Calgary Public Transit II

[DarkKeyo]

Originally Posted by fusili

Some sort of people mover connecting Children's Hospital, Foothills and the UofC would work well. Connections to either UofC or Brentwood LRT station as well as a BRT station, perhaps at Foothills Hospital would be great and would make getting to the Hospitals by public transit all that much easier. There is a considerable amount of movement of staff, faculty and students between the UofC, Foothills and Children's already and any future development would only increase that.

Something like this, maybe?



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Originally Posted by Radley77

On this video, the VP of campus development at Bow Valley College mentioned for the new gateway station at city hall, eastbound would be called "Centre City Station" and westbound would be referred to as "Bow Valley College Station."

There's no way Calgary Transit will either change the original name of City Hall station, or have separate names for platforms on the same block.

Especially not "City Centre Station", a name better suited for the SELRT station at 7th Ave, and/or the middle station on the Stephen Ave subway.... if it should be used at all.

I doubt that guy knows what he is talking about.

[frinkprof]

^I don't know. The name of 11th Street West Station will be foolishly named "Kerby Station," after the adjacent seniors' service centre that won't be there anymore within a few short years.

[CTrainDude]

Originally Posted by frinkprof

^I don't know. The name of 11th Street West Station will be foolishly named "Kerby Station," after the adjacent seniors' service centre that won't be there anymore within a few short years.

AND the Kerby Centre specifically asked it NOT be named after them.

[mersar]

I still hold out hope that the city will change Kerby Station to Mewata Station before December 2012

That said, in some ways I can understand why they may want to call the different platforms different things, especially since in the downtown its always been that way (though with no dual platforms). Theres a lot of effort in keeping the status quo, even when it doesn't need to be kept. For instance they could have renamed 4th Street to be 5th Street station, so it followed the same pattern as every other station does now (the stations are all named after the street to the west of the station, except for 4th and the soon to be demolished olympic plaza)

And I think there must be some truth to the video, considering its posted on a city ran web site. It hasn't gone to council yet though as far as I'm aware (station name changes have to be approved by council), though it may be up this summer as theres rumors of another couple station name changes that are gaining traction in terms of getting changed a bit so it makes sense to do them all at once (and before the new platforms at city hall are open)

[fusili]

Originally Posted by DarkKeyo

Something like this, maybe?



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I would maybe even make it a complete loop by going from Foothills to MacMahon and then onto the university again. It is a hard route to plan because the 3 destinations are basically in a circle, so making direct connections between the three is difficult without a circle route.

[suburb]

Originally Posted by DarkKeyo

Something like this, maybe?



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Or maybe like this even:


Oh wait, that is an existing route map.

Guys, all of these are simple workarounds that don't result in a true reduction of cars and traffic at Foothills. Very few staff and fewer friends and family of those in the hospital use the bus. We need a cross-town LRT!

On the NC LRT blog, Anonymous suggested keeping the NC LRT above ground and in the current proposed alignment, and then focusing efforts instead on a cross-town line connecting ACH, FMC, NW LRT, NC LRT and NE LRT via a largely underground line. I like that idea!!!

[faxri]

So what is the overall plan for extending the south and NW lines to 4 cars? Was looking at the Fishcreek station and I have no clue how they are going to extend it. There isnt room on either end the way it is setup now

[frinkprof]

Originally Posted by suburb

Guys, all of these are simple workarounds that don't result in a true reduction of cars and traffic at Foothills. Very few staff and fewer friends and family of those in the hospital use the bus. We need a cross-town LRT!

On the NC LRT blog, Anonymous suggested keeping the NC LRT above ground and in the current proposed alignment, and then focusing efforts instead on a cross-town line connecting ACH, FMC, NW LRT, NC LRT and NE LRT via a largely underground line. I like that idea!!!

