DENVER | Transportation Thread

[bcp]

bunt, yeah i was talking about the front range rail / HSR studies that are going on...many show shared ROW along diagnol road. still, for now i'd say terminate the RTD train in boulder (ideally at a better spot...)

[Pizzuti]

Connecticut is not part of the MTA but Connecticut still runs its trains on MTA lines, to Grand Central Station. Public agencies have the ability to cooperate... if they tend not to, that is a bad thing, not a status-quo to idealize.

The idea that a Front Range Commuter Rail agency could never work out a way to utilize and cooperate with RTD is pretty uncreative.

Would you also oppose the idea of regional rail utilizing Union Station?

[bunt_q]

As long as it's a separate entity, they don't interfere with RTD services, and they pay their fair share (which would mean extra), then fine. I am quite okay with charging out of district cars double to utilize RTD parking structures. Something similar could work up north.

But the point was - that's not a good enough reason to keep a project that otherwise isn't beneficial to district taxpayers. If it stands on its own merits within RTD and can later be used elsewhere also, fine. But it is NOT a first step in the way to front range rail. If that's an argument, then other funding sources outside RTD should be explored. Fort Collins anything is last last on the list of RTD projects to fund, well behind even inner city Denver rail.

[Pizzuti]

Well perhaps I don't approve of the NW corridor for exactly the same reasons RTD does... that's not reason enough for me to oppose it. Instead of advocating cancelling the line, I advocate for it to be utilized by Front Range transit. I would be as angry about the situation as you are if RTD somehow belligerently opposes the idea of the NW corridor connecting to long-distance commuter rail, if/when that becomes a crystallized plan.

As a side note, RTD (in Westminster and Boulder at least) already allows vehicles registered to in-district addresses to park for free for 24 hours and charges for vehicles that are out of district.

[SnyderBock]

I still like the idea of ending the NW Rail in Boulder and expanding the BRT system to additional destinations, such as Longmont and Nederland, making Boulder a hub of a big regional BRT system. Even more, to reflect Boulder's culture, I think this entire BRT fleet hubbed in Boulder, should run on alternative and/or renewable energy/fuels.

[bunt_q]

Originally Posted by SnyderBock

I still like the idea of ending the NW Rail in Boulder and expanding the BRT system to additional destinations, such as Longmont and Nederland, making Boulder a hub of a big regional BRT system. Even more, to reflect Boulder's culture, I think this entire BRT fleet hubbed in Boulder, should run on alternative and/or renewable energy/fuels.

That's a good idea. Super- Hops, Skips, and Jumps. A one-seat BRT ride from Longmont to Denver, via Boulder, could be a national trend-setter. Not sure the road space is there to do it right, but it's worth investigating.

[Pizzuti]

Hey the CU university busses are already biodiesel.

[SnyderBock]

They could send one that runs from Boulder to Longmont, south down I-25 to Denver Union Station, as well. Much of the HOV type lanes are in place already along I-25 north of Downtown Denver.

[trubador]

Originally Posted by SnyderBock

They could send one that runs from Boulder to Longmont, south down I-25 to Denver Union Station, as well. Much of the HOV type lanes are in place already along I-25 north of Downtown Denver.

the only HOV north of downtown ends where I-25 crosses I-36, so any bus coming down I-25 would hit significant traffic and delays north of that intersection until about 104th.

I know right now that Longmont has a bus that goes downtown (the L) but it goes down 287, stops in Lafayette (287), Broomfield (36) and Westminster(36) and continues to downtown via the HOV lanes.

[bunt_q]

Originally Posted by trubador

the only HOV north of downtown ends where I-25 crosses I-36, so any bus coming down I-25 would hit significant traffic and delays north of that intersection until about 104th.

Umm, there is no "I-36." Well, not in Colorado, at least.

And the HOVs continue up 36 past Federal now, and will go farther eventually. That's the road the BRT will/could follow, not up I-25 to 104th.

[Cirrus]

There's no I-36 anywhere. It's an unused number.

More or less semantic to trubador's post, though.

But correct me if I'm wrong; aren't HOV lanes being installed on US36?

