YVR Airport & Sea Island Developments Discussion

[SpongeG]

well it end up with a corporate name - those kind of things need the money corporations can provide them - rather them than me the tax payer

[trofirhen]

I, like most Canadians, admire Terry fox for his valiant effort in the face of illness. However, as has been pointed out, there are already schools named after him, as well as a memorial (done in the worst of visual taste) downtown. Naming a stadium after him might be appropriate, but an airport, as a gateway to a country, if named after a person, is usually somebody known over the world (we'll keep the UAE out of this for the moment) like John Lennon Airport in Liverpool.

Lester B. Pearson was not only Prime Minister of Canada, but won the Nobel Peace Prize for his solution to the Suez Crisis of 1956.

Trudeau was PM for several terms, and became an international emblem of Canada, for better or worse.

Terry was a hero, but is too homespun for a name for our airport. Plus, there are numerous things named for him already, as has been noted.

Heck, why not Emily Carr as a name? She was a renowned artist who captured the spirit of BC in her art, and became famous posthumously.

Anyway, Vancouver is not yet a big enough airport (in my opinion) to be named after someone.

Leave well enough alone. PUH-LEEEEEEEZE.

[whatnext]

The federal government has knocked the stool out from the UAE's brazen attempt to coerce Canada into accepting Emirates flights, by pulling troops out early from Camp Mirage. UAE had threatened to restrict access to the base unless EK was allowed unlimited access to Canada:

http://www.nationalpost.com/Troops+pull+early+from+Dubai+base/3641380/story.html

[mr.x]

Lets not forget that technically, "Vancouver International Airport" is named after someone and therefore honours him. Does he not matter?

[SpongeG]

Kenya Airways joins Let’s Talk Travel road shows in western Canada

Oct 07, 2010
VANCOUVER, Canada - Kenya Airways is on the road this fall in western Canada. Kenya Airways, in conjunction with four other suppliers (Bestway Tours and Safaris, Safari Studio, SITA World Tours, and Destinos), has announced an exciting series of presentations highlighting the newest destinations, latest itineraries, and products available in Africa, South America, India, and Central Asia.

According to Mable Tang, Kenya Airways Western Canada manager, “We are inviting all agents fascinated with developing intimate knowledge of the latest product offerings in order to enhance their ability to sell some of the most exciting destinations in Africa and other destinations, to a dinner preview to see all the latest offers. Everyone attending will see our latest product updates and have a chance to win a trip for two valued at more than
US$5,000.”

...

http://www.eturbonews.com/18963/kenya-airways-joins-let-s-talk-travel-road-shows-western-canada

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by mr.x

Lets not forget that technically, "Vancouver International Airport" is named after someone and therefore honours him. Does he not matter?

Captain George Vancouver, for whom our city was named,yes. Excellent point, Mr. X

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by SpongeG

Kenya Airways joins Let’s Talk Travel road shows in western Canada

Oct 07, 2010
VANCOUVER, Canada - Kenya Airways is on the road this fall in western Canada. Kenya Airways, in conjunction with four other suppliers (Bestway Tours and Safaris, Safari Studio, SITA World Tours, and Destinos), has announced an exciting series of presentations highlighting the newest destinations, latest itineraries, and products available in Africa, South America, India, and Central Asia.

According to Mable Tang, Kenya Airways Western Canada manager, “We are inviting all agents fascinated with developing intimate knowledge of the latest product offerings in order to enhance their ability to sell some of the most exciting destinations in Africa and other destinations, to a dinner preview to see all the latest offers. Everyone attending will see our latest product updates and have a chance to win a trip for two valued at more than
US$5,000.”

...

http://www.eturbonews.com/18963/kenya-airways-joins-let-s-talk-travel-road-shows-western-canada

Too bad they don't have a route from YVR into Nairobi and beyond. (If they applied for it, the government would more than likely allocate it to YYZ instead, so what's the use in hoping)?

[Yume-sama]

That's one time I'd rather fly Air Canada Kenyan planes sound scary.

