Metro Vancouver Transit Discussion

[TransitJack]

Originally Posted by Xrayal

"SkyTrain Mark I Vehicle Refurbishment and Modernization ($55.4 million)
The original fleet of 114 SkyTrain MK-I cars was built in 1983-1985. After 25 years of service, each car has now accumulated nearly 4 million kilometres of revenue service and the fleet has reached its expected useful life of 25 years. The project involves refurbishing vehicle floors, LIM motors, electrical systems, and enhancing the interior of cars to emulate the 1300/1400 series MK-II interior. The modernization component will include smart signs from the latest MK-II, animated route maps over two of the car interior doorways, and an amber LED external destination sign on the car front. It is anticipated that the relatively poor ride quality and noise attenuation cannot be fundamentally changed when revamping the MK-I cars. Though some areas may improve slightly with better diagnosis, other significant unchanged areas of the car (trucks for example) will continue to require high maintenance. The upgraded cars will reduce capital investment requirements by extending the life of the aging MK-I fleet by 15 years (withdrawal in 2026)."

I'm surprised by the level of upgrading that is to occur on original the MK1 fleet. New electronics like LED signs, interiors similar to the new grey MKIIs.

How much did the most recent order or 48 MKII cars cost? Is upgrading the MKI fleet the smartest idea for Translink. Don't get me wrong, I'm nostalgic over these old trains, but to make such an investment and still have "high maintenance" on the unchanged portions (trucks) leaving poor ride quality and high noise levels unaltered seems somewhat silly when compared to the benefits of a newer fleet.

I wonder if they have any sketches to reflect the changes. Will they old trains get the new livery? So many questions...

[GeeCee]

Originally Posted by Xrayal

"Review feasibility to install Wi-Fi at SkyTrain stations and on WCE trains."

I get installing them on WCE trains, but at SkyTrain stations? I don't see the point. How long are you really at a station for?

[usog]

IMO what they really need to do is bolt them together into 6-car trainsets. The problem isn't just that they look and feel a bit dated, they're so damn small and cramped. Surely they'd save space and maintenance on removing all the redundant signalling and other equipment too.

[nname]

Originally Posted by TransitJack

I'm surprised by the level of upgrading that is to occur on original the MK1 fleet. New electronics like LED signs, interiors similar to the new grey MKIIs.

How much did the most recent order or 48 MKII cars cost? Is upgrading the MKI fleet the smartest idea for Translink. Don't get me wrong, I'm nostalgic over these old trains, but to make such an investment and still have "high maintenance" on the unchanged portions (trucks) leaving poor ride quality and high noise levels unaltered seems somewhat silly when compared to the benefits of a newer fleet.

I wonder if they have any sketches to reflect the changes. Will they old trains get the new livery? So many questions...

I think the trains are 3-4 millions per car, so that's about 300 millions for replacing them and maintaining the capacity.

[aberdeen5698]

Originally Posted by TransitJack

I'm surprised by the level of upgrading that is to occur on original the MK1 fleet.

55 million to buy 15 years of service for a fleet with capacity equivalent to around 100 or so MK-II cars is a bargain.

[nname]

Plus they can probably get those SRT cars from Toronto in 2015 for scrap metal price, even if we only use them for spare parts to keep the maintenance cost low. That's a fleet of another 28 cars.

In 2012, the rail division has targeted to increase its service hours 4.7 per cent compared to the 2011 target primarily due to increased service during AM and PM peaks and increased Friday and Saturday evening service levels.

That's interesting as I wasn't expecting that.

The planned 2012 service level for Canada Line is 3.4% above the original 2012 level planned back in 2010/2011 (which I think was the service set in the original agreement), and that's about 11 round-trips per day on average. That's enough to increase the peak service from 3.5min to 3min for 4 hours per day, or from 3.5min to 3.1min for 5 hours per weekday AND extend the 3.5 frequency up to almost 9pm on Friday and Saturday evening...

As for the Expo and Millennium service increase, I guess that's for peak hour based on my experience (would the train that full on Fri Sat evening with the current 3min headway?) A 3.9% increase weekday-only means 15 round-trips per day on Expo and 11 round-trips per day on the Millennium Line (if including the weekend, it would be 11 and 8 trips respectively). To add the 26 trips within the 5 hours peak period, they would need to add another 8.5 trains in service. But do they even have that many spare trains? If they put every available train in service, they can probably only add 5 to 6 trains in total...

Plus, the above assume the increase spread over a whole year. Since the improvement won't come before late April at the earliest, the amount of service increase would be even higher... It would be interesting to see what the plan really are...

[bardak]

Originally Posted by nname

The planned 2012 service level for Canada Line is 3.4% above the original 2012 level planned back in 2010/2011 (which I think was the service set in the original agreement), and that's about 11 round-trips per day on average. That's enough to increase the peak service from 3.5min to 3min for 4 hours per day, or from 3.5min to 3.1min for 5 hours per weekday AND extend the 3.5 frequency up to almost 9pm on Friday and Saturday evening...

