Edmonton Construction 11 (November 2011) - Page 93

ue · #**1841** Posted **Mar 7, 2012, 8:24 PM**

What cities are better comparisons to Edmonton? Better than a city that is nearby, in the same province, similar size, urban fabric/history, economic prospects, laws, culture, etc?

There are many good things, such as that new Dub Hotel, going on in Edmonton, but that doesn't mean we can't learn from comparable cities that have an edge on this city in certain regards. I may have forgot to mention this, but in addition to Calgary not being "king shit", it has a few things that it does worse than Edmonton.

s211 · #**1842** Posted **Mar 7, 2012, 8:33 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jasper and one o nin

Now now, lets not be mean

. GMH is actually not that bad. What I have a problem with, is that they undercut most of the more notable firms in town by a lot and end up getting some fairly significant projects that they really should not be doing.
They're trying to play in the big kid's sandbox. Except they are pissing all over the sand so nobody else can play.

Actually, GMH is that bad.

The only thing I have against Mandel is that he seems to have gone silent on the "no more crap" mantra. He gave me false hope.

Black Star · #**1843** Posted **Mar 7, 2012, 8:47 PM**

Concur fully. IMO Mandel has done an amazing job to facilitate the resurgence of downtown. But I thought he would be more aggressive/bullish on the monitoring of quality and taste of more of the projects in the core.

tony0911 · #**1844** Posted **Mar 7, 2012, 8:53 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by 240glt

^ That's your perogative. I see the comparison as silly... cities are always going to have their stong and weak points. Looking south like a bunch of forlorn cattle behind a barbed wire fence is dumb. Feepa's right. There's much better cities to look to for guidance.

I could go back to Cowtown (or Vancouver for that matter) tomorrow if I wanted to. For me, Edmonton is where I want to be at this stage of my life, and this city offers me everything I want & need. In fact, even more. I've made it what I want out of a city. Seems like a lot of Edmontonians have a problem doing things for themselves.

Well, Calgary seems to be getting much more of an urban fabric feel as well as a lot more of those "well designed" residential towers that all the architectural junkies on here say that our DT is lacking. So, either they are doing something right or we are doing something wrong or a complement of both. Most people on here and C2e say they would like a much greater compliment of those types of buildings in our city myself included, so either there is a small minority of us in the city spouting off for something that the city doesn't want or we need to change how we operate to get a different outcome that we desire. Perhaps something can be learned from others.

Kevin_foster · #**1845** Posted **Mar 7, 2012, 8:59 PM**

There is only so much a mayor or city council can do to raise the bar on architecture and design. The design committee has done a great job in weeding out the absolute garbage, but even still they can't completely bar a project from starting if the demand is there. They can only throw up lot's of red tape.

At the end of the day, the quality of design in this city is directly attributable to the citizens and investors who buy.

If there is demand for a Shangri La in Edmonton, there will be one built.

I think we need to point the fingers at ourselves for seeing and buying such subpar crap. I wonder how well projects like the Venetian would do in other major cities across the globe. Probably not too well

We're in the right direction though. The city and its leaders have done wonders for getting "the word out" to the masses, and I think saying "no more crap" is somewhat of a bit of lip service, to perhaps start to get the public to think about what they demand.

Don't want crap? Don't buy crap. Our counterparts to the south are starting to get this, even though they have their share of crap too.

Also, If demand continues, hopefully we can see some more investors and outside talent to come compete. If I was an outside firm looking in, I'd say Edmonton is ripe for the taking to the next sexiest bidder.

Coldrsx · #**1846** Posted **Mar 7, 2012, 9:24 PM**

'Don't want crap? Don't buy crap'

Exactly. Amazing what voting with your $ can do.

tony0911 · #**1847** Posted **Mar 7, 2012, 9:32 PM**

When you need a place to live and all that is available on the market is crap.....pretty hard not to buy something.

Coldrsx · #**1848** Posted **Mar 7, 2012, 9:36 PM**

^right, cause 'everything' on the market is crap.

TimB09 · #**1849** Posted **Mar 7, 2012, 9:46 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by tony0911

When you need a place to live and all that is available on the market is crap.....pretty hard not to buy something.