[Millennium2002]

Unsafe? =O

There are a few countries whose airlines have been banned by say the EU... but I don't think Kenyan is high on the watch list...

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by Yume-sama

That's one time I'd rather fly Air Canada Kenyan planes sound scary.

If you've flown Air Canada's 767 fin # 690 you've flown on ex-Kenya plane.

http://www.planespotters.net/Aviation_Photos/photo.show?id=073437

[sacrifice333]

Sounds like AC not only blocked further UAE airline routes & frequencies to Canada but is also forcing the Canadian Forces to make alternative arrangements re: Camp Mirage and the mission in Afghanistan!

UAE closes airspace to MacKay, blocks his flight from Afghanistan

JANE TABER AND DANIEL LEBLANC
Ottawa— Globe and Mail Update
Published Monday, Oct. 11, 2010 10:42AM EDT
Last updated Monday, Oct. 11, 2010 1:01PM EDT

The United Arab Emirates has closed its airspace to Defence Minister Peter MacKay and Chief of the Defence Staff General Walt Natynczyk as they were on their way back from a visit in Afghanistan, according to a senior government source.

The pair had landed at Camp Mirage in the UAE as they were on their way to Kandahar on Thursday. But as they prepared to return, Mr. MacKay and Gen. Natynczyk were informed that they could not land at Camp Mirage or even fly over the UAE, according to a senior government official.

...
Air Canada and Transport Canada oppose the idea of linking air negotiations to geopolitics.
...

Read the full article on Globe & Mail.com

[whatnext]

Yeah, Air Canada really has that kind of power. As I pointed out upthread, the UAE threatened Canada with loss of the Camp Mirage base if they didn't accede to the demands of their air carriers for a huge increase in access. The Tories grew a pair and called their bluff.

And now we have the UAE closing their airspace to Peter Mackay's flight after he left a troop inspection in Afghanistan. A disgusting attempt at bullying Canada.
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/nati...-flight-from-afghanistan/article1752151/

[Waders]

Of course bullying does not work and now Canada has decided to exit Camp Mirage.
What exactly is at stake that can cause such a diplomatic spat?

See article "Negotiations ended, MacKay confirms Camp Mirage exit" at http://www.ctv.ca/CTVNews/TopStories/20101011/camp-mirage-talks-uae-canada-101110/

[MalcolmTucker]

Millions of dollars of air travel - the emirati are building huge airports in the region for a reason, in areas that don't have the population to anchor hubs. If they play hard ball with us, think about how they have built their networks all over the globe. They have hundreds of wide body airplanes on order, and are building multiple airports to service more than 100m people annually. They need people to fill those planes - they don't have enough oil to keep their society going on it alone, so diversification it is. Turned a small niche as the choke point between europe and asia into a huge competitive advantage, and they are expanding as much as possible. The public nature of the dispute isn't just about Canada, it is any nation that wants rights into the UAE, also it is a warning for nations like Australia that may want to limit emirati's growth when looking at bilateral/trilateral revisions.

I think Canadians often forget we are a rich country, and there are only so many rich people in the world and access to our market is worth lots of money.

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by Sir.Humphrey.Appleby

Millions of dollars of air travel - the emirati are building huge airports in the region for a reason, in areas that don't have the population to anchor hubs. If they play hard ball with us, think about how they have built their networks all over the globe. They have hundreds of wide body airplanes on order, and are building multiple airports to service more than 100m people annually. They need people to fill those planes - they don't have enough oil to keep their society going on it alone, so diversification it is. Turned a small niche as the choke point between europe and asia into a huge competitive advantage, and they are expanding as much as possible. The public nature of the dispute isn't just about Canada, it is any nation that wants rights into the UAE, also it is a warning for nations like Australia that may want to limit emirati's growth when looking at bilateral/trilateral revisions.

I think Canadians often forget we are a rich country, and there are only so many rich people in the world and access to our market is worth lots of money.

With this latest arm-twisting episode, Sir Humph, I'm starting to see your point of view. Something that baffles me is that in the UK, they fly into not only London and Manchester, but also Birmingham and Newcastle-upon-Tyne!
"Why so many destinations?" I ask myself, and why Newcastle? It's not much bigger than Saskatoon!!

