Halifax Stadium Discussion

[fenwick16]

Originally Posted by the shadow warrior

Well Waye the question is are there enough CFL fans in Nova Scotia to support a team for 20 years or more ? Considering a couple of years ago the defunct Daily News (remember that newspaper, they were a 2014 Commonwealth Games bid sponsor) ran an article on the Grey Cup gathering in a pub in Halifax. A grand total of 3 people showed up. The defunct Daily News had reporters go to every bar in Halifax and no bar had anyone interested in the Grey Cup to turn the channel or get the patrons away from the swinging bells machines.

I suppose that you can't provide a weblink for a defunct newspaper to back your claim.

How do you explain that 11,500 fans packed all the available seats at SMU Stadium for a neutral site game (Touchdown Atlantic in Halifax). How do you explain that over 20,000 attended neutral site games twice in Moncton?

The fact that you like to exaggerate the stadium cost and under-estimate the fan interest indicates to me that you are just another "do nothing, oppose everything" type of person.

[the shadow warrior]

Originally Posted by fenwick16

I suppose that you can't provide a weblink for a defunct newspaper to back your claim.

How do you explain that 11,500 fans packed all the available seats at SMU Stadium for a neutral site game (Touchdown Atlantic in Halifax). How do you explain that over 20,000 attended neutral site games twice in Moncton?

The fact that you like to exaggerate the stadium cost and under-estimate the fan interest indicates to me that you are just another "do nothing, oppose everything" type of person.

No I oppose throwing future generations over a cliff for juvenile pursuits while we are the most in debt territory per capita in the America's . Somewhere between 60 million and 180 million lays the true cost of a stadium of this type in the HRM to host Fifa. Exaggerate the Price ? It is better clear in Black and White what the cost is for being lead by the nose by Fifa. If there is such a great case for a stadium in Halifax please explain why both Beazley Field and Huskies Stadium have fallen so far into disrepair that Building inspections had to close portions of those small facilities ? I would say apparently the support is lacking for ST Mary Alumni for Huskie Stadium because the case in the US for a similar stadium in the NCAA would have that stadium at 40000 seats built up over stages from 1969.

There is a Rugby Club in Halifax that travels to play teams in other Maritimes Cities. Do you know where they play in the HRM ? What are their name ? ever once attend a game ? How many people were there ? I bet the players out numbered the spectators .

[Jstaleness]

From cbc.ca/ns

Halifax regional council has agreed to spend up to $20 million for a stadium, though some councillors doubt they can find partners to pay the other $40 million.

Halifax needs a stadium to qualify as one of the host cities for the FIFA Women's World Cup in 2015. A new facility could cost $60 million.

After a long debate Tuesday, council set aside $20 million and instructed staff to search for funding partners.

Coun. Dawn Sloane said the municipality has to step up. "Why would you go to someone and say, 'How would you like to fund a stadium? And they say what's your input to this, and you say, 'nothing,'" Sloane said.

Coun. Barry Dalrymple pointed out that the municipality doesn't have to spend the $20 million if it cannot find partners.

"This is a once in a 10- or 20-year opportunity. It's something this municipality desperately needs for so many reasons. And there's no question if at the end of the day the costs don't work … the costs don't work. But we will never know that until we finish this process," he said.

Premier Darrell Dexter has already said the province cannot commit to a stadium. He said there are other priorities, including the Lower Churchill hydroelectric project and possibly a new convention centre.

Coun. Gloria McCluskey doubts the funding partners are out there.

"Maybe [the province] is smarter than we are. They've said they can't afford it. I say we can't afford it," she said.

There is still no word on the design of the stadium, where it would be located or how much it would cost to run. A final study is expected to be completed by December, when council must make its decision to meet the FIFA deadline.

McCluskey isn't convinced there's enough time.

"We're going to find ourselves in December with a report in front of us without all the answers, and there's going to be a panic to pass it," she said.




* One thing that I noticed in that was the "possibly a new convention centre" comment.

