YVR Airport & Sea Island Developments Discussion - Page 186

Bigtime · #**3701** Posted **Sep 28, 2011, 6:02 PM**

Emirates has announced service to Seattle starting in March. Could this be a way to get at the YVR market while they continue to fight with the government?

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-09-28...h-seattle-dallas-flights.html?cmpid=yhoo

Gordon · #**3702** Posted **Sep 28, 2011, 6:04 PM**

It was announced today that Emirates will start flying between SEA and Dubai
April 2012

main reason Ottawa's protection of Air Canada.

Thanks Ottawa

vanlaw · #**3703** Posted **Sep 28, 2011, 6:21 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bigtime

Emirates has announced service to Seattle starting in March. Could this be a way to get at the YVR market while they continue to fight with the government?

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-09-28...h-seattle-dallas-flights.html?cmpid=yhoo

That is good news! Hopefully they have some of the same seat sale prices they offer out of Tornto frotime to time, which are great fares sometimes.

Long flight though. I think their SF and LA flights come in at around 17 hours going there. Anyone know which way they fly from the West Coast - i.e. Eastward over US/Europe or Westward over Asia? I think it is probably almost a wash distance wise.

Bigtime · #**3704** Posted **Sep 28, 2011, 6:23 PM**

Looks like they fly over the Atlantic on these flights to/from the west coast.

Example, LAX-DXB: http://flightaware.com/live/flight/UAE216/history/20110928/2345Z/KLAX/OMDB

twoNeurons · #**3705** Posted **Sep 28, 2011, 7:18 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by vanlaw

That is good news! Hopefully they have some of the same seat sale prices they offer out of Tornto frotime to time, which are great fares sometimes.

Long flight though. I think their SF and LA flights come in at around 17 hours going there. Anyone know which way they fly from the West Coast - i.e. Eastward over US/Europe or Westward over Asia? I think it is probably almost a wash distance wise.

It would be "gooder" news if we could take the same flight out of YVR.

vanlaw · #**3706** Posted **Sep 28, 2011, 8:23 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by twoNeurons

It would be "gooder" news if we could take the same flight out of YVR.

Of course, and hopefully we will see that one day. But at least Seattle is a drivable as opposed to hititng SF of LA flights that Alaska currently connects with which by the time you factor in time and cost you might as fly to YYZ and catch the flight from there.

Jebby · #**3707** Posted **Sep 28, 2011, 8:47 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by vanlaw

That is good news! Hopefully they have some of the same seat sale prices they offer out of Tornto frotime to time, which are great fares sometimes.

Emirates has amazing offers sometimes. I got Zürich-Dubai-Kuala Lumpur round trip with a 5 day layover in Dubai on the outbound trip (to do some shopping

) for €1600...Business Class!

trofirhen · #**3708** Posted **Sep 28, 2011, 10:02 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gordon

It was announced today that Emirates will start flying between SEA and Dubai
April 2012

main reason Ottawa's protection of Air Canada.

Thanks Ottawa

Yes, thanks Ottawa! You do a wonderful job of protecting and promotong the economy of Ontario (.....oops, I meant Canada)

trofirhen · #**3709** Posted **Sep 28, 2011, 10:06 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bigtime

Emirates has announced service to Seattle starting in March. Could this be a way to get at the YVR market while they continue to fight with the government?

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-09-28...h-seattle-dallas-flights.html?cmpid=yhoo

The article does not mention Canada. I think Emirates would like to fly to Seattle anyway, which a a more important overall size and economy than Vancouver. I do not know if they are in fact interested in Calagary, with the oil connection. Any ideas on that one?

Bigtime · #**3710** Posted **Sep 28, 2011, 10:10 PM**

I still believe that EK is really not that interested in serving YYC, they just kept dangling that carrot to try and get the frequencies into Canada so they could serve YYZ daily (and probably add YVR and YUL).

Even if they did serve YYC I think it would easily cannibalize the many options we already have (AC, LH, BA, KL) to get almost anywhere in the world with one stop in a super-hub (LHR, FRA, AMS, NRT).

vanlaw · #**3711** Posted **Sep 28, 2011, 10:36 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by galeforcewinds

Emirates has amazing offers sometimes. I got Zürich-Dubai-Kuala Lumpur round trip with a 5 day layover in Dubai on the outbound trip (to do some shopping

) for €1600...Business Class!

That is unreal for business. A couple of years ago I managed to book Toronto-Dubai-Mumbai with a 4 day layover in Dubai and then open jaw flying back from Trivandrum(south India)-Dubai-Toronto for $1350 CAD in economy, which was still far cheaper than connections through Europe. I flew to Toronto on aeroplan points, so was a very good deal.

I still check from time to time and they seem to offer the better deals on onward connections - i.e. it is cheaper to fly to Mumbai or other cities through Dubai than to just fly to Dubai.

Another perk that they don’t really advertise is their long layover policy. Even if you are in economy, if your layover is more than 8 hours, less than 24 and your flight is the next one to your destination, they will shuttle you to a hotel, give you a free room and food vouchers for the buffet (not great, but at least its free) and get you back for your flight. If in business the arrangement is far better.

