Jameson House | 116m | 37fl | Completed

[Coldrsx]

Having extensively walked all of these cities, some many times, I think you/people underestimate the big city feel of Van...

anyways, back to Jammy.

I love its departure from 'chengy' and much of recentish design.

[trofirhen]

I agree that parts of Vancouver do feel "big city." Problem is, there's not enough of it, the buildings are too low as a rule, and the pace is too slow.
I think it will come in due course, as height restrictions are eased, and better road / transit structure is put in place. All that, plus more sophisticated cultural life, shopping, and so forth.

[dreambrother808]

Why is anyone complaining that Vancouver doesn't feel as big as cities that are actually much BIGGER? Vancouver isn't like Chicago? How shocking! We only have 2.4 million people. Get over it and stop whining.

Vancouver has grown and changed at a steady pace. If that's not fast enough for you, then maybe you need to rethink how realistic your expectations are.

[Pavlov]

Originally Posted by trofirhen

Interesting!! My response matched yours almost exactly when I read his compsrisons!! When I go to San Fran, the first thing I notice is the height (and light, bright colours) of the buildings, as well as the extensiveness of downtown. Montreal feels bigger and more sophisticated-looking. And T.O sprawls outwards in big "clumps" of highrises, with suburbia or greenspace in between. As far as "canyons," to me the only real "canyon" in Vancouver is Georgia Street, and it has a way to go yet, too.

To me the big thing that Vancouver lacks in terms of big city feel is corporate presence. Say what you will about those soul-sucking ruthless corporations, but nothing can replace the monolithic 50 story corporate towers (no matter how many 20 story point towers IMO), the pace on the streets created by people in expensive suits making deals, etc. I really think that is where downtown Vancouver pales in comparison to Chicago, San Francisco, Hong Kong, Montreal, Toronto, etc. (not to mention the real heavyweights). Indeed (and I know I'm going to be flamed for this!) in some ways, on warm Wednesday morning, I think downtown Calgary has a more "big city" atmosphere than downtown Vancouver (albeit downtown Vancouver, and Vancouver in general, has more urbanity than Calgary in pretty much every other way).

Apologies for perpetuating the off-topic bent that this thread has taken. I'll redeem myself by saying that Jameson House does have a sort of corporate or commercial aethstetic for a residential condominium, which is one of the reasons I like it, especially in the Vancouver context.

[Pavlov]

Originally Posted by dreambrother808

Why is anyone complaining that Vancouver doesn't feel as big as cities that are actually much BIGGER? Vancouver isn't like Chicago? How shocking! We only have 2.4 million people. Get over it and stop whining.

Vancouver has grown and changed at a steady pace. If that's not fast enough for you, then maybe you need to rethink how realistic your expectations are.

Agreed of course (it was that unsavoury coldrsx character that brought up the comparisons to much larger cities!) And there is no doubt that as far as mid-sized cities in North America, Vancouver is one of (if not the) very best in terms of urban fabric.

EDIT: just to add "in North America"; comparisons to cities in other parts of the world is too difficult (I think).

[crazyjoeda]

Vancouver will never have the same "big city" feel as cities like Toronto, London or Chicago. Comparing Vancouver to these much more populated cities is silly. Vancouver has a far greater urban feel to it than any other midsize city, but more importantly it feels more like a place you would want to live. There's a reason why Vancouver has been constantly ranked the #1 city in the world for years.

[vansky]

Originally Posted by crazyjoeda

Vancouver will never have the same "big city" feel as cities like Toronto, London or Chicago. Comparing Vancouver to these much more populated cities is silly. Vancouver has a far greater urban feel to it than any other midsize city, but more importantly it feels more like a place you would want to live. There's a reason why Vancouver has been constantly ranked the #1 city in the world for years.

you can't compare van to those cities,

but you can compare van to seattle to judge who is the bigger city, since both of them r laid backs....

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by vansky

you can't compare van to those cities,

but you can compare van to seattle to judge who is the bigger city, since both of them r laid backs....