The outside of buildings may not be up to your standards but there's a lot of nice places on the inside around town. That's a pretty unfair comment as I just moved from a place that visually isn't appealing from the outside but our suite was very well done and very impressive.

angelvs · #**1850** Posted **Mar 7, 2012, 9:48 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coldrsx

^right, cause 'everything' on the market is crap.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RiMOKmp0uZc

s4.audios · #**1851** Posted **Mar 7, 2012, 9:50 PM**

Hilton looks amazing and so does corner one in taupee's posted pic IMO. Maybe that projection is the back of the tower?? That back side really is all that worries me about corner one; no photos for it. And these corner 1 pics really arent realistic enough to make a completely honest opinion.

Cold is UW the warehouse district? If so, I fully agree with you. I vision the area as a signature condo neighbourhood in the city; needs a loooooot of love.

Nobody can deny that Edmonton needs to catch up on design and quality projects. Although it is starting to happen and it comes with demand and having more players in the industry. I think there were barely any developers in the past and thats why we have so many ugly buildings.

Jasper and one o nin · #**1852** Posted **Mar 7, 2012, 9:54 PM**

^^ ha ha. Because that fits the mental picture of what I think Tony looks like!

Coldrsx · #**1853** Posted **Mar 7, 2012, 10:00 PM**

^^ yup, Urban Warehouse. It is such a disconnect and wasteland in many areas. We need Norquest to go, Dub's 7th st bookend, Scott park, LRT and a good 5-6 Quest sized towers with mixed use podiums.

Hallsy's Toupee · #**1854** Posted **Mar 7, 2012, 10:08 PM**

I think fear and desperation plays a role in mediocre architecture here. Fear that developers will say to city council, let us build what we want or we'll stay away from downtown and build it in Sherwood Park, Winnipeg or wherever. I mean, when's the last time True North built one of their turds here?

Coldrsx · #**1855** Posted **Mar 7, 2012, 10:19 PM**

TNP last built one of the better buildings, architecturally speaking, of recent memory... 'The Uptown'. Gaeton 'got out' because he saw certain market conditions that did not work for his company.

tony0911 · #**1856** Posted **Mar 7, 2012, 10:21 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coldrsx

^right, cause 'everything' on the market is crap.

Well I'm a late twenties early thirties professional recruited here by a company working DT wanting to buy a place close to work DT.....Give me something between 100 and 109 st and 98 Ave to 104 ave that looks like anything remotely similar to some of the building from other cities that have been discussed on here.....because I am from elsewhere and that's what I'm used to seeing DT and that's what I'm looking for and expecting. (Theoretical of course, look forward to the numerous choices you will offer)

Coldrsx · #**1857** Posted **Mar 7, 2012, 10:27 PM**

I don't disagree we have a lack contemporary condo towers to choose from, but below are some good options.

7th st lofts, omega, icon, quest, soon to be ultima, Philips, Cobogo.

tony0911 · #**1858** Posted **Mar 7, 2012, 10:34 PM**

Ultima 2 yrs away....can't wait
7th st.....don't like only one window in my closet of a condo
Icon...too many lawsuits and existing unhappy tenants, not interested
Phillips cobogo......not looking for a historic relic
Quest is a possibility......

Not totally trying to be a wise ass......but you can get the point I'm trying to make, with what we have to offer it's no wonder people are driven to the vinyl clad matchstick walk ups in the burbs because their really is nothing available DT.

If you were relocated here tomorrow the pickings are beyond slim for a new young buyer who want to be in the core.

Coldrsx · #**1859** Posted **Mar 7, 2012, 10:52 PM**

^Again, I very much agree we need more examples of contemporary urban living (including townhouses please) downtown and area. I have a few friends in your situation and many found it hard to find a modern high-rise with the style they prefer. That said, have you been in 7th st... there are some killer 1bdrm mezzanines and 2 storey units even.

rapid_business · #**1860** Posted **Mar 7, 2012, 11:26 PM**

/\ As you said Cold, Tony is right on this one.

As someone in a similar position as Tony described, options for new/newer construction in DT and Oliver are weak. How is it that there is only one condo in this area with pre-sales right now that fits into a decent category = Pearl? Recession and all, I know. But the lack of options are staggering.

That's why I'd take a 1970s concrete block in Oliver with a river view and gut it/reno it. Most other options suck if you are looking to spend sub $400k.