[Johnny Aussie]

Originally Posted by trofirhen

With this latest arm-twisting episode, Sir Humph, I'm starting to see your point of view. Something that baffles me is that in the UK, they fly into not only London and Manchester, but also Birmingham and Newcastle-upon-Tyne!
"Why so many destinations?" I ask myself, and why Newcastle? It's not much bigger than Saskatoon!!

Dubai benefits by being in the cross roads between Europe and Asia and Europe and Australia. So pretty much any city in Europe can use Dubai as a transfer point to other places in the Middle East, India, South East Asia, East Asia, Australia etc. And Newcastle is a lot bigger than Saskatoon. Metro area is > 1 million and a good catchment area over 3 million +.

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by Johnny Aussie

Dubai benefits by being in the cross roads between Europe and Asia and Europe and Australia. So pretty much any city in Europe can use Dubai as a transfer point to other places in the Middle East, India, South East Asia, East Asia, Australia etc. And Newcastle is a lot bigger than Saskatoon. Metro area is > 1 million and a good catchment area over 3 million +.

Yes, the catchment areas in British cities are large, and my analogy was way off. Nevertheless, Emirates seems to have its tentacles deep into Europe, and Australia too. I wonder why they didn't fight it the way Canada has?

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by trofirhen

Yes, the catchment areas in British cities are large, and my analogy was way off. Nevertheless, Emirates seems to have its tentacles deep into Europe, and Australia too. I wonder why they didn't fight it the way Canada has?

You might find this interesting. I would suspect a lot of countries are question allowing Emirates unfettered access to their markets, when the playing field is not level:

Air France CEO Calls for EU Curbs on Expansion by Gulf Carriers

Air France-KLM Group is teaming up with Europe’s biggest airlines to push for European Union action to slow the encroachment of Emirates and other Gulf carriers, saying the region’s status as an air-travel hub is under threat. ...

...For the past two decades, the U.S. and Europe have agreed to withhold export credit guarantees from airlines registered in five countries where Airbus SAS and Boeing Co. airliners are built: Britain, France, Germany, Spain and the U.S. This means many European and all American carriers are denied cheaper government-backed plane financing available to rivals from countries including Gulf states....

...Emirates, the biggest Gulf carrier, already pays very little in the way of airport charges or fuel tax at its Dubai hub, as well as escaping many of the social charges that weigh on European companies, Air France’s Gourgeon said. Those benefits could generate 3 billion euros ($4.2 billion) of operating income if applied to Air France-KLM, he said....

If left unchecked, the competitive imbalance between the Gulf and Europe will eventually lead to a mass shift in stopover traffic, and other economic activities, to Middle Eastern hubs, Gourgeon said.

“I think it’s very dangerous for Europe,” he said. “What they’re trying to do is buy our jobs.”

Full article: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-10-10...curbs-on-expansion-by-gulf-carriers.html

[jsbertram]

Originally Posted by Waders

Of course bullying does not work and now Canada has decided to exit Camp Mirage.
What exactly is at stake that can cause such a diplomatic spat?

See article "Negotiations ended, MacKay confirms Camp Mirage exit" at http://www.ctv.ca/CTVNews/TopStories/20101011/camp-mirage-talks-uae-canada-101110/

Will we need to be in Camp Mirage after we've pulled our troops out of Afghanistan next year? It seems to me that an early exit from Camp Mirage is a convenient tit-for-tat with Emirates & between the two governments.

I see that none of the news articles is saying the troops were brought home, so I wonder if they've just been relocated to another "undisclosed secret base" located in a friendlier nearby country for a year or so until the Afghanistan troop wind-down happens.

[jsbertram]

Originally Posted by whatnext

If you've flown Air Canada's 767 fin # 690 you've flown on ex-Kenya plane.

http://www.planespotters.net/Aviation_Photos/photo.show?id=073437

I'm fairly confident that the AC maintenance crews made sure the plane was brought up to their air-worthiness standards before it was put into service.