Well, Seattle is bigger by about a million people, so it's technically bigger, but in the same general range. It also has a richer, more diverse economy, and more outward signs of wealth. It has more freeways and much taller buildings, plus a lot of interesting stores and cafés.
*
However, I recall visitors from Peru, having been to both, calling Vancouver "mas European" (more European), meaning more urbane and refined. Also, oddly, Vancouver is considered by many to feel "speedier" and "faster paced" than Seattle, even though it is smaller. This may be because there is more traffic on the main roads, whereas Seattle has a large freeway system that takes it up.
*
Economically, I think Seattle is the clear winner, with several major corporate headquarters and a very large computer industry as well as medical research industry.
*
Nevertheless, for urbanity, Vancouver somehow wins out, even though it's rainier (and a litttle less walkable as a result). Seattle does have terrific opera and symphony, and seems to value its cultural heritage more, as well as placing a high standard on education. This may be in part due to the Scandinavian influence there, which is "civilized," and places a high value on hard work. (Not to say Vancouverites don't work hard, too)
*
Overall, Vancouver has "finer" texture to it. Downtown Seattle has some impressive buildings and beautiful hilltop neighbourhoods, but there is a "rawness" to it that seems to permeate the city. Even Seattle people will say that, and you can find such allusions in press and tourist articles.

/correct me if I'm wrong.

[PROSTSHOCKER]

Vancouver feels pretty damn big-city to me. If you compare it to a similar populated (city-proper and metro population) city such as Denver, you can see why. For a mid-size major city, Vancouver is probably among the top in the class. It doesn't try to compare itself with relatively similar sized cities.

Regardless, What Jameson needs is some taller structures flanking its not-so-prettier sides.

[SpongeG]

i think u just have to come here you can't judge what its like based on photos and forum talk and stats

vancouver is a big centre for research as well - hello the canada arm is from here and the ballard fuel cell for examples

we don't have national headquarters here and never will but we have plenty of head offices here for western based/started companies which are quite successful - enough to get into the ontario market ie earls, joeys, boston pizza etc. which is kind of opposite to eastern based businesses who find it tough to crack the BC market and often end trying at the alberta border

[Pavlov]

Originally Posted by SpongeG

i think u just have to come here you can't judge what its like based on photos and forum talk and stats

vancouver is a big centre for research as well - hello the canada arm is from here and the ballard fuel cell for examples

we don't have national headquarters here and never will but we have plenty of head offices here for western based/started companies which are quite successful - enough to get into the ontario market ie earls, joeys, boston pizza etc.

Who is judging it not having been there? (if that comment is directed towards me, I've been dozens and dozens of times and my parents have retired there).

Anyway, I love Vancouver. I just think that the one thing it lacks in terms of "big city" atmosphere is that commercial corporate element, both in terms of architecture and in terms of pace and streetlife. Downtown Calgary has more of this kind of atmosphere. To me, that is important in a big city (I acknowledge that it may not be as important for others). Otherwise, it has just about everything.

[djh]

Originally Posted by Reesonov

Who is judging it not having been there? (if that comment is directed towards me, I've been dozens and dozens of times and my parents have retired there).

No, it was directed elsewhere.

[SpongeG]

Originally Posted by Reesonov

Who is judging it not having been there? (if that comment is directed towards me, I've been dozens and dozens of times and my parents have retired there).

Anyway, I love Vancouver. I just think that the one thing it lacks in terms of "big city" atmosphere is that commercial corporate element, both in terms of architecture and in terms of pace and streetlife. Downtown Calgary has more of this kind of atmosphere. To me, that is important in a big city (I acknowledge that it may not be as important for others). Otherwise, it has just about everything.

not directed at you or anyone really

Vancouver doesn't really have much of a corporate culture but its downtown is quite lively, work days its quite busy, bentall centre is like nuts its all underground though and you don't even know it exists unless you go down there

I like the feel here, feels more like portland than anything else to me anyway and i prefer it that way

[flight_from_kamakura]

every so often this comes up, and i'd just like to add, as i tend to, that sf is definitely far more "city" than vancouver if you judge it merely by prevalence of detached single family dwellings, yards (in the front, esp), private driveways, building height and density, and all the other things along that "sub-urban" v "urban" axis. like, sf just doesn't have alleys. now, sf's no nyc, its population is only about 100k more than that of vancouver, but in terms of urban form (and function), sf definitely resembles brooklyn more than it does the anything in canada. a much much better city for comparison to vancouver is portland, oregon - almost identical in population, wealth, and relevance to people outside of the region that it anchors. and i believe the same could well be said about any of the cities mentioned above.

we may well yearn for greatness, but vancouver's way, young jedis, lies along another path.

and as for canyons, vancouver has a couple great ones shaping up pretty nicely here around the jameson, really something how the density if coming along.

[delboy]

Originally Posted by trofirhen

I agree that parts of Vancouver do feel "big city." Problem is, there's not enough of it, the buildings are too low as a rule, and the pace is too slow.
I think it will come in due course, as height restrictions are eased, and better road / transit structure is put in place. All that, plus more sophisticated cultural life, shopping, and so forth.