[q12]

Originally Posted by the shadow warrior

No I oppose throwing future generations over a cliff for juvenile pursuits while we are the most in debt territory per capita in the America's . Somewhere between 60 million and 180 million lays the true cost of a stadium of this type in the HRM to host Fifa. Exaggerate the Price ? It is better clear in Black and White what the cost is for being lead by the nose by Fifa. If there is such a great case for a stadium in Halifax please explain why both Beazley Field and Huskies Stadium have fallen so far into disrepair that Building inspections had to close portions of those small facilities ? I would say apparently the support is lacking for ST Mary Alumni for Huskie Stadium because the case in the US for a similar stadium in the NCAA would have that stadium at 40000 seats built up over stages from 1969.

I hope the thunderous applause for Halifax winning the shipbuilding contract will drown out these annoying naysayers.

One of the things I hear from many people who have moved out west for work is that the one thing they really enjoy is being able to go to a real pro sports game.

The city is set for a boom, and it needs basic infrastructure like a stadium to help attract and keep talent here.

There is a Rugby Club in Halifax that travels to play teams in other Maritimes Cities. Do you know where they play in the HRM ? What are their name ? ever once attend a game ? How many people were there ? I bet the players out numbered the spectators .

What the fuck does the Rugby club have to do with the stadium? We have been talking about soccer and football. Nice try.

What about the lawn bowling club in Dartmouth? I heard they don't pack that place like they use to. It would be great to go to a lawn bowling game in a 25,000 seat stadium.

[Empire]

Originally Posted by the shadow warrior

No I oppose throwing future generations over a cliff for juvenile pursuits while we are the most in debt territory per capita in the America's . Somewhere between 60 million and 180 million lays the true cost of a stadium of this type in the HRM to host Fifa. Exaggerate the Price ? It is better clear in Black and White what the cost is for being lead by the nose by Fifa. If there is such a great case for a stadium in Halifax please explain why both Beazley Field and Huskies Stadium have fallen so far into disrepair that Building inspections had to close portions of those small facilities ? I would say apparently the support is lacking for ST Mary Alumni for Huskie Stadium because the case in the US for a similar stadium in the NCAA would have that stadium at 40000 seats built up over stages from 1969.

There is a Rugby Club in Halifax that travels to play teams in other Maritimes Cities. Do you know where they play in the HRM ? What are their name ? ever once attend a game ? How many people were there ? I bet the players out numbered the spectators .

Shadow, you are just another whining, cry baby, if it isn't for me it's no good negative drain. You are very typical of the tax paying crowd who says we need tax $$ for sidewalks, pot holes and everything else in my neighbourhood. Nova Scotia is in debt because we don't have the get up and go to make things happen. We receive $$$$$$$ in transfer payments from the feds and that little tax handout is gaining opposition yearly. So for you to say spend tax $$$ on the obvious means you cannot think outside the box. We need to demonstrate that we are willing to take some calculated risks to generate interest in our region so that at some point we retain people and attract people to foot the tax bill when the transfers run out.

[the shadow warrior]

Originally Posted by q12

I hope the thunderous applause for Halifax winning the shipbuilding contract will drown out these annoying naysayers.

One of the things I hear from many people who have moved out west for work is that the one thing they really enjoy is being able to go to a real pro sports game.

The city is set for a boom, and it needs basic infrastructure like a stadium to help attract and keep talent here.



What the fuck does the Rugby club have to do with the stadium? We have been talking about soccer and football. Nice try.

What about the lawn bowling club in Dartmouth? I heard they don't pack that place like they use to. It would be great to go to a lawn bowling game in a 25,000 seat stadium.

well here is the point , Moncton regularly has 5000 spectators for High School Football. St John's Newfoundland has huge crowds for Rugby at their 6500 seat rugby facility. Halifax is not a sports town and hence why it is much more likely that the CFL will locate in Moncton before Halifax regardless if there is a stadium in Halifax or not. Council in the HRM will get cold feet and Abandon this round of lets get a stadium simply because they will be faced with no Federal Money per Stephen Harper's policy of not funding CFL Stadiums or NHL type hockey arenas.

Remember Harper is an economist who is cutting 250 million away from the department of veterans affairs.

