Highways in Canada

[eternallyme]

Originally Posted by jmt18325

I think that once the road is twinned between TB and Nipigon, the focus should be on bypassing small towns, and twinning in the eastern part of the province, down the valley to Petawawa, and between Sault Ste. Marie and North Bay.

In that stretch, the most badly needed stretches are:

1) Arnprior to Petawawa (REALLY badly needed - killer highway, yet the province might be deliberately going slow for political reasons as the Ottawa Valley is a Tea Party stronghold)

2) Bonfield to North Bay, through North Bay and on to Sturgeon Falls

3) Warren to Sudbury, around Sudbury to the end of the current 4 lanes, then again from Whitefish to Webbwood

4) Bypasses of Massey, Spanish, Blind River, Iron Bridge, Bruce Mines and Desbarats (any other small towns missed)? All of those should be 2 lanes initially, except for Desbarats which should be 4 to tie into the current 4 lanes.

5) Sault Ste. Marie sweeping northeast bypass from Fifth Line to the current 90-degree turn

[White Pine]

No, the Ottawa Valley isn't Tea Party. They voted Liberal for decades until the gun registry came out, and now that and the base keeps the conservatives going. And some of the best people I've ever known are there, so don't go around implying their low intelligence because of politics. Besides, this has nothing to do with highways anyway.

Anyways, the only place that would be negatively affected is Cobden (or at least the Shell in Cobden). Anyway, this section has already been planned. I think some people who own cottages in the area don't like it, but yeah. The Arnprior section took a few years to build, so I think it's more of a case of slow construction than anything. It's cool to watch the construction moving along!

[FrAnKs]

A quick tour in Quebec city :
A740 & A73 and Pierre laporte bridge at the end.
Was made last summer with my new Sony HDR.

• Video Link

[NBNYer]

Cool!

I saw my old apartment building! This makes me miss QC.
Why did you cut out Charest?

I think the most impressive urban drive in the city is Dufferin-Montmorency Hwy coming into downtown.

[FrAnKs]

thanks! I cutted Charest because of the sun reflexion, it was horrible to be honnest with you... even if my windshield was clean.

[davidivivid]

Well well, isn't that a familiar sight!!! Thanks for the video Franks.

[go_leafs_go02]

Originally Posted by FrAnKs

A quick tour in Quebec city :
A740 & A73 and Pierre laporte bridge at the end.
Was made last summer with my new Sony HDR.

• Video Link

Very nice! Been to QC once, about 5 years ago now, and it's a fantastic city.

Two things though, that I noticed.

1) HOLY WEAVING!!!!
2) Where's the emergency stopping shoulders?! There are absolutely none, Ontario will have a left and a right side shoulder anywhere where there is 3 or more lanes. How can that be forgotten?

[Mister F]

Originally Posted by go_leafs_go02

Very nice! Been to QC once, about 5 years ago now, and it's a fantastic city.

Two things though, that I noticed.

1) HOLY WEAVING!!!!
2) Where's the emergency stopping shoulders?! There are absolutely none, Ontario will have a left and a right side shoulder anywhere where there is 3 or more lanes. How can that be forgotten?

Most of the world does right shoulders but not left. And they tend to have higher speed limits than we're used to. Ontario highways really are overbuilt.

[MolsonExport]

Great QC driving video, FrAnKs

[go_leafs_go02]

Originally Posted by Mister F

Most of the world does right shoulders but not left. And they tend to have higher speed limits than we're used to. Ontario highways really are overbuilt.

USA interstate standards require a left shoulder if there is 3 or more lanes in one direction.

I'd argue that Quebec freeways are underbuilt. What you see in Quebec City is alot better than Montreal in terms of highway design. That's second-world right there.

[haljackey]

Left shoulders are more of a nicety. In places like Canada, they are useful in the winter as they provide a place where snow can be put (for medianed highways anyway).

Quebec's highways are more in-line with the US Interstates whereas Ontario is more like the A-routes of the Eurozone.

Quebec's freeways are overbuilt system-wise, but may be underbuilt quality-wise. Just look at the Turcot Interchange or the overpass that collapsed a few years back.

[catkat]

QEW through Waterdown/East of Hamilton Area is 3 lanes each direction with no left shoulder...

