Halifax Stadium Discussion

[brettinhalifax]

account deleted

[TedWilliamsHead]

wespidel I don’t want you to stop posting. I don't comment much on this thread but I do view it daily and I know you’re a regular and provide some good information and thoughts...I was also one of the ones that might have frustrated you earlier when I told you to stop repeating yourself but I didn't mean for it to anger you in that way. Anyways just wanted to throw some support your way to let you know I do appreciate you posting on this form.

[wespidel]

That was a very nice comment made by you, thank-you. You are a good person for posting it! Take Care, SPYDER*

[c-way-dude]

Originally Posted by brettinhalifax

IMO the only reason the Halifax CFL owner would play games in Moncton is because it was good for the bottom line.

It could be as simple as selling 20,000 tickets in Moncton @ $50 per ticket = $1,000,000 vs. 25,000 tickets in Halifax @ $30 = $750,000. The owner is $250,000 to the good minus some hotel rooms and a couple of bus rentals.

Or it could be a little more complicated than that if the owner sees value in becoming "Team Maritimes" where it is a good business decision to sell 20,000 tickets in Moncton @ $30 per ticket = $600,000 vs. 25,000 tickets in Halifax @ $30 = $750,000 because the $150,000 loss is made up by increased goodwill among the population, merchandise sales, sponsorship revenue, etc.

Money talks.

Absolutely. I think the only way a Halifax-based team would regularly play games in Moncton is if Halifax ends up building a basic stadium like a permanent version of Empire Stadium. A significant number of seats will be around the endzones, and therefore be cheaper. Moncton could charge a little more for their seats because it would be an event coming to town only twice a year. Any loss of revenue from hosting games in Moncton's stadium could probably be recovered from the things you mentioned at the end of your post.
I think the odds of Halifax's stadium (assuming it's even built) being pretty basic are good. That is why the more I think about the idea of playing a couple of games per season in Moncton, the more I like it.

[halifaxboyns]

Originally Posted by David1gray

i made up a map for moncton and halifax catch areas within 3 hours using google maps. some of this is most likely off since i used get direction times. anyways, you be the judge.

hopefully this works

map: http://maps.google.ca/maps/ms?hl=en&ie=U...15418133511407.00049c2ea7a29b499d607&z=6

This is a great map David - took me a while to go back and find it (I've been on vacation the past few days and boy did I need it!).

I agree with c-way-dude. Logically, for such a relatively low populated area (the maritimes) it makes sense (for now and to me) to create 1 team. At this point, I see it as a race on who gets the headquarters, Moncton or Halifax. But the fact that we're thinking in a Moncton/Halifax frame of mind is important because no matter where it ends up, the team will more than likely (and should) have games in other cities.

Personally, I'd love to see it in Halifax - but I'd drive to Moncton as well. If it is in Halifax, I'd say there should be at least 2 or 3 games per year in Moncton. As part of that, I'd go one step further though. If the team is based in HRM and does 'guest' games in Moncton, I'd want to see them expand the stadium capacity on a temporary basis for each game. The main number should be increased - thus to improve the team catchment of fans.

[halifaxboyns]

Originally Posted by q12

Ok how about this in Shannon Park? (Not to scale but you get the point.)

I like this location and the fact it has the ability to expand at the end zone. Would this be able to have a roof put on it eventually once it was fully built out with end zone seating?

[halifaxboyns]

I was at a presentation today from some people who deal with McMahon Stadium - so I got a chance to ask some questions. So before my 'old' age sets in, I wanted to get some ideas down for ways to reduce stadium costs in the long run.

• Although McMahon doesn't do naming rights - the saddledome does. $10 million for 10 years. I'd say something along that line with Aliant, Eastlink, NSP, any of the Banks would work?
• Banks love sponsorship on a building - Ottawa is the Scotia Bank centre and when they can't get a building name; they sponsor or do advertising. Could be a great opportunity.
• While I am not a fan of public space advertising - from what I heard; you could earn between 10 to 35 million $ a year for advertising at the stadium (in washrooms, in the building, on the field, in parking lots) depending on the size, amount of advertising, etc.

This is just a couple ways where (although not really bringing down the upfront cost) ensure that the operating costs and years to 'pay back the upfront cost' is reduced.

[David1gray]

So, I've added populations to my map. I used the population of counties given on wikipedia to get my totals. Therefore some of these numbers are going to be off.

map:http://maps.google.ca/maps/ms?hl=en&ie=U...486,-63.105469&spn=3.98191,10.821533&z=7

[DigitalNinja]

I think the map is quite off considering HRM now (Less than an hour from Halifax has over 400k now.

[David1gray]

ya i wasnt sure how much of the HRM is actual within one hour. so i used a number given to me by a search i did in wikipedia. which was "urban area halifax". but now that i look at it, most of the HRM would be within one hour anyways

[lawsond]

Interesting numbers despite HRM being underestimated by about 75 thousand.
What it shows is that Moncton has a bigger "catchment" if you are willing and able to drive three hours to see a football game.
But Halifax has a much bigger "catchment" for one and two hour drives.
And double the population for under an hour.
I would think that not as many people would be willing or able to spend the time and money to trek six hours (there and back) to see a regular season football game than those within a shorter distance.
In practical terms, if you think of people deciding spontaneously on a Saturday afternoon to "go catch a game", Halifax HRM is far and away ahead of Moncton.

[lawsond]

Also did a quick crunch of 2001 numbers in what I call the "ish" zone.
That is, places which may be slightly over one hour but only by a small margin.
Therefore, I call them one hour-ish from Halifax.

Colchester County (Truro and area) - 49,307
Hants County (Windsor etc) - 40,513
Kings County (Kentville/Wolfville) - 58,866
Lunenburg County (Bridgewater) - 47,391

That's a total of 196,075 or roughly 200,000 more people who are one hour-ish from Shannon Park but certainly far less than two hours.

