Tim Hortons Field | 40m | ? | Complete

[SteelTown]

No more money for Hamilton stadium, Ottawa says

By John Kernaghan
http://www.thespec.com/news/local/ar...um-ottawa-says

The sharp backlash against the possibility of up to $180 million in federal money for a Quebec City hockey rink to host a National Hockey League team is behind the federal sports minister rejecting more money for a Pan Am stadium as home to the Tiger-Cats.

That’s the view of a source close to Pan Am stadium negotiations.

“It would just make the Quebec situation worse,” the source said.

In a media report yesterday, Gary Lunn, Minister of State for Sports, said Ottawa would not provide more money to boost Hamilton’s $102-million, 15,000-seat stadium.

That followed Prime Minister Stephen Harper’s statement that homes for pro sports team should be a private-sector endeavour.

Lunn did suggest in media reports that the Pan Am Games host corporation could redistribute the $500 million Ottawa has pledged to the 2015 Games to allow more for Hamilton’s proposed stadium.

But Hostco already faces more costs with track and field, the Games premier event, moved from Hamilton to York University, which will need an expanded stadium.

Lunn said in reports that the onus was on the private sector in Hamilton to come up with a 25,000-seat stadium for the Tiger-Cats.

[mattgrande]

Originally Posted by SteelTown

No more money for Hamilton stadium, Ottawa says

Lunn said in reports that the onus was on the private sector in Hamilton to come up with a 25,000-seat stadium for the Tiger-Cats.

Pan American Stadium | ? | ? | Approved --> Pan American Stadium | ? | ? | Cancelled

[fenwick16]

What are the options for football in Hamilton if little to no money is being contributed by the Hamilton Tiger-Cats? Which of these are viable?

1) A scaled back 25,000 seat non-iconic stadium (if the large parking garage were eliminated and it was located close to existing parking and public transit) This could be a good stadium but nothing extravagant.
2) Spending money to renovate Ivor Wynne Stadium (could it be used for the Pan-Am Games?). A complete renovation and make-over could do wonders.

Maybe Ivor Wynne Stadium should be preserved.

[SteelTown]

Mr. Lunn, the federal Sports Minister, said Ottawa will not increase its Pan Am Games contribution beyond the $500-million already promised, but did not rule out discussing an increase in the stadium’s share of the money.

“I think it’s important that they stay within the $500-million,” he said in an interview. “If they’re looking at issues to try to increase the stadium for the Ti-Cats, I think that’s great. But for the funding, it’s really important that the private sector step up to the table to meet those funding demands... We have a policy that we don’t, as a rule, build sports infrastructure for professional sports teams.”

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/...rticle1711007/

[mattgrande]

Originally Posted by fenwick16

What are the options for football in Hamilton if little to no money is being contributed by the Hamilton Tiger-Cats? Which of these are viable?

1) A scaled back 25,000 seat non-iconic stadium (if the large parking garage were eliminated and it was located close to existing parking and public transit) This could be a good stadium but nothing extravagant.
2) Spending money to renovate Ivor Wynne Stadium (could it be used for the Pan-Am Games?). A complete renovation and make-over could do wonders.

Maybe Ivor Wynne Stadium should be preserved.

Way-back-when Hostco said they wouldn't support an Ivor Wynne renovation because the funds are supposed to be for building new sports infrastructure. Things may have changed now, who knows?

[SteelTown]

Miles to go on stadium: Bob Young

Paul Morse
The Hamilton Spectator
http://www.thespec.com/sports/articl...dium-bob-young

Hamilton Tiger-Cats owner Bob Young says the latest stadium site under consideration -- the rail shunting yard at Longwood -- is exciting, but that there's still a long way to go to make it happen.

"While I'm not as pessimistic as I was three weeks ago, I'm certainly far from optimistic, and I share council's frustration and disappointment with the lack of speed on the exercise," Young said this morning at Hillfield-Strathallan College where he was honored as this year's alumni of distinction.

He said he had great faith in city manager Chris Murray's ability to make things happen.

Young said the city and Ticats have to work with the federal and province to figure out if this particular location is the right location.

"The east Mountain would have worked, and it would appear that, without doing all the homework on remediation and many other things, it would appear that the rail yards at Longwood would work."

But Young warned that there is still a very real possibility that he might pull the Ticats out of Hamilton.

