Regina | New Mosaic Stadium - Page 75

Nathan · #**1481** Posted **Jul 16, 2012, 4:28 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by osmo

My mistake I punched in 5 games. Still though expecting sell outs for 39 yrs strait is quite dubious. Not even the NY Yankees or Red Sox could promise that. Plus sports attendance figures in all major leagues are in decline. The numbers are still fluffed up even if your getting 80 million in projected revenues.

The obvious plum that would be good to hear about are parking revenues. Are not talked about at all, or is still to soon. Will they be granted to Evraz? Or the Riders?

Another thing are seat licensees (PSLs). Maybe It's a fools game to promise 39 yrs of sellouts but it's not to sell of seat exclusivity for a select duration.

1- 30 years not 39 (probably a typo?)

2-We are building a 33k stadium, not some massive 60k stadium, so I don't think it's outside the realm of possibility for us to either come close to or actually sell out all those games. Plus, with inflation, maybe in 15-20 years that $12 fee can be adjusted a bit if necessary. Many NFL teams have sellouts dating back to the 60s, 70s, and 80s; so just for 10 dates a year it's a lot easier to do than for the 70+ required for baseball.

3- seat licences... Worst. Idea. Ever. If this were some multi-purpose facility (which you were dead-set against) you could, because then you'd have first rights on numerous other events. But as this will now be pretty much just a football stadium that can host the odd one off concert, you are asking people to pony up thousands for a licence that would give them the right to purchase their season tickets in the seats that some have held for decades (not to mention the $12 per ticket surcharge on top of it all). All this will do is p*ss people off, and you will probably lose fans instead of retaining/gaining them.

You want us to cheap out on a stadium and bare bones it ala the 70s in the USSR... And now you want to nickel and dime everything as well?

wacko · #**1482** Posted **Jul 16, 2012, 5:37 PM**

$12 per ticket × average attendance of 30,000 per game × 10 games per year × 30 years = $108 million. Of course this does not cover the interest on the principal, quoted as $74 million, but it goes a long way. Granted, it has only been relatively recently that the 'Riders have averaged anywhere close to 30,000 paid seats a game. The Roughriders will not always be in first place, and some years might see lower attendance than others. Let's see how far 'Rider Pride goes.

Evraz Place has parking for around 3,000 vehicles. If the charge is $10 per vehicle per game, then $9 million could be raised over 30 years. Though I've no idea whether the parking revenue would go to the 'Riders or to the City of Regina. If to the 'Riders, this would help raise some money towards their $25 million portion of the stadium, or to their extra structural needs (locker room, weight room, etc.) If to the City of Regina, this would presumably help cover operating costs of the stadium. Perhaps the City should once again start charging for parking for all events at Evraz Place, not only Roughrider games at the new stadium.

I agree with Nathan, seat licences are not a good idea, particularly since this stadium will primarily be used for football only. There would be few other events that would have the same draw as the 'Riders, so not much point in having seat licenses.

I'm pleased to see that the major stakeholders were open about disclosing the total funding requirements ($675 million). And yes, property taxes are going to rise regardless. As a matter of fact, property taxes are supposed to cover $300 million of the $675 million. Though I'm a little skeptical about some of the other sources of revenue. Where does the $81 million in interest earned come from? Will Sask Sport actually pay $2.5 million a year for amateur sports to use the stadium? Where does "other revenue" come from? Parking fees would only cover a portion of that.

osmo · #**1483** Posted **Jul 16, 2012, 8:26 PM**

PSLs make sense in high demand environments. This is where I don't buy the argument that the ticket fee will pan out to the total estimate in that time frame. We are at or near the top in attendance in the league bounty on the best seats is more than acceptable.

Tickets have been in decline among all professional leagues. NFL attendance is down 23 percent. Economics have a lot to do with as people don't have as much money to burn in the states but also technology is another factor as well.

With PSLs you are exploiting a over capped demand for premium seats. If the demand was indeed true that they could say they are going to sell out every game for 30 years then it would also make sense that Season tickets will be capped out also - thus when PSLs enter the equation. But I don't believe the Riders are near that and thus don't believe the Cities numbers on the ticket fee. What will fans say when the Riders will charge the highest prices in the league? I am sure that will piss them off also, they will still go to games but the Riders will have to do a lot to keep interest on the field.

Now that something is being built I am just critical of the numbers and debt. the 270 million this thing will cost is still a large amount for a municipality this size. I am just a realist in saying property-taxes will have to be thrown into the pot to pay this thing off. Regina is not an exception as other cities have had to do this to invent strange new taxes to try and shield local taxpayers. It does not matter what projections they give us that ticket fee is not guaranteed money and their is a still a bill to be paid.