That gives Halifax over 600,000 within a very short distance.

[ATL Stadium]

The Herald today printed an article about the HRM Council asking for volunteers for a Stadium Steering Committee (SSC) They would be involved in forming the business plan, operational plan, site selection. It would reportedly would be comprised of approx 12 people ( council members, sports/rec managers, business persons, and citizens)
SSC would be huge job....just think of the amount of work required.

Councillors previously stated they wanted un-biased, open minded people for this job.....Holy Moly....how is that going to go forward? I'm really scared that people in favour will vetoed off and the committee will be filled by those opposed....This would not work!

I fully understand and respect the need to have a business plan......funding partners are such a key issue....cost and debt to taxpayers will be the outcome....but how is the intangible benefit to be measured?

The Councillors will want to display a cost benefit analysis as a result of the business plan.

If this gets approval..and becomes the Atlantic Stadium ....or perhaps Sobeys Atlantic Stadium....or some other name it seems clear at this point the sites that council view as "sellable" to the public are Shannon or Dartmouth Crossing areas....nobody wants to pave paradise to build a Stadium.

FIFA is certainly a factor.,,,as is the Indigenous Games. We will need a cause to rally around getting this built. To get this going one of both have to happen.

We need that foresight to build big enough to support a permanent stadium and attract a tenants for the long haul operational costs. That means after any games we need the ability to host a CFL team and or a Soccer team, University games like the Uteck Bowl and the Vanier, outdoor events like concerts and other exhibition type of activities......its all in the mix.

[ATL Stadium]

Originally Posted by lawsond

Also did a quick crunch of 2001 numbers in what I call the "ish" zone.
That is, places which may be slightly over one hour but only by a small margin.
Therefore, I call them one hour-ish from Halifax.

Colchester County (Truro and area) - 49,307
Hants County (Windsor etc) - 40,513
Kings County (Kentville/Wolfville) - 58,866
Lunenburg County (Bridgewater) - 47,391

That's a total of 196,075 or roughly 200,000 more people who are one hour-ish from Shannon Park but certainly far less than two hours.

That gives Halifax over 600,000 within a very short distance.

It would be an interesting evaluation (other than Rider Nation) to see what the season ticket sales and draw is from what distances CFL teams are currently experiencing.

[David1gray]

Originally Posted by lawsond

Also did a quick crunch of 2001 numbers in what I call the "ish" zone.
That is, places which may be slightly over one hour but only by a small margin.
Therefore, I call them one hour-ish from Halifax.

Colchester County (Truro and area) - 49,307
Hants County (Windsor etc) - 40,513
Kings County (Kentville/Wolfville) - 58,866
Lunenburg County (Bridgewater) - 47,391

That's a total of 196,075 or roughly 200,000 more people who are one hour-ish from Shannon Park but certainly far less than two hours.

That gives Halifax over 600,000 within a very short distance.

ya when i was doing the calculations i thought about that and wasnt sure what to do about it. maybe i should add a 1 and half hour line? maybe later. but right now i have an exam to study for.

[MonctonRad]

Already posted on the "CFL in the Maritimes" thread:



The "ish" catchment area for Moncton (~90 minutes) is about 400,000.

I agree that the "ish" population for Halifax is about 600,000

These are both greater than for Regina and do not overlap.

[halifaxboyns]

MacKay touts Shannon Park as stadium site

By MARY ELLEN MacINTYRE Cape Breton Bureau
Thu, Feb 17 - 4:54 AM
SYDNEY — Shannon Park "would be a natural site" for a stadium in Halifax Regional Municipality, Defence Minister Peter MacKay said Wednesday.

The Dartmouth location would be a good spot partly because the federal government already owns the land, the minister said, adding that he was aware that Mi’kmaq First Nations are interested in a portion of the site.

» SEE ALSO: Volunteers sought to advise on metro stadium

He made the statements after making some funding announcements at Sydney’s Centre 200.

Asked if federal funding would be provided for a multi-use stadium, MacKay said the federal government would keep on open mind on any request for money.

He said he would expect to see economic and feasibility studies completed on the project before any decision was made by the federal government.

Halifax regional council recently approved funding for a $100,000 consultant’s study that will look into the feasibility of a new stadium.

It would cost between $30 million and $60 million to build but proponents say the value to this region would be inestimable. The stadium could host for entertainment events, trade shows and sporting competitions.

Mayor Peter Kelly has said the construction could be funded by federal, provincial and municipal cash.

A stadium could also help this region become one of the host cities if Canada is selected to host the 2015 FIFA Women’s World Cup soccer championship.

[halifaxboyns]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

Already posted on the "CFL in the Maritimes" thread:



The "ish" catchment area for Moncton (~90 minutes) is about 400,000.

I agree that the "ish" population for Halifax is about 600,000

These are both greater than for Regina and do not overlap.

How is the catchment from Moncton higher? Maybe I'm not seeing it?

[David1gray]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

Already posted on the "CFL in the Maritimes" thread:



The "ish" catchment area for Moncton (~90 minutes) is about 400,000.

I agree that the "ish" population for Halifax is about 600,000

These are both greater than for Regina and do not overlap.

thanks MonctonRad. My numbers weren't too far off i guess. but this works much better. ill change the numbers now

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by halifaxboyns

How is the catchment from Moncton higher? Maybe I'm not seeing it?

The Moncton catchment is only higher if you go to a three hour driving radius, but this is not realistic for casual travellers.

A 90 minute drive is far more realistic if you are talking about fans willing to travel to several games a year. This would be about 400,000 people for Moncton and 600,000 people for Halifax.

Again, the 90 minute catchments for Moncton and Halifax only overlap in the Truro area.