[q12]

Originally Posted by the shadow warrior

Halifax is not a sports town and hence why it is much more likely that the CFL will locate in Moncton before Halifax regardless if there is a stadium in Halifax or not.

You make it too easy too prove you arguments are wrong. Halifax has been a league leader in attendance in the QMJHL since it joined the league. The Halifax Rainmen have had great attendance for minor league basketball. Huskies stadium is falling apart so if they had a decent place to play attendance would be higher.

How about Halifax's attendance record with the World Juniors, World Men's, World's Women's Hockey tournaments?

Council in the HRM will get cold feet and Abandon this round of lets get a stadium simply because they will be faced with no Federal Money per Stephen Harper's policy of not funding CFL Stadiums or NHL type hockey arenas. .

Well if that's the case then how would Moncton get any federal funding to upgrade their stadium to CFL standards. You're a walking contradiction.

[the shadow warrior]

Originally Posted by Empire

Shadow, you are just another whining, cry baby, if it isn't for me it's no good negative drain. You are very typical of the tax paying crowd who says we need tax $$ for sidewalks, pot holes and everything else in my neighbourhood. Nova Scotia is in debt because we don't have the get up and go to make things happen. We receive $$$$$$$ in transfer payments from the feds and that little tax handout is gaining opposition yearly. So for you to say spend tax $$$ on the obvious means you cannot think outside the box. We need to demonstrate that we are willing to take some calculated risks to generate interest in our region so that at some point we retain people and attract people to foot the tax bill when the transfers run out.

The Province is in such huge debt because we have bought into business cases as the Bank of First, last and only resort for Sven Galis. From the World Trade and Convention Centre to Sydney Steel and practically everything else have had rosey business cases presented to only turn out to be false. The steering committee on the stadium has identified a 450,000 dollar a year operational short fall. They don't account for interest on the money borrowed to create the White Elephant in the first place.

Calculated Risks are for private companies to take not taxpayers whom the majority will not step foot in a stadium. 70 senior citizens at Farrell Hall is not the future of a CFL franchise in the HRM.

[q12]

Originally Posted by the shadow warrior

Calculated Risks are for private companies to take not taxpayers whom the majority will not step foot in a stadium. 70 senior citizens at Farrell Hall is not the future of a CFL franchise in the HRM.

Actually more like calculated risks are for cities that are successful at attracting people with talent.

There are so many senior citizens in Nova Scotia because we have been too chicken shit to take a risk that would bring rewards like attracting young people (taxpayers) to Halifax.

[Jstaleness]

Originally Posted by q12

You make it too easy too prove you arguments are wrong. Halifax has been a league leader in attendance in the QMJHL since it joined the league. The Halifax Rainmen have had great attendance for minor league basketball. Huskies stadium is falling apart so if they had a decent place to play attendance would be higher.

How about Halifax's attendance record with the World Juniors, World Men's, World's Women's Hockey tournaments?



Well if that's the case then how would Moncton get any federal funding to upgrade their stadium to CFL standards. You're a walking contradiction.

You spoke the exact words that I was going to reply with. Shadow had already lost most credibility but that last comment just pushed the shadow over the edge. Hard to see the light when your attitude is cast in shadows I guess.

[the shadow warrior]

Originally Posted by q12

You make it too easy too prove you arguments are wrong. Halifax has been a league leader in attendance in the QMJHL since it joined the league. The Halifax Rainmen have had great attendance for minor league basketball. Huskies stadium is falling apart so if they had a decent place to play attendance would be higher.

How about Halifax's attendance record with the World Juniors, World Men's, World's Women's Hockey tournaments?



Well if that's the case then how would Moncton get any federal funding to upgrade their stadium to CFL standards. You're a walking contradiction.