They need to increase service during peak hours but after that I think the biggest issue service wise is the early morning and evening frequencies. The 12-20 minute headways for the branches really hurt the network during those hours.

[DKaz]

Originally Posted by bardak

They need to increase service during peak hours but after that I think the biggest issue service wise is the early morning and evening frequencies. The 12-20 minute headways for the branches really hurt the network during those hours.

The 20 minute frequencies are horrible. The airport trains are full coming from YVR even at those late hours.

[deasine]

I agree, those frequencies at the branches definitely need to be improved at night, but that doesn't necessarily mean they need to add more trains. Service should run either Waterfront to Richmond-Brighouse, with the YVR branch acting as a shuttle between the airport and Bridgeport. I don't know if there were any agreements between YVR, TransLink, and the Canada Line, and while there's a transfer involved, it will greatly benefit those using the service with a much higher frequency. Similarly, Waterfront to Richmond-Brighouse will also benefit with more trains running at a higher frequency.

[DKaz]

Quick note, they're doing a Police fare check at the West Coast Express Warerfront Station in the fare paid zone. About 5 tickets in 10 minutes out of hundreds of legit passengers. They normally do daily informal fare checks before the fare paid zone everyday.

And deasine, the one time I had to take the train I think shortly after midnight, the train leaving YVR only went as far as Bridgeport so we had to wait 15 minutes for a Waterfront train.

[deasine]

Originally Posted by DKaz

And deasine, the one time I had to take the train I think shortly after midnight, the train leaving YVR only went as far as Bridgeport so we had to wait 15 minutes for a Waterfront train.

Those ones are all destined back to the OMC, but not "shuttle" trains as I mentioned.

[Mac Write]

I wonder when the concept upgraded Mark I'd photo's will appear and when actual work will begin? Also when will the remaining Mark I's be upgraded/retired?

[TransitJack]

Does someone have a link to this 2012 plan that references increased service and the MK1 refurbishment plan, please and thanks.

[cornholio]

Originally Posted by GeeCee

I get installing them on WCE trains, but at SkyTrain stations? I don't see the point. How long are you really at a station for?

Well If they were to stick wifi on all stations and skytrains then I certainly would use transit more often as about 80% of my work is flexible and out of office and I just need a internet connection.

Makes sense to me, the more places you can stick wifi the better. It should be pretty simple to stick wifi on all skytrain cars.

[Pinion]

Originally Posted by GeeCee

I get installing them on WCE trains, but at SkyTrain stations? I don't see the point. How long are you really at a station for?

Wifi should be everywhere. In Seattle I could use free wifi nearly everywhere I went - it will be a standard expectation soon.

[deasine]

Originally Posted by Pinion

Wifi should be everywhere. In Seattle I could use free wifi nearly everywhere I went - it will be a standard expectation soon.

Well Shaw is developing this, aiming to blanket at least downtown Vancouver and periphery with free WiFi (well free for existing Shaw customers). Perhaps there can be a partnership?

But honestly though, how important is wifi on SkyTrain stations? You spend usually no more than three minutes on the platform waiting for a train anyway. On WCE trains I can sort of understand. But I don't really see the need for SkyTrain. If it gets developed, I hope it is a public-private partnership.

[GeeCee]

Originally Posted by cornholio

Well If they were to stick wifi on all stations and skytrains then I certainly would use transit more often as about 80% of my work is flexible and out of office and I just need a internet connection.

Makes sense to me, the more places you can stick wifi the better. It should be pretty simple to stick wifi on all skytrain cars.

Installing them along the route itself would make more sense from a technical perspective, rather than installing an access point on each trainset.

My point was more that installing it at only stations and not along the route would be dumb aside from late night on the Canada Line branch lines with the super low frequencies.

[racc]

Originally Posted by GeeCee

Installing them along the route itself would make more sense from a technical perspective, rather than installing an access point on each trainset.

My point was more that installing it at only stations and not along the route would be dumb aside from late night on the Canada Line branch lines with the super low frequencies.

You are forgetting that people often have to wait for buses or for rides from friends near SkyTrain stations. Not many buses have the frequency of SkyTrain.

[GeeCee]

Originally Posted by racc

You are forgetting that people often have to wait for buses or for rides from friends near SkyTrain stations. Not many buses have the frequency of SkyTrain.

Yup, good point. It'd also be good for the various retail in SkyTrain stations.

[officedweller]

From the Now:

Surrey OKs another $1.175M for heritage rail project, but says costs need to stay under control
By Amy Reid, Surrey NOW
February 7, 2012

SURREY - Surrey city council approved an additional $1.175 million for the Fraser Valley Heritage Railway Society (FVHRS) for the Heritage Rail Demonstration Project, bringing the total price tag for the city to more than $4 million.

...

Read more: http://www.thenownewspaper.com/Surrey+an...y+under/6115781/story.html#ixzz1lpEPjvJ7