PHILADELPHIA | American Commerce Center | 1,510' Pinnacle / 1,210' Roof | 63 FLOORS

[Don098]

Originally Posted by OneWorldTradeCenter

Well, some news are better than no news. But I doubt that this really gets built.. I hope it!

You're absolutely right. By my count, this is the first time we've seen the building even mentioned in a news article since January...at least what's been posted on this thread.

[Dylan Leblanc]

Frankly I don't want this tower to be built. The design is so cheap and amateur, it doesn't deserve to be Philly's tallest. This proposal reminds me of that Miapolis thing.

[giantSwan]

American Commerce Center Enthusiasts...

just read an article highlighting philly's population decrease and recent increase on www.crackedbellblog.com it mentioned the stagnant ACC

[Don098]

Originally Posted by giantSwan

American Commerce Center Enthusiasts...

just read an article highlighting philly's population decrease and recent increase on www.crackedbellblog.com it mentioned the stagnant ACC

My reaction to this is...yea, so?

That was a very elementary assessment of Philadelphia demography and development. There's nothing there that nearly 100% of the regulars on the Philly development thread already know. Most importantly, this is not news about the ACC's status.

[Onn]

Originally Posted by giantSwan

American Commerce Center Enthusiasts...

just read an article highlighting philly's population decrease and recent increase on www.crackedbellblog.com it mentioned the stagnant ACC

Trying to connect population to an office building? Really? Have you looked at the world lately.

[Tony73]

Well, but this tower will be built or not?

[pwp]

Originally Posted by Tony73

Well, but this tower will be built or not?

I'd say the consensus on this forum is that it will get built, but not this year and possibly be scaled down from the original design. From the little news that's surfaced on the project in the past few months, much has centered on the need and on-going campaign to recruit an anchor tenant to lease up a substantial amount of floor space. As the economy rebounds, we'll hopefully see more noise on this project; however, what's also working against this, in my opinion, is that the major local players (education, pharma, and health care companies) may desire to reside in, or closer to, University City. Possibly the latest Census data will generate some interest from suburban firms to the city? Then again, it's not as though you can't look around and see the progress the city's made in the past 10-years.

[Spocket]

Originally Posted by pwp

I'd say the consensus on this forum is that it will get built, ...

Not to be a party pooper here but the only reason that it's the consensus on this forum is because a)a lot of the posters are from the area in question and therefore have a serious desire to view things through rose-tinted glasses , and b) nobody wants to start a city-vs-city .

Of course it's possible that it will be built . Some day I'm sure that something tall and graceful will be put up that gives Philly a signature skyline envied by many . I'm not saying it won't happen because Philly is somehow incapable of seeing something like this built . What I think is a more prudent comment is to say that at the current time the economics of this tower don't make sense . Further , and more importantly , by the time they do , the ACC will be long forgotten . The truth is that we're looking at at least five years and probably closer to a decade before something like this is viable .

Yes , it could be scaled down but the problem isn't just that it's too much space to flood the market with . The simple fact is that there are no large , anchor tenants on the horizon . There are plausible and possible anchor names to throw around but nothing very serious whatsoever . That's just not going to change any time soon .

Unless somebody is willing to build this thing completely on speculation then it's just not going to happen .

And just for the record , I say this as somebody who was practically holding his breath waiting for a shovel to hit the dirt . I mean I really , really wanted this thing to go up and I still do . The cold water dashing the dreams is not a function of baseless negativity .

[bryson662001]

This building as it is now designed will not be built. There are other developers out there with their own projects and they are all chasing the same elusive tenant. Even if Hill Opportunity were to snare that tenant, they are not going to use 3 year old plans. A new design would be produced, probably reduced in size, which is just as well because that neighborhood is not the best place for this giant building anyway. I agree it is time to close this thread.

[Onn]

Originally Posted by bryson662001

This building as it is now designed will not be built. There are other developers out there with their own projects and they are all chasing the same elusive tenant. Even if Hill Opportunity were to snare that tenant, they are not going to use 3 year old plans. A new design would be produced, probably reduced in size, which is just as well because that neighborhood is not the best place for this giant building anyway. I agree it is time to close this thread.

Projects generally don't get scaled down in such a dramatic way as you purpose, the whole point of the project was building big. Don't go off on a limb like that when you have nothing to support that claim, closing the thread is even more ridiculous when its obvious the plans will not go forward in a down economy. Does that mean it will never happen? Not at all.

[Lecom]

As the project has not officially been cancelled nor is it old enough to become a definite stale proposal, the thread stays.

[Don098]

Originally Posted by bryson662001

This building as it is now designed will not be built. There are other developers out there with their own projects and they are all chasing the same elusive tenant. Even if Hill Opportunity were to snare that tenant, they are not going to use 3 year old plans. A new design would be produced, probably reduced in size, which is just as well because that neighborhood is not the best place for this giant building anyway. I agree it is time to close this thread.

I chuckle every single time I see your avatar because it so perfectly encapsulates who you are on this forum.