[catkat]

http://maps.google.ca/maps?hl=en&ll=43.2...afU4lC-Om54q1xc3sDA&cbp=12,231.51,,0,1.4

[go_leafs_go02]

Originally Posted by catkat

http://maps.google.ca/maps?hl=en&ll=43.2...afU4lC-Om54q1xc3sDA&cbp=12,231.51,,0,1.4

That's Highway 403, not the QEW, but yes, you're right in that case. however, that situation in Ontario is extremely rare. 401 from Milton right to London has a left median shoulder, QEW to Niagara, the same.

And here is proof with regard to interstate design. Some older freeways in urban areas probably don't fit, but anything built in the last few decades had to contain an inside paved shoulder.

Shoulder width: Minimum outside paved shoulder width of 10 feet (3.05 m) and inside shoulder width of 4 feet (1.22 m). With three or more lanes in each direction, the inside paved shoulder should be at least 10 feet (3.05 m) wide. If truck traffic is over 250 Directional Design Hour Volume, shoulders at least 12 feet (3.66 m) wide should be considered. In mountainous terrain, 8 feet (2.44 m) outside and 4 feet (1.22 m) inside shoulders are acceptable, except when there are at least four lanes in each direction, in which case the inside shoulders should also be 8 feet (2.44 m) wide.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interstate_Highway_standards

Here's a location in Michigan showing a wider inside shoulder. Note there's 3 lanes:

http://g.co/maps/xx2v7

[sonysnob]

That section of Hwy 403 in question opened in 1963, and was among the first six lane highway segments to be opened to traffic in Ontario.

Back in the 1960's, even in Ontario, most six-lane (or wider) highways in Ontario lacked left-side shoulders. Think of highways such as the QEW through Mississauga, or Highway 400 between Toronto and Barrie. It wasn't really until the late 1970s or early 1980s that Ontario started building every six lane (or wider) freeway with fully paved left and right shoulders.

What separates Ontario Freeways from those in Quebec, is that Ontario has retrofitted so many of its older freeways with newer, upgraded design standards while Quebec has not.

For example, not that long ago, the 400 had no left side shoulder where it ran through both Toronto and Vaughan:

(Sorry for the image size),

Today, it obviously does:


Same for the 401 through Scarborough and Pickering for example:

(again sorry for the image size),

while today the freeway is totally unrecognizable from 20 years ago:


Even Québec has significantly updated its standards, the province just never upgrades any of its existing infrastructure.
The A-25 extension has left-side shoulders despite the fact it is only of a four-lane configuration:

[eemy]

Highway 400 north of Toronto up to where 11 splits off is basically still identical to the older standard shown above. I definitely approve of left-shoulder lanes, particularly in heavy traffic.

[haljackey]

Makes sense to me. Older highways can be retrofitted to modern standards, given there's enough room for inner shoulders.

Most of the work would probably be done when highways are widend/reconstructed.

Heck, even Simcity has this kind of standard:



I know this isn't in Canada, but one of the most impressive conversions you'll see is Interstate 94 in Detroit. This 6 lane hazard was built in the 1950's and will see a makeover with extra lanes and left shoulders:

• Video Link

If anyone has driven on this stretch, it's a horror. (I've done it several times to get to the Detroit Airport.) I can't wait for this project to start.

[catkat]

Maybe when the new crossing between Windsor and Detroit is built, that I-94 project will go ahead. Apparently the US government will match the funds used to build the bridge, giving Michigan an extra 2 Billion dollars for highway upgrades

[Mister F]

Originally Posted by go_leafs_go02

USA interstate standards require a left shoulder if there is 3 or more lanes in one direction.

I'd argue that Quebec freeways are underbuilt. What you see in Quebec City is alot better than Montreal in terms of highway design. That's second-world right there.

By "most of the world" I didn't mean the US. They have generous standards like us.

Originally Posted by haljackey

Quebec's highways are more in-line with the US Interstates whereas Ontario is more like the A-routes of the Eurozone.

Not really, Ontario highways are more like the US. Any highway I've been on in Europe has little to no left shoulder, even ones with 6 lanes. Even concrete barriers are rare.

[eemy]

I think the worst I've had to drive on is I-75 through Cincinnati. They don't have inside shoulders either, and the highway is turning all the time. My experience could have also been influenced by the fact that I was driving in very heavy traffic in pouring rain at night.

Crossing into Kentucky is a pleasure though. They have very nice road standards there.