No I think like most things surrounding Moncton their highly successful track record would attract the Irvings to table which has been the case with things in the past. Halifax has a 40 million dollar HRm taxpayer bill for the new quad surface while Moncton does a similar facility with Private money completely. Who does Halifax have ? Certainly not Sobeys. Sobeys got done over hard by the city with the one dollar a year lease to Costco in the Chain Lake Park. Meanwhile Crombie Reit one of the largest property owners in the HRM pays huge taxes . The absence of Sobeys or the Shaw group from naming rights for a Metro Centre seems to show the value of events marketing in the HRM or the lack of business savy in the HRM. Sobeys in their hometown county lobbied and received federal , provincial and municipal funding for a 32 million dollar Arena/ Aquatics centre that is being built now. Sobeys donated one million dollars and the land worth 3.5 million. Private enterprise in Pictou County has ponied up over 6 million of the 32 million.

Huskie Stadium is falling apart simply because the activities on the field of play don't pay for maintenance. Multiple that number of seats by 5 times and you have five times the problem in a Stadium without a paying tenent. Stadiums and Arena's dont exist in a vacuum they are costly and like the female councilor said last night . They take away money from other forms of entertainment in the region.

[q12]

Originally Posted by Jstaleness

You spoke the exact words that I was going to reply with. Shadow had already lost most credibility but that last comment just pushed the shadow over the edge. Hard to see the light when your attitude is cast in shadows I guess.

And J, I forgot about the estimated 70,000 who turned up for Crosby's Stanley Cup Parade.

[the shadow warrior]

Originally Posted by q12

Actually more like calculated risks are for cities that are successful at attracting people with talent.

There are so many senior citizens in Nova Scotia because we have been too chicken shit to take a risk that would bring rewards like attracting young people (taxpayers) to Halifax.

Well where were the youth on the two public meeting nights ? They were texting from their bedrooms , surfing the internet , going to the mall, and many other things then thinking of building a Stadium without any business case. The province of Nova Scotia has no capital to risk on holes in the ground without tenents.

[q12]

Originally Posted by the shadow warrior

No I think like most things surrounding Moncton their highly successful track record would attract the Irvings to table which has been the case with things in the past. Halifax has a 40 million dollar HRm taxpayer bill for the new quad surface while Moncton does a similar facility with Private money completely. Who does Halifax have ? Certainly not Sobeys. Sobeys got done over hard by the city with the one dollar a year lease to Costco in the Chain Lake Park. Meanwhile Crombie Reit one of the largest property owners in the HRM pays huge taxes . The absence of Sobeys or the Shaw group from naming rights for a Metro Centre seems to show the value of events marketing in the HRM or the lack of business savy in the HRM. Sobeys in their hometown county lobbied and received federal , provincial and municipal funding for a 32 million dollar Arena/ Aquatics centre that is being built now. Sobeys donated one million dollars and the land worth 3.5 million. Private enterprise in Pictou County has ponied up over 6 million of the 32 million.

Huskie Stadium is falling apart simply because the activities on the field of play don't pay for maintenance. Multiple that number of seats by 5 times and you have five times the problem in a Stadium without a paying tenent. Stadiums and Arena's dont exist in a vacuum they are costly and like the female councilor said last night . They take away money from other forms of entertainment in the region.

Who wants to guess which special interest group this shadow is from?

Heritage Trust?
Save the View?
Canadian Taxpayers Federation?
or maybe that new group...
People who Complain about Everything Progressive.

[halifaxboyns]

Originally Posted by the shadow warrior

Well where were the youth on the two public meeting nights ? They were texting from their bedrooms , surfing the internet , going to the mall, and many other things then thinking of building a Stadium without any business case. The province of Nova Scotia has no capital to risk on holes in the ground without tenents.

There were young people at the meetings - well at least the second meeting, I didn't watch the first one.

Youth are too intimidated by the public specticle of public hearings, I've been doing them for years. They might come and observe, but few are willing to speak because they don't think they will be taken seriously - which is a shame because if they only realized how powerful their voices are, they'd speak and be heard.

[the shadow warrior]

Originally Posted by q12

And J, I forgot about the estimated 70,000 who turned up for Crosby's Stanley Cup Parade.

WOW wee WOW wee Borat replies. How many people paid for a free spot on the sidewalk for that one? so did we double our money with the Brad Marchant Stanley Cup parade ? Gosh I heard Harold Mackay ran to the mayor for funding the parade

[q12]

Originally Posted by the shadow warrior

Well where were the youth on the two public meeting nights ?