I just want transparency and not politics as usual. This thing is going to cost a ton of cash so be open with the process and let citizens know they will be on the hook for some of the costs.

Quote:

According to the agreement, the city would support both the capital costs and ongoing maintenance costs through a combination of debt, property taxes and allocation of other new or existing revenues. The plan would see a 0.45 per cent mill rate hike for each of 10 years. It's considered comparable to the five-year, 0.63 per cent increase the city implemented a couple years ago to pay for new buses and fire trucks.

Under the 30-year plan, the total funding requirements tally up to $675 million - with $230 million for maintenance and rehabilitation of the facility, $51 million in city debt interest, $70 million for city debt principal, $74 million in provincial loan interest, $100 million in provincial loan principal and $150 million for city interim financing.

Projected revenue sources to cover that $675 million are $300 million from property tax and related revenue, $100 million for facility fees, $81 million in interest earned, $75 million under a SaskSport agreement, $15 million in sponsorship and advertising revenue, $24 million in "cost avoidance" on Mosaic Stadium (it currently costs $800,000 annually for upkeep of the current stadium) and $80 million chalked up to "other revenue."

Read more: http://www.thestarphoenix.com/sports/Reg...+debate/6938681/story.html#ixzz20oqDPfUT

Nathan · #**1484** Posted **Jul 16, 2012, 8:39 PM**

If you want Rider season tickets to drop over 23% as well, feel free to try a PSL. This isn't a situation that should be "exploited". Exploiting the paying public will not get other people on board for the stadium (they would prefer government to spend the entire budget on hospitals, roads, and the arts and that won't change), but what you would do is alienate your paying customers. My family has had season tickets since 1993 and I can tell you, we'd be out if PSL's were brought in. Then you can really have fun talking about attendance dive-bombing. As you said, Riders attendance wasn't always fantastic, so not to mention how many long-time ticket holders would drop off, how many new ticket-holders would stay on? My guess is not many at all. How many family ticket holder would you p*ss off in the process?

Good thing the people actually in charge of this aren't so short-sighted that they are thinking along your lines. A usage fee is by far the better option. Plus there will be naming rights, which will be higher for the new facility and many more corporate boxes (which the Riders can use to pay their higher rental fee).

Yes there is demand for tickets, but it's not inelastic.

Stormer · #**1485** Posted **Jul 16, 2012, 9:19 PM**

I am pretty confident there will be no seat licences, but there will very likely be club seating. Therefore, some of the prime seats will be much more expensive but will come with amenities (like 2 cupholders

)

Welkin · #**1486** Posted **Jul 16, 2012, 10:23 PM**

Even though there have been several "football only" stadiums built that used PSL's as part of their financing package, keep in mind that they were NFL stadiums and not CFL stadiums. The CFL is no where near the price level of NFL tickets, so don't expect CFL fans to be agreeable to pay NFL level PSL's or ticket prices. I don't see PSL's working for CFL stadiums unless they were really dirt cheap and then what's the point of doing them at all. As for premium seats or club seats, those should be available and will include premium executive club level bars, restaurants, lounges, restrooms and etc., but those will be owned and operated by the the Riders. The stadium financiers will not see any of that money. The stadium fees will be the same $12 for a cheap $19 end zone seat as they will be for an $80 club level seat. This may hurt sales of cheap end zone seats, so hopefully most of the seats will be on the sidelines. I can see Riders fans paying the $12 stadium fee, but what about Regina Rams or high school games played at the stadium. Will those fans have to pay the extra fee also?

Stormer · #**1487** Posted **Jul 16, 2012, 11:13 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Welkin

Even though there have been several "football only" stadiums built that used PSL's as part of their financing package, keep in mind that they were NFL stadiums and not CFL stadiums. The CFL is no where near the price level of NFL tickets, so don't expect CFL fans to be agreeable to pay NFL level PSL's or ticket prices. I don't see PSL's working for CFL stadiums unless they were really dirt cheap and then what's the point of doing them at all. As for premium seats or club seats, those should be available and will include premium executive club level bars, restaurants, lounges, restrooms and etc., but those will be owned and operated by the the Riders. The stadium financiers will not see any of that money. The stadium fees will be the same $12 for a cheap $19 end zone seat as they will be for an $80 club level seat. This may hurt sales of cheap end zone seats, so hopefully most of the seats will be on the sidelines. I can see Riders fans paying the $12 stadium fee, but what about Regina Rams or high school games played at the stadium. Will those fans have to pay the extra fee also?

Amature sport will not pay. Their contribution/rent will come in the form of grants from SaskSport, which I believe is funded by lotteries.