[Skyscraper Sebastian]

I like the main tower's design, but all the other stuff (hotel, plaza) I don't like. They have to change the design.

[volguus zildrohar]

The project was a complete shock when it was first proposed. The developer has never built anything on this scale before and there did not appear to be any kind of need or call for something of that size, especially after the recent completion of Comcast Center and the presence of several other substanial proposals.

Since about summer of last year my hopes for this one have faded. I believe that the developers are committed to making this happen, I just firmly do not believe that they can keep to the original program. Other highrises proposed for Philadelphia are more modestly sized (in terms of floor space) and would seem much more appealing to lenders when such money begins flowing again. ACC is the sort of thing that should have been let out of the bag in '03 or '04. Even if a large company wanted contiguous space and were willing to wait there are already people ahead of Hill and ACC in line, practically speaking.

Part of the allure of this one is the fact that it breaks the 1,000 foot barrier here for the first time. The design, while not devoid of merit, needs work and I've never bought the idea that the program can work on the plot for which it is intended, which is easily the most compact for any Philadelphia building of its size - it would be akin to jamming the Empire State Building somewhere on Exchange Place.

[markdv]

Can't understand Philadelphias self-imposed floor restriction.... I mean, we have the Comcast tower at almost 1000' and 60+ stories, and ACC at >1400' with 60+ stories ??? What's up with that ? Most other towers with these heights have many more stories . I think ACC is beautiful but it doesn't look 975" due to the tall ceilings, rather it looks about 700'. A good building needs a tighter height : floor ratio and just looks better !

[Starship Catvern]

I really hope this gets built, it will make a great addition to our skyline and Philadelphia deserves a super tall.

[wanderer34]

Originally Posted by pwp

I'd say the consensus on this forum is that it will get built, but not this year and possibly be scaled down from the original design. From the little news that's surfaced on the project in the past few months, much has centered on the need and on-going campaign to recruit an anchor tenant to lease up a substantial amount of floor space. As the economy rebounds, we'll hopefully see more noise on this project; however, what's also working against this, in my opinion, is that the major local players (education, pharma, and health care companies) may desire to reside in, or closer to, University City. Possibly the latest Census data will generate some interest from suburban firms to the city? Then again, it's not as though you can't look around and see the progress the city's made in the past 10-years.

If it gets built, then fine, but scaled down is another issue, as the purpose of building the ACC was not just to break to 1000' mark, but to attract a major tenant to the city using the KOZ zone, as well as provide hotel, retail, and residential services. It did generate a lot of media attention as far as the TV stations broadcasting the plans. But I just can't see a scaled down version at the same site. I can see something being built smaller along one of Market St's few large lots from 19th St going west, but 18th and JFK is a major site for this type of tower, and seeing it not get built, even for this economy, or scaled down to another 600' - 700' is not just a huge disappointment for Hill Int'l, but for the city as well. I just hope we get a new mayor because I don't really feel comfortable w/ Nutter running the city, and I mean anybody (Katz, Green, Torsella, Rendell ???).

[thenbagis]

Checking in on the ACC development
http://planphilly.com/checking-acc-development
By Kellie Patrick Gates

A proposed 1,500-foot skyscraper that would be the city's tallest remains a ground-level parking lot. But the American Commerce Center project “is not scrapped,” the developer's attorney said.

“We're still looking for a tenant,” said attorney Peter Kelsen.

The developers – Hill International Real Estate Partners – are talking to a number of businesses in hopes of finding someone to fill the two-million square feet of space the building would contain, Kelsen said. “But until a large tenant is secured ... we will not build on spec.” he said.

In 2008, the structure designed by Philadelphia native and world-renowned architect Eugene Kohn lit up internet message boards and headlined Philadelphia City Planning Commission and City Council meetings. With its enormous leasing potential and 300-foot communications spire, the tower would have surpassed the Comcast Building as the city's tallest. City planners – including former Deputy Mayor Andy Altman, who is now heading up the planning for London's 2012 Olympic Games – were excited by the prospect. Why? It promised environmentally-conscious construction would extend the SEPTA concourse, allowing those who worked there to connect more easily with public transit. Advocates from the public praised the building as a forward-thinking boost to Philadelphia's skyline. Opponents derided it as “a bigger is better boondoogle" that would cut off other buildings sight lines and air.

Definitely a worthwhile read

[brian.odonnell20]

So, at this point, this has a better chance of being downsized than built as is or cancelled. From what I took from that article, the developers have expressed no interest in letting go of the project and will downsize it to more modest proportions if the current ones become unfeasible.

[Fabb]

Originally Posted by markdv

Can't understand Philadelphias self-imposed floor restriction.... I mean, we have the Comcast tower at almost 1000' and 60+ stories, and ACC at >1400' with 60+ stories ??? What's up with that ? Most other towers with these heights have many more stories . I think ACC is beautiful but it doesn't look 975" due to the tall ceilings, rather it looks about 700'. A good building needs a tighter height : floor ratio and just looks better !

I agree.
Extremely tall ceilings make it look like a hollow box.
Skyscrapers should have more substance.