Jesus. If the Centre Street Subway advocates get criticized for making assumptions about the significance of the cost, this has got to be at least 5 times worse. An entire circle LRT route is cost prohibitive. You may see some short spurs off the radial lines, and maybe some people-movers or smaller-scale rail-based solutions like the one proposed above, but a circle LRT (or at least a circle as big as most people propose) would require, at the very least, acquiring thousands of properties. Likely into the billions of dollars just to secure the route.

[frinkprof]

Originally Posted by faxri

So what is the overall plan for extending the south and NW lines to 4 cars? Was looking at the Fishcreek station and I have no clue how they are going to extend it. There isnt room on either end the way it is setup now

It's supposed to be all done by 2014. In the case of Fish Creek, I'd imagine they will have to alter the pedestrian bridge to the south. Its sister station (in terms of expansion), Canyon Meadows, actually has had piles in place for its platform extension since day one.

Southland is currently undergoing its extension, and I wouldn't be surprised to see them fire up one of the NW stations this summer.

[DarkKeyo]

Originally Posted by fusili

I would maybe even make it a complete loop by going from Foothills to MacMahon and then onto the university again. It is a hard route to plan because the 3 destinations are basically in a circle, so making direct connections between the three is difficult without a circle route.

The trouble with a circle route is that the NWLRT closes the circle and to complete the people mover as a circle it would basically have to run right beside the LRT. Plus, circle routes seem to have more trouble with dealing with scheduling and delays.

Originally Posted by mersar

I still hold out hope that the city will change Kerby Station to Mewata Station before December 2012

No map or city documentation I've ever read has named 11th St as anything but 11th St. Same with City Hall.

I do prefer actual names over numbered road names; the numbers cause confusion, I have to correct people or explain to them which station I mean quite often, even for people who have lived in Calgary longer than me. Particularly 8th-7th-6th-4th. I have to refer to them as 'the one by Century Park', 'the one with the clocks', 'the one by Holt Renfrew/TD square'. Trying to explain them to people not familiar with the system is even harder.

I would much prefer Mewata station, Century Park station, Courts Park Station, Downtown core station (the same name for 3rd, the station on the SELRT, and the station on the subway, since they should be one interconnected station anyways). Something else for 7th, 6th, 39th, 45th, and 69th, too.

[suburb]

Originally Posted by frinkprof

Jesus. If the Centre Street Subway advocates get criticized for making assumptions about the significance of the cost, this has got to be at least 5 times worse. An entire circle LRT route is cost prohibitive. You may see some short spurs off the radial lines, and maybe some people-movers or smaller-scale rail-based solutions like the one proposed above, but a circle LRT (or at least a circle as big as most people propose) would require, at the very least, acquiring thousands of properties. Likely into the billions of dollars just to secure the route.

I don't believe the cross-town LRT proposal was meant to be a circle. Instead it was a "cross-town" proposal along 16th avenue, that would need to be underground for a good chunk. In phase one you could connect the Foothills to the planned North-Centre line, and then in the future expand to the children's hospital to the West, and to the NE line to the East. Transitions would be at Lion's Park, a station on the NC line North of the Science Centre station, and perhaps around Sunridge on the NE line.

Would do much more than a re-aligned NC line, as I really think that the Foothills is important, and additionally, that there are a lot of people needing to get across town and not just to and from the core.

[Cage]

Originally Posted by faxri

So what is the overall plan for extending the south and NW lines to 4 cars? Was looking at the Fishcreek station and I have no clue how they are going to extend it. There isnt room on either end the way it is setup now

Extend the station to the South and build a new platform entrance exit that has pax travelling up and down a stair case and link up the existing overpass.

[fusili]

Originally Posted by suburb

I don't believe the cross-town LRT proposal was meant to be a circle. Instead it was a "cross-town" proposal along 16th avenue, that would need to be underground for a good chunk. In phase one you could connect the Foothills to the planned North-Centre line, and then in the future expand to the children's hospital to the West, and to the NE line to the East. Transitions would be at Lion's Park, a station on the NC line North of the Science Centre station, and perhaps around Sunridge on the NE line.