[SnyderBock]

Well, a Boulder hub BRT system for North Denver Metro would be an interesting alternative to a costly to operate NW Rail running from Boulder to Longmont. I'd like them to extend the NW Rail in phases, until it gets to Boulder, but then any extension beyond that actually be a part of a State funded Front Range commuter rail project which will not only expand rail service to Longmont, but also Loveland and Fort Collins and South to Colorado Springs and Pueblo. In the meantime, provide express bus and BRT service across the northern greater metro area using Boulder as it's hub instead of Denver.

[The Dirt]

Originally Posted by Cirrus

But correct me if I'm wrong; aren't HOV lanes being installed on US36?

Yeah, they start/end around Federal right now, but the plan is to eventually extend them to Wadsworth.

[Cirrus]

Greyhound ought to be part of this discussion. It's true that a lot of people who would ride a train will never set foot on a Greyhound, but certainly there is a market, and certainly it's a way to travel without a car. I'd have used it from to time if it ever occurred to me that getting around the state by bus were possible, but it never did.

But man, it looks pretty convenient. There are multiple buses a day going from Denver to Colorado Springs, Pueblo, Fort Collins... pretty much everywhere.

[The Dirt]

Originally Posted by Cirrus

Greyhound ought to be part of this discussion. It's true that a lot of people who would ride a train will never set foot on a Greyhound, but certainly there is a market, and certainly it's a way to travel without a car. I'd have used it from to time if it ever occurred to me that getting around the state by bus were possible, but it never did.

But man, it looks pretty convenient. There are multiple buses a day going from Denver to Colorado Springs, Pueblo, Fort Collins... pretty much everywhere.

Well, they are moving to the old Gates Rubber factory area, with plans to "integrate" with the Light Rail stop and RTD bus routes.

[taylor23]

The discussion about BRT has brought up something that has confused me about RTD’s plans. The way I think of BRT is special buses that run on mostly dedicated roadway and fast loading stations. It looks like extending the HOV on 36 might get started this year with new slip ramps being created. I assume this would be the same as at the new Broomfield PnR. While great to avoid stop lights and would be an improvement the buses will still have to cross two lanes of traffic to reach the stops, then two lanes of traffic to get back to the HOV, and repeat every mile or so. Having to cross lanes of traffic takes away the advantage of the HOV, depending on how bad traffic is. This would not be all that different to what we already have today.

I had seen concept pictures of 36 with center loading stops in the HOV and special two car buses. Were these plans dropped?

[bunt_q]

Originally Posted by Cirrus

Greyhound ought to be part of this discussion. It's true that a lot of people who would ride a train will never set foot on a Greyhound, but certainly there is a market, and certainly it's a way to travel without a car. I'd have used it from to time if it ever occurred to me that getting around the state by bus were possible, but it never did.

But man, it looks pretty convenient. There are multiple buses a day going from Denver to Colorado Springs, Pueblo, Fort Collins... pretty much everywhere.

I rode Greyhound home to Colo Spgs on the weekend from Boulder a few times in college (well, B bus, then Greyhound), back before there was a FREX bus. All I remember about it was that it was damned expensive for the distance. Incidentally, the FREX has gotten pricey too - it's up to $22 round-trip Denver-Colo Spgs.

HOVs will get done to Flatirons eventually I think. But yes, RTD has greatly scaled back the BRT. Waiting for CDOT to get on board, basically. Until we can fund a comprehensive transit-highway TREX-like solution for US36, it's all in slow-mo.

[Cirrus]

^
Further reason why the NW rail is a poor use of money. Boulder will be getting two dysfunctional transit lines rather than one that works.

[trubador]

Originally Posted by bunt_q

Umm, there is no "I-36." Well, not in Colorado, at least.

And the HOVs continue up 36 past Federal now, and will go farther eventually. That's the road the BRT will/could follow, not up I-25 to 104th.

yes but I was referring to the HOV on I-25, where you would expect a Longmont bus to use.

[Cirrus]

^
I'm not sure I'd expect that. I imagine more people who live in Longmont probably work in Boulder, Broomfield, and Westminster than in downtown Denver.

Not that I have any proof of this.