"That's where we were three weeks ago -- we were done. The city had made its commitment to the west harbour, a location that wouldn't work for running a successful sports marketing operation.

"So we were out talking with every other municipality that might be able to help us. But none of those conversations were overly optimistic either," he said.

Young said the rail yards "sure looks good to me ... it's 50 acres that's right on a highway, so it has all the access we need, all the city building requirements that the city has expressed that they've wanted to invest in.

One just has to drive around that rail shunting yard to realize this is one of the most exciting pieces of property in the city, he said.

"If the commitment of the city and council is that they really want to see the investment made in downtown Hamilton, this is a location that ticks both boxes for stadium in terms of access and accessibility.

"And it appears to work for the city's goal for investment downtown."

[mishap]

Originally Posted by mattgrande

Padthai, I was under the impression that Hamilton's $45M will be coming from the Future Fund, but I can't find anything to back that up.

The city's money is very likely coming from the Future Fund. The big question is whether or not they intend to pay it back over time. At least one suggestion was made by a councillor that they treat it as a grant as opposed to a loan, ie. free money. If that's the case, we can't scream that the Ticats aren't offering any money when the city isn't.

The city originally did not want a stadium in the West Harbour area. Now that they're looking at a potentially free building, why not change that amphitheatre to a staduim, and get as many seats in there as possible?

[SteelTown]

I'm getting the impression that Bob Young is gearing up for an announcement for their funding contribution towards the stadium.

[realcity]

I'm getting the impression that this forum has jumped the shark

[highwater]

Originally Posted by SteelTown

I'm getting the impression that Bob Young is gearing up for an announcement for their funding contribution towards the stadium.

I'd be very surprised. More like he's announcing he's selling the team.

[mattgrande]

Originally Posted by highwater

I'd be very surprised. More like he's announcing he's selling the team.

I'll give him fifty bucks.

Honest question, what are the odds of a community ownership style setup?

[matt602]

Originally Posted by realcity

I'm getting the impression that this forum has jumped the shark

this.

[SteelTown]

http://www.hamilton.ca/NR/rdonlyres/...1_CMO9006i.pdf

That the CP Rail yard at Aberdeen and Longwood be forwarded to Hostco as the venue location, agreed to by the City of Hamilton and the Hamilton Tiger-Cats, for the new Pan Am Stadium.

Complete Stadium use negotiations and funding arrangements with the Hamilton Tiger-Cats by September 30, 2010

[dennis1]

Originally Posted by mattgrande

I'll give him fifty bucks.

Honest question, what are the odds of a community ownership style setup?

That was already tried and it failed.

[mattgrande]

Originally Posted by SteelTown

http://www.hamilton.ca/NR/rdonlyres/...1_CMO9006i.pdf

That the CP Rail yard at Aberdeen and Longwood be forwarded to Hostco as the venue location, agreed to by the City of Hamilton and the Hamilton Tiger-Cats, for the new Pan Am Stadium.

Complete Stadium use negotiations and funding arrangements with the Hamilton Tiger-Cats by September 30, 2010

The second line is this:
That the Province of Ontario and the Federal Government, including P3
Canada, be formally requested to provide sufficient additional funding to expand the current proposed 15,000 seat Pan Am Stadium to a 25,000 seat facility

I can't say I support that.

EDIT UPON FURTHER READING:

That the City of Hamilton request the Ministry of Transportation to review traffic impacts on Aberdeen Avenue and request a review of the potential to widen the
exit and entrance by adding two vehicle lanes in each direction and review the Main Street West interchange and Longwood Road;

I don't see a possible way to expand Aberdeen from four to eight lanes. There are houses on both sides, pretty much right at the road, before you get to Dundurn.

The Tiger-Cats have indicated a willingness to purchase part of the CP property provided that the lands purchased would be available for development purposes. The lands viewed in this regard would not include the stadium area or parking areas for the stadium.

So the money's not going to the stadium. It's going to whatever the Ti-Cats want as part of their "entertainment district."

CP Rail representatives have indicated that the price of the land will include a price per acre as well as allowances for the relocation of tenants... The relocation estimates provided by CP Rail are significant.

That certainly doesn't sound promising.

[markbarbera]

The widening of Aberdeen would be to handle additional traffic coming from the highway to the site and would not be the entire stretch of Aberdeen, likely just as far east as the Frid extension or possibly Dundurn. And two additional lanes in either direction is overkill IMO. I hope they are looking at Longwood as well, as this will likely be a significant entry and egress route link to Main and King.