They were in Toronto, Montreal, Ottawa, Edmonton, Calgary or Vancouver watching an NHL game.

And the rest were at the Halifax Mooseheads game.

And there was young people in attendance. Did you take a poll at the beginning to find out everyone's age? Did they advertise the meetings at Dal and SMU, or at high schools? Probably not.

[TheNovaScotian]

I respect your right to have an opinion and your right to express it, but as the same with many people, if you want to present it as fact than i would love to see the evidence that backs it......Oh wait you don't have any so really all you have is just some grip about other failed economic policies and because they involve public money they're all the same?? And are doomed to fail?
Halifax is one of the better cities in the country to hold large scale events that why the Commonwealth games bid was awarded to us and we turned it down. A international body that's sole purpose is to figure out if a city can handle LARGE scale sports events awarded it to us over Mumbai, but no we shouldn't build a sensible sized stadium to accommodate 25 000 of our 400 000 or the 1.5 million within 6 hours proximity, because the heavy water plant was a bust, that makes perfect sense to me.
I am 26 and missed the meetings because I had a lecture to attend and work the 2 other days, I was excited to see that some of the older generation that owes a bit of sensible action to the younger generation because Yes, the list goes on of failed projects that have saddled US, the younger generation with such a large debt but that doesn't mean we close up shop and count our pennies, it means we need to be more ambitious and more innovative to create the wealth needed to pay it back not austerity.

[halifaxboyns]

Originally Posted by TheNovaScotian

I respect your right to have an opinion and your right to express it, but as the same with many people, if you want to present it as fact than i would love to see the evidence that backs it......Oh wait you don't have any so really all you have is just some grip about other failed economic policies and because they involve public money they're all the same?? And are doomed to fail?
Halifax is one of the better cities in the country to hold large scale events that why the Commonwealth games bid was awarded to us and we turned it down. A international body that's sole purpose is to figure out if a city can handle LARGE scale sports events awarded it to us over Mumbai, but no we shouldn't build a sensible sized stadium to accommodate 25 000 of our 400 000 or the 1.5 million within 6 hours proximity, because the heavy water plant was a bust, that makes perfect sense to me.
I am 26 and missed the meetings, I was excited to see that some of the older generation that owes a bit of sensible action to the younger generation because Yes, the list goes on of failed projects that have saddled US, the younger generation with such a large debt but that doesn't mean we close up shop and count our pennies, it means we need to be more ambitious and more innovative to create the wealth needed to pay it back not austerity.

Well said.

[the shadow warrior]

Originally Posted by TheNovaScotian

I respect your right to have an opinion and your right to express it, but as the same with many people, if you want to present it as fact than i would love to see the evidence that backs it......Oh wait you don't have any so really all you have is just some grip about other failed economic policies and because they involve public money they're all the same?? And are doomed to fail?
Halifax is one of the better cities in the country to hold large scale events that why the Commonwealth games bid was awarded to us and we turned it down. A international body that's sole purpose is to figure out if a city can handle LARGE scale sports events awarded it to us over Mumbai, but no we shouldn't build a sensible sized stadium to accommodate 25 000 of our 400 000 or the 1.5 million within 6 hours proximity, because the heavy water plant was a bust, that makes perfect sense to me.
I am 26 and missed the meetings, I was excited to see that some of the older generation that owes a bit of sensible action to the younger generation because Yes, the list goes on of failed projects that have saddled US, the younger generation with such a large debt but that doesn't mean we close up shop and count our pennies, it means we need to be more ambitious and more innovative to create the wealth needed to pay it back not austerity.

Well first of all the 2014 commonwealth games domestic bid was awarded to Halifax simply from the standpoint of Paul Martin interfering in the process to have the weakest Candidate City that he knew would fail in the vote. Paul Martin favored Africa hosting. Paul Martin's plan of limiting possible liability of actually having to host a ten to one money loser in the commonwealth games worked to perfection. Stephen Harper then picked up the ball and deep sixed Halifax YEAH high five