NEW YORK | One World Trade Center | 1,776' Pinnacle / 1,373' Roof | 108 FLOORS

[Don098]

It's hard to be self-centered when tons of people would agree with us if they knew the issue. This building is in a public space, and the imagery of smoke/steam/whatever coming out of those vents will be HIGHLY visible during winter and reminiscent of the imagery associated with the 911 attacks on the twin towers. It will be an eyesore for the millions of people that come to visit the site every year, the people in WTC7, the Verizon Building, and the people directly above the vents in WTC1. It's not what the architect intended, it's not what Silverstein imagined, and it's not what the Port Authority wanted. None of this would be an issue if it weren't for a FEW bitchy top execs or lawyers in the negotiating room.

In other words, millions or people (likely) > a few powerful people. I think it's pretty easy to see what would be considered self-centered in this circumstance.

And yes, there will be endless pictures of the vents on this forum to get an idea about it's impact. Let me put it to you this way: If you bought a brand new car and someone scratched it's side in the parking lot, my bet is that you'd be pretty pissed off, especially if you met the perpetrator and they were like "oh yea, sorry about that. I know you spent $30,000 on this car, but I just didn't want to reposition my car so that I had enough room to get out, so I just opened the door and figured you wouldn't care 'cause it's just a little scratch right? Get a grip"

Don't downplay the aesthetics. Especially on an architectural forum.

[JoePDX]

Originally Posted by Don098

It's hard to be self-centered when tons of people would agree with us if they knew the issue. This building is in a public space, and the imagery of smoke/steam/whatever coming out of those vents will be HIGHLY visible during winter and reminiscent of the imagery associated with the 911 attacks on the twin towers. It will be an eyesore for the millions of people that come to visit the site every year, the people in WTC7, the Verizon Building, and the people directly above the vents in WTC1. It's not what the architect intended, it's not what Silverstein imagined, and it's not what the Port Authority wanted. None of this would be an issue if it weren't for a FEW bitchy top execs or lawyers in the negotiating room.

In other words, millions or people (likely) > a few powerful people. I think it's pretty easy to see what would be considered self-centered in this circumstance.

And yes, there will be endless pictures of the vents on this forum to get an idea about it's impact. If you bought a brand new car and someone scratched it's side in the parking lot, my bet is that you'd be pretty pissed off, especially if you met the perpetrator and they were like "oh yea, sorry about that. I know you spent $30,000 on this car, but I just didn't want to reposition my car so that I had enough room to get out, so I just opened the door and figured you wouldn't care 'cause it's just a little scratch right?" Don't downplay the aesthetics.

Its not even built or functioning yet and yet you are obsessing over what it "might" look like? Its a public building? Last time I checked it was trying to get tenants to RENT out space. Doesn't sound public to me. I think the public space would only encompass the memorial park. Yeah. smokes gonna come "billowing" out and 9/11 family members will go into shock and faint out right on the memorial plaza from the impact it has on them. LOL (Sitting waiting for horrific rendering of smoke billowing out of vents...anyone?)

[Don098]

Originally Posted by JoePDX

Its not even built or functioning yet and yet you are obsessing over what it "might" look like? Its a public building? Last time I checked it was trying to get tenants to RENT out space. Doesn't sound public to me. I think the public space would only encompass the memorial park. Yeah. smokes gonna come "billowing" out and 9/11 family members will go into shock and faint out right on the memorial plaza from the impact it has on them. LOL

1) This is what I wrote verbatim: "This building is in a public space". That's a whooooole lot different than saying the building itself is public. The cityscape is a public space. That's why we have zoning laws and things of that nature.

2) I never said billowing, so don't use quotation marks as if you're quoting me. Don't be sarcastic. The images of the towers burning are some of the most unforgettable images to New Yorkers and Americans of the 21st century. People don't forget violent and emotional images, and smoke coming directly out of an otherwise uninterrupted facade horizontally is not much of a stretch in recalling those 911 images... My point is that it COULD end up looking SIMILAR, that's all. You're putting words in my mouth, and that's not appreciated.

_______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Is it even legal for Conde to build their own flu in order to circumvent mandated inspections? How would this new flu NOT be subject to the same inspections? And if there's a loophole in the law, why haven't tons of skyscrapers encountered the same issue in NYC?

[JoePDX]

Originally Posted by Don098

1) This is what I wrote verbatim: "This building is in a public space"...you need to work on your reading comprehension.

2) I never said billowing, so don't use quotation marks as if you're quoting me. Don't be sarcastic. The images of the towers burning are some of the most unforgettable images to New Yorkers and Americans of the 21st century. People don't forget violent and emotional images, and smoke coming directly out of an otherwise uninterrupted facade horizontally is not much of a stretch in recalling those 911 images...

I don't think its IN a public space. SURROUNDED by maybe. So check your grammatic sentence building skills. The quotation marks were not meant to quote you, sorry. Just to convey exaggeration. I guess I used them incorrectly. I think it was in a post previously.