According to Dreschel's article in today's Spec, funding is falling into place. Apparently the Province is willing to put more towards stadium expansion and land acquisition/remediation costs, and the Ticats have their $15 mil contribution for a portion of the land for sports precinct development, along with a commitment to cover operating expenses at the new stadium (similar to their EM proposal).

This may have been pulled from the fire, but let's see how the COW meeting goes today.

[mattgrande]

Originally Posted by markbarbera

According to Dreschel's article in today's Spec, funding is falling into place. Apparently the Province is willing to put more towards stadium expansion and land acquisition/remediation costs, and the Ticats have their $15 mil contribution for a portion of the land for sports precinct development, along with a commitment to cover operating expenses at the new stadium (similar to their EM proposal).

From The Article:
"But that only buys a 15,000 to 20,000 seat facility while the Ticats need a 25,000-seater to replace the aging Ivor Wynne. That leaves a shortfall of $25 million to $50 million, not to forget the additional cost of purchasing and cleaning up the CP lands."

That sounds like one hell of a shortfall. I'd much rather see the Ti-Cats $15m going to the Stadium than the precinct.

And oh wow, the Ti-Cats are willing to use the naming rights to cover operating expenses... which are theirs to cover.

The situation hasn't changed at all. We have the Ti-Cats asking for a brand new stadium, and they're not willing to put a damn dime towards it.

[mishap]

Originally Posted by mattgrande

The situation hasn't changed at all. We have the Ti-Cats asking for a brand new stadium, and they're not willing to put a damn dime towards it.

Neither is the City, so you'd think they'd be getting along better.

Seriously though, this is the posturing part where everybody finds out just how much they can get before they finally reach into their own pockets. The Cats will come up with something, and so will the City. I hope so, anyway.

[SteelTown]

The cost of constructing the stadium is estimated to be $160-mil. Does NOT include cost of buying CP lands.

The current funding shortfall is $34.7-million for the CP yard lands stadium proposal.

Rossini is showing a slide that states $15-mil of funding shortfall could be found from Ivor Wynne develop, ticket surcharge, and exist budg

$5-mil from Ivor Wynne district, $5-mil from ticket surcharge, and $5-mil from existing budget

Funding shortfall for velodrome is currently estimated to be about $14-mil

[SteelTown]

Bare-bones stadium for Hamilton, says manager

Emma Reilly
http://www.thespec.com/news/local/ar...n-says-manager

The city's top bureaucrat is warning councillors that Hamilton can only afford to build a bare-bones, “utilitarian” stadium to host the Pan Am Games.

“It's not going to be a Taj Mahal,” said city manager Chris Murray. “There's a very real need for us to be very practical in the design of the stadium.”

According to new figures presented to council Wednesday, a new stadium will cost about $160 million in 2012 dollars—and the available funding is falling $35-million short of that amount.

That doesn't include the costs of land acquisition and remediation, figures which are not available to the public.

The financial pressures mean Hamilton will likely build a stadium that looks more like Toronto's BMO Field than the Rogers Centre.

Currently, with the $125 million of public funding on the table, it's “within grasp” to build a pared-down 22,000-seat stadium, Murray says.

Previously, the city said it could only build a 15,000-seat stadium with that funding, a venue large enough to host the Games but too small to house the Tiger-Cats. The city is also counting on the province to help pick up some of the extra cost.

Wednesday's financial update shed new light on the stadium's tangled financial negotiations between the city and the Cats. Both sides have been discussing their contributions for months—and as the stadium site has shifted, so have the Cats' promises of funding.

The team's most recent offer lies between their financial commitments to the west harbour site—where they promised nothing—and their preferred site at the east Mountain, where team owner Bob Young said he would commit $74 million, including $15 million toward the capital costs of the stadium.

For the stadium at the CP lands near Longwood and Aberdeen, Cats president Scott Mitchell says the team is ready to buy between 10 and 20 acres of land and develop it, possibly with a hotel. The team would also take on the remediation costs of that patch of land and take on the day-to-day operating costs of the stadium. But the team hasn't committed any funding to building the stadium itself.

They also have claimed the proceeds of the naming rights for the stadium, an important slice of revenue that was expected to bring in $7.5 million.

Council will vote on the stadium site Oct. 12.