Hourglass · #**3712** Posted **Sep 29, 2011, 8:46 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by vanlaw

That is good news! Hopefully they have some of the same seat sale prices they offer out of Tornto frotime to time, which are great fares sometimes.

Good news for consumers, bad news for YVR and other airport-related businesses and services. According to the YVR website, one daily international flight creates about 186 person-years of direct employment. So the SEA flight offers more options for consumers but without the spin-off benefits a direct flight would bring.

trofirhen · #**3713** Posted **Sep 29, 2011, 11:28 AM**

Does anyone really think that allowing Emirates into Vancouver (which won't happen anyway) would 🞵🞵🞵🞵 the lifeblood out of our destinations in Europe and East Asia?

Hardly. Dubai is on the other side of the world, a much longer flight from Vancouver to, say, Athens or Rome, but a great gateway to Africa.

People are trying to hold their breath until long-range jets can fly from YVR to Airports in India, which probably won't be for years anyway, and are afraid Emirates would seize onto that market.

Emirates to Dubai would be great for Africa, and some other Middle Eastern destinations.

How it is perceived as a threat to Air Canada escapes me. Other more enlightened members will explain, I am sure.

Bigtime · #**3714** Posted **Sep 29, 2011, 12:47 PM**

An interesting tweet I just caught this morning:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brent Jang's Twitter

WestJet signs new interline pact. Outbound fliers can connect to #Emirates thru #WestJet, "travelling to Dubai and beyond."

And the news release:

http://www.newswire.ca/en/releases/archi...tm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

vanlaw · #**3715** Posted **Sep 29, 2011, 4:14 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hourglass

Good news for consumers, bad news for YVR and other airport-related businesses and services. According to the YVR website, one daily international flight creates about 186 person-years of direct employment. So the SEA flight offers more options for consumers but without the spin-off benefits a direct flight would bring.

The SEA-DXB flight targets a fairly specific market though in terms of where people are travelling. It wont have much of an impact on YVR's Asia and Europe bound flights with perhaps the exception of those who transit through Europe on their way to the ME or Africa. However, given the relatively small number of Europe bound flights YVR has, and they fact they seem to generally run fairly full (just my own impression), I don’t think it is an issue.

Having said that, perhaps it is some incentive for YVR and other airport authorities to start putting some pressure on the fed'l gov't to deal with this BS issue, if they aren't already.

I just like it for my own self-serving reasons - trying to get a job in the ME and it would make travel back and forth a little easier, and also have family in the region, so better options for them coming home in the summer. I despise having to transit through YYZ or YUL when heading east to Europe or beyond. I'd rather hop the puddle jumper to SEA and get on the 16 hour flight as opposed to 4 1/2-5hr to YYZ and still a 13-15 hour flight.

Hourglass · #**3716** Posted **Sep 29, 2011, 5:37 PM**

Yes, this will definitely be an option for people traveling to MEA as well as South Asia.

It IS a BS issue -- although I know Air Canada apologists here will disagree. More choice is almost always a good thing for consumers. Transport Canada's stated position is to try to negotiate rights for direct traffic, arguing that airlines such as Singapore and Emirates are gunning for transfer traffic since they can't support a non-stop. True. And this is no different than what Air Canada does in conjunction with Lufthansa to hub ME and South Asian traffic via Frankfurt.

The problem is compounded by the fact than in many ways Air Canada still behaves like a monopoly. All one has to do is look at the whole saga with Toronto Island Airport. Air Canada basically left YTZ to rot while focusing on building up YYZ -- that is, until Porter Airlines came in and was hugely successful. Suddenly, Air Canada is banging on the door, demanding to be let into YTZ again.

With more competition at YVR, my belief is that Air Canada would respond to defend its market share, resulting in more flights and better connections.

I'm sure YVR has been putting pressure on the Federal Gov't. I'm just not overly optimistic the situation is going to change anytime soon.

MalcolmTucker · #**3717** Posted **Sep 29, 2011, 5:58 PM**

More choice is almost always a good thing for consumers. - Yes.

But is it in the national interest at all times? No.

jlousa · #**3718** Posted **Sep 29, 2011, 6:00 PM**

Don't think it's apologist when Emirates have a unfair competive advantage. France and the UK certainly aren't protecting Air Canada but are having the same issues with Emirates. I'm the last one for protectionist measures, but feel the government of Canada is taking the right approach with them.

trofirhen · #**3719** Posted **Sep 29, 2011, 6:14 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by jlousa

Don't think it's apologist when Emirates have a unfair competive advantage. France and the UK certainly aren't protecting Air Canada but are having the same issues with Emirates. I'm the last one for protectionist measures, but feel the government of Canada is taking the right approach with them.

Could you possibly detail this unfair competitive advantage that EMIRATES has? I'm not clear on exactly what it is and how it works against Canada. Thank you.

jlousa · #**3720** Posted **Sep 29, 2011, 6:53 PM**

It's been discussed in this very thread before, you can look there or google it. It's big news in France as well so it should be easily available. Boils down to Dubai subsidizing Emirates in order to turn Dubai into a global hub and feed the hotel/restuarant and rest of the city. Recommend you do some research on it as it's heavily documented and have been numerous stories all over the globe about it. Certainly not a Canada-only issue.