Would do much more than a re-aligned NC line, as I really think that the Foothills is important, and additionally, that there are a lot of people needing to get across town and not just to and from the core.

Why not a BRT? 16th avenue definitely has the capacity for it (as opposed to Centre Street which is very constrained in the ROW). And why an LRT? The ridership is perfect for what a BRT can offer. LRTs are expensive and are only justified with really high ridership (which the NC LRT would carry).

Right tool for the job and all that.

[MalcolmTucker]

yeah, 16th ave in the close term, lets say 50 years shouldn't need anything more than a well designed BRT with its own ROW and whatnot. Who knows what time will bring but I doubt huge loads could justify a subway within our lifetimes.

[fusili]

Originally Posted by MalcolmTucker

yeah, 16th ave in the close term, lets say 50 years shouldn't need anything more than a well designed BRT with its own ROW and whatnot. Who knows what time will bring but I doubt huge loads could justify a subway within our lifetimes.

As well, the BRT is easily implementable. How much does it cost to put roll curbs on one lane of 16th avenue and paint some pavement. Done and done.

[CTrainDude]

Originally Posted by frinkprof

It's supposed to be all done by 2014. In the case of Fish Creek, I'd imagine they will have to alter the pedestrian bridge to the south. Its sister station (in terms of expansion), Canyon Meadows, actually has had piles in place for its platform extension since day one.

Southland is currently undergoing its extension, and I wouldn't be surprised to see them fire up one of the NW stations this summer.

Brentwood and Canyon Meadows are next. Supposedly start in April to finish before Stampede. These should be easy add-ons, unlike Southland. Erlton will go after Stampede is over.

[suburb]

Originally Posted by fusili

Why not a BRT? 16th avenue definitely has the capacity for it (as opposed to Centre Street which is very constrained in the ROW). And why an LRT? The ridership is perfect for what a BRT can offer. LRTs are expensive and are only justified with really high ridership (which the NC LRT would carry).

Right tool for the job and all that.

I didn't expliciltly state it, but the status quo now is a BRT in place of potential future LRTs or similar people movers ... so agreed for the near term.

Originally Posted by MalcolmTucker

yeah, 16th ave in the close term, lets say 50 years shouldn't need anything more than a well designed BRT with its own ROW and whatnot. Who knows what time will bring but I doubt huge loads could justify a subway within our lifetimes.

I somewhat agree with the sentiment, however, I think 50 years is too far out for considering something a pinch more substantive. Remember that not only are juggernauts such as the Foothills hospital, University health sciences, Southern Alberta Institute of Technology and what I'll term as china town north (around centre), the idea would be to further inspire densification and TOD along that corridor. You could almost get another beltline type area there. I'd also think that all the students that take the LRT all the way to DT from the NE and then transfer to the NW line for the U, would take this 'short-cut' and actually ease the burden on the other two lines in the core region.

Again, I'd agree that a BRT solution is good for the short to medium term, and that might be enough to spur the development evolution I'm thinking could be perfect for that stretch.

[Jack Doe]

Originally Posted by CTrainDude

Brentwood and Canyon Meadows are next. Supposedly start in April to finish before Stampede. These should be easy add-ons, unlike Southland. Erlton will go after Stampede is over.

Good to hear.Do you have access to a schedule for when the other S and NW stations are to be done?

[frinkprof]

Originally Posted by CTrainDude

Brentwood and Canyon Meadows are next. Supposedly start in April to finish before Stampede. These should be easy add-ons, unlike Southland. Erlton will go after Stampede is over.

Thanks for that. Honestly, I was starting to worry about the pace of things thus far. However, with having at least 4 stations done by the end of summer on the 201 line, that seems about right for a 2014 completion.

I'd imagine if they are doing Erlton this year, that they will leave Victoria Park-Stampede until next summer after Stampede 2012. Maybe they will start another NW station after Brentwood is done and get it done by fall 2011.

[frinkprof]

I guess SAIT and University stations will probably be done in the summer as well, to minimize impact to students using those stations.