Le-TanK- · #**1488** Posted **Jul 16, 2012, 11:56 PM**

This is great news! any news on when we will see concept art on how the new stadium will look like?

wacko · #**1489** Posted **Jul 17, 2012, 5:12 AM**

Maybe check back at the end of the year. While the funding may (theoretically) be in place now, no design work has been done on the stadium as of yet. That's the reason it will take almost five years: one year of design and site prep, then four years of construction. Far better to be conservative on the timeline and not over-promise like the Blue Bombers did.

Nathan · #**1490** Posted **Jul 17, 2012, 5:20 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by wacko

Maybe check back at the end of the year. While the funding may (theoretically) be in place now, no design work has been done on the stadium as of yet. That's the reason it will take almost five years: one year of design and site prep, then four years of construction. Far better to be conservative on the timeline and not over-promise like the Blue Bombers did.

Some design work has been done and also presented to the city/partners. They engaged some architects to give them designs of what can be done for the $278 mill some time ago. I'm sure more detail work needs to be done, but they aren't exactly at the beginning stages of the process anymore.

And I think they said it would be complete in 2016, and open for the 2017 season. So probably closer to 4 years, gives them a bit of time afte the stadium is complete to do some site work directly around it.

wacko · #**1491** Posted **Jul 17, 2012, 3:56 PM**

Yes, I see now that that the city is in the process of planning and designing conceptual work for the new stadium. My mistake.

As I see it, the drop-dead date for the stadium opening would be June 2017, which is close to five years from now. There are always the inevitable delays though, both weather-related and otherwise, so it's good to have lots of time.

I do wonder if the property tax increases will need to be approved by city council following the civic election in the fall. We'll have a new mayor by then, and perhaps some new city councillors as well, who may or may not agree with the idea of raising taxes to build a new stadium.

osmo · #**1492** Posted **Jul 19, 2012, 12:51 AM**

I think its smart politics to support the motion that preceded you. Criticism can come on other aspects such as housing or infrastructure and maybe we should of used the same effort and priorities to get those done with the province but I feel it may be suicide to try and "kill it".

cutterp · #**1493** Posted **Aug 22, 2012, 2:55 PM**

Saw the plans last night and I was happy to see quite a few large water closets in the stadium, and a tunnel!

In all seriousness, it looks great.

Stormer · #**1494** Posted **Aug 22, 2012, 3:25 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by cutterp

Saw the plans last night and I was happy to see quite a few large water closets in the stadium, and a tunnel!

In all seriousness, it looks great.

That's all you are going to tell us? What does the roof look like?

sask1982 · #**1495** Posted **Aug 22, 2012, 5:20 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by cutterp

Saw the plans last night and I was happy to see quite a few large water closets in the stadium, and a tunnel!

In all seriousness, it looks great.

A tunnel to where? Brandt Centre? Lawson?

Nathan · #**1496** Posted **Aug 22, 2012, 5:56 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by sask1982

A tunnel to where? Brandt Centre? Lawson?

To the casino/downtown would be amazing, but also ridiculously expensive and highly unlikely.

Migs · #**1497** Posted **Aug 22, 2012, 8:28 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by cutterp

Saw the plans last night and I was happy to see quite a few large water closets in the stadium, and a tunnel!

In all seriousness, it looks great.

Forgive my ignorance but what is a water closet?

*edit*. Ahh you mean cans. Lol

You gotta tell us more...

Scruff Bucket · #**1498** Posted **Aug 22, 2012, 8:50 PM**

Synonyms for W.C.:
http://www.merriam-webster.com/thesaurus/water+closet?show=0&t=1345668134

Is there a surrounding/multilevel concourse to link all of the seating sections, suites, concessions, etc.? When will more info be released?! ... The suspense! The suspense! ...

SkydivePilot · #**1499** Posted **Aug 23, 2012, 3:43 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scruff Bucket

Synonyms for W.C.:
http://www.merriam-webster.com/thesaurus/water+closet?show=0&t=1345668134

Is there a surrounding/multilevel concourse to link all of the seating sections, suites, concessions, etc.? When will more info be released?! ... The suspense! The suspense! ...

If this were the case, then the stadium will certainly be roof-ready!

cutterp · #**1500** Posted **Aug 23, 2012, 4:39 PM**

Some nice lounges, wide concourses, a huge beer area, terraces, large box seating areas for the rich and then another for the richer. Training area for athletes... a real stadium.

I didn't get to see the bit about all of the research done on the roof shading the seating area but it sounds like they have done a lot of work on sun position and what not through out the year and what it does to the spectators sight lines.

Pretty neat. I'm sure there will be revisions but it was very interesting.