[Don098]

Originally Posted by JoePDX

I don't think its IN a public space. SURROUNDED by maybe. So check your grammatical sentence building skills. The quotation marks were not meant to quote you, sorry. Just to convey exaggeration. I guess I used them incorrectly. I think it was in a post previously.

Word choice is an element style, not grammar, and "in" and "surrounded by" are exactly the same thing. This is the definition of in: "used to indicate inclusion within space" from dictionary.com. Please... stop doing this.

[JoePDX]

Originally Posted by Don098

Word choice is an element style, not grammar, and "in" and "surrounded by" are exactly the same thing. This is the definition of in: "used to indicate inclusion within space" from dictionary.com

Well you know what i mean. The land that tower one is on is not public.

[Fishman92]

But the view is. This is a memorial. And the general opinion is that the memorial is being defaced. Sorted?

[Tall guy 31]

Originally Posted by Fishman92

But the view is. This is a memorial. And the general opinion is that the memorial is being defaced. Sorted?

In my opinion...this is NOT a memorial. It's going to be a office building that generates billions of billions of income over years. Though, I agree..they should not be allowed to have a vent that produces steam/smoke. But Conde signed a 2 billion dollar lease. We allllll know that money talks & bull$hit walks.

[The Grand Architect]

The P.A should stand up for themselves, like Don098 said.

Conde Nast shouldn't come to a P.A owned Tower and tell the P.A what to do. Instead it should be the other way around. The P.A should tell Conde Nast that if they shall install a vent, they will kick em' all out. Simple.

[Kanto]

Originally Posted by Fishman92

I completely agree.

Me too. 1WTC is a memorial and also an architectural masterpiece. Definitely nothing that should have a hole in itself

[JayPro]

Originally Posted by The Grand Architect

The P.A should stand up for themselves, like Don098 said.

Conde Nast shouldn't come to a P.A owned Tower and tell the P.A what to do. Instead it should be the other way around. The P.A should tell Conde Nast that if they shall install a vent, they will kick em' all out. Simple.

So does that mean that they lose WTC's anchor tenant and the search begins anew and indefinitely?

Yes, this whole dustup could've been handled much more diplomatically. There have to be some concessions between two extremes. Do you allow your signature building's prime occupant to unilaterally decide the terms of its lease? Or do you take an inordinately heavy-handed approach that alienates the very people and businesses you're trying to reel in?

The first instance is where CN definitely could have been more gracious. Remember, though, that the PA--while rightly perceived in this matter as perhaps a bit too acquiescent--has to keep in mind who they're dealing with. If they lose this sort of client over a silly engineering technicality, their detractors---and there seem to be a busload of them---will have a field day.

[NYYskyline]

this played with my eyes; I was like wow this is one wide building

[uakoops]

Hey everyone lighten up. The vent will be on the north side and will NOT be visible from the Memorial Plaza.
BTW I wonder if under certain weather conditions there will be visible steam from the cooling towers on the roof.

[meh_cd]

Originally Posted by uakoops

Hey everyone lighten up. The vent will be on the north side and will NOT be visible from the Memorial Plaza.
BTW I wonder if under certain weather conditions there will be visible steam from the cooling towers on the roof.

I'm kind of hoping they install some kind of LED lighting system on the mechanical floors in the 90s. Something like the setbacks at the ESB so that they can have three colors in varying patterns. That combined with the spire would look great.

[Kanto]

Originally Posted by meh_cd

I'm kind of hoping they install some kind of LED lighting system on the mechanical floors in the 90s. Something like the setbacks at the ESB so that they can have three colors in varying patterns. That combined with the spire would look great.

Yeah, this would be nice

[animatedmartian]

Shiny Things


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[Kiev252]

Taken last Friday from 35th floor in 1 Liberty Plaza. Notice tower 4 is almost as tall.

[Traynor]

I posed this idea/question over at SSC:

Seeing as the glass floats above the stainless steel at the corners anyway... Couldn't the Conde Natsty vents be directed to one of the corners? Using a narrow floor to ceiling vent hidden behind the lip of the glass, there could be four spots where the exhaust could be vented without changing the look of the facade at all.

And if that is not enough cubic footage of venting, then duct it to the Northeast and Northwest corners and you get twice the openings (8 in total) all without changing the look of the tower.

[Troubadour]

The vaporous grease that would linger around the tower could be named "Freedom Fog," and the pigeons would grow obese licking it off the windows.

[Fishman92]

Originally Posted by Traynor

I posed this idea/question over at SSC:

Seeing as the glass floats above the stainless steel at the corners anyway... Couldn't the Conde Natsty vents be directed to one of the corners? Using a narrow floor to ceiling vent hidden behind the lip of the glass, there could be four spots where the exhaust could be vented without changing the look of the facade at all.

And if that is not enough cubic footage of venting, then duct it to the Northeast and Northwest corners and you get twice the openings (8 in total) all without changing the look of the tower.

I, to be fair, think this is the only feasible option. Hide it, hide it, HIDE IT.
Conde Nasty.