I don't agree that teh buildings are too low as a rule. Who is to say that a great city has to reach for the stars. Vancouverism balances density with out the 'shutting' in and out effect of large towers.

I find it interesting that the usual predicatable comparisons are made...San Fran, Chigaco etc..... what about comparing to Miami, Manchester, Leeds, Perth, Denver, Birmingham.....bigger does not always mean better..my favourite UK cities are all under 200 k....

I would be hard pressed calling Vancouver small, although certainly concede that it is when compared to the big lads.....and as noted, who cares....

UK Cities by Population:

http://www.ukcities.co.uk/populations/

US Cities by Population:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_cities_by_population

[delboy]

Originally Posted by trofirhen

Well, Seattle is bigger by about a million people, so it's technically bigger, but in the same general range. It also has a richer, more diverse economy, and more outward signs of wealth. It has more freeways and much taller buildings, plus a lot of interesting stores and cafés.
*
However, I recall visitors from Peru, having been to both, calling Vancouver "mas European" (more European), meaning more urbane and refined. Also, oddly, Vancouver is considered by many to feel "speedier" and "faster paced" than Seattle, even though it is smaller. This may be because there is more traffic on the main roads, whereas Seattle has a large freeway system that takes it up.
*
Economically, I think Seattle is the clear winner, with several major corporate headquarters and a very large computer industry as well as medical research industry.
*
Nevertheless, for urbanity, Vancouver somehow wins out, even though it's rainier (and a litttle less walkable as a result). Seattle does have terrific opera and symphony, and seems to value its cultural heritage more, as well as placing a high standard on education. This may be in part due to the Scandinavian influence there, which is "civilized," and places a high value on hard work. (Not to say Vancouverites don't work hard, too)
*
Overall, Vancouver has "finer" texture to it. Downtown Seattle has some impressive buildings and beautiful hilltop neighbourhoods, but there is a "rawness" to it that seems to permeate the city. Even Seattle people will say that, and you can find such allusions in press and tourist articles.

/correct me if I'm wrong.

I've been to seattle a number of times and don't get it.....not sure it's that noticbly drier...seems the same to me.....and would strongly disagree that it is more walkable, at least the core...which feels teh same size and much grubbier and less interesting.

Cultural realms aside, I will take Vancouver...

[delboy]

Originally Posted by Reesonov

Who is judging it not having been there? (if that comment is directed towards me, I've been dozens and dozens of times and my parents have retired there).

Anyway, I love Vancouver. I just think that the one thing it lacks in terms of "big city" atmosphere is that commercial corporate element, both in terms of architecture and in terms of pace and streetlife. Downtown Calgary has more of this kind of atmosphere. To me, that is important in a big city (I acknowledge that it may not be as important for others). Otherwise, it has just about everything.

having spent a week a month for the past 6 months in Calgary on business, I don;t see this at all. True the core (if thats what you call it) gets busy in the day, by 7 pm though i could n't figure out what happended......it like a sci fi episode where everyone vanishes?

Not urbane at all and as for architecture....you must be joking right....or did i mis-read your post, i sure hope so!

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by Coldrsx

Having extensively walked all of these cities, some many times, I think you/people underestimate the big city feel of Van...

anyways, back to Jammy.

I love its departure from 'chengy' and much of recentish design.

Yeah, I'm surprised people can say with a straight face Vancouver doesn't have a big city feel. Example: dleung posted this great photo in another thread:

[Canadian Mind]

Imagine that view now without renders...

And to think the downtown peninsula, while mostly built-out, still has hundreds of low-mid rise lots that can be redeveloped. What we've seen in the past 25 years is only the shell of what the city will be in 2061, or even just 2036.

[Pavlov]

Originally Posted by delboy

having spent a week a month for the past 6 months in Calgary on business, I don;t see this at all. True the core (if thats what you call it) gets busy in the day, by 7 pm though i could n't figure out what happended......it like a sci fi episode where everyone vanishes?

Not urbane at all and as for architecture....you must be joking right....or did i mis-read your post, i sure hope so!

I've already acknowledged that downtown Vancouver activity is far higher than downtown Calgary outside of business hours. I stand by my comments:

Originally Posted by Reesonov

Who is judging it not having been there? (if that comment is directed towards me, I've been dozens and dozens of times and my parents have retired there).

Anyway, I love Vancouver. I just think that the one thing it lacks in terms of "big city" atmosphere is that commercial corporate element, both in terms of architecture and in terms of pace and streetlife. Downtown Calgary has more of this kind of atmosphere. To me, that is important in a big city (I acknowledge that it may not be as important for others). Otherwise, it has just about everything.