HomeDiagramsDatabaseMapsForum About
     

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Regional Sections > Canada > Ontario > Ottawa-Gatineau > Business, Politics & the Economy


Reply

 
Thread Tools Display Modes
     
     
  #181  
Old Posted Sep 10, 2010, 2:31 PM
TransitZilla TransitZilla is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,801
Quote:
Originally Posted by DubberDom View Post
This is how the Ring Road should look...

Congratulations... you've managed to route this thing right through the Leitrim Wetland and the Findlay Creek subdivision. Good luck with that...
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #182  
Old Posted Sep 10, 2010, 3:16 PM
Kitchissippi's Avatar
Kitchissippi Kitchissippi is offline
Busy Beaver
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Ottawa
Posts: 4,697
Quote:
Originally Posted by DubberDom View Post
I took the Mitch Owens route to go back home... OMG, what a disaster, it actually took 10 minutes longer.
OMG, ten full minutes?!?! Cancel the LRT and let's throw a billion dollars towards that problem.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #183  
Old Posted Sep 10, 2010, 3:48 PM
Proof Sheet Proof Sheet is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 2,986
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mille Sabords View Post
2- assured by a human-shaped piece of plastic wearing glasses that there should be absolutely no cost overruns,
What a great description of a certain candidate whose CV has a lot of ducking and diving. I'm torn as to who to vote for and in many ways your summation of the main 4 candidates was spot on and matched much of my thinking...care to do a snapshot of the candidate who is now reduced to representing the constituants of Bay Ward to ensure that a candidate who doesn't represent the people of Bay Ward could get elected.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #184  
Old Posted Sep 10, 2010, 3:49 PM
Umpaidh Umpaidh is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by DubberDom View Post
I took the Mitch Owens route to go back home... OMG, what a disaster, it actually took 10 minutes longer.

You guys are underestimating the actual demand for that 416-417 cross route. Try going from Orleans to Colonnade, Airport, Barrhaven or 416 from Orleans in rush hour

Anyway, I know I will not get support from this board since most readers are ideological urbanists who fail to understand that approximately 500,000 Ottawa residents live outside the Greenbelt
I guess you missed the part where I said that the route is 5 minutes longer, and I am one of the residents living outside the Greenbelt who regularly (every day) travels from Barrhaven to Orleans, and Barrhaven to Stittsville?
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #185  
Old Posted Sep 10, 2010, 4:02 PM
adam-machiavelli adam-machiavelli is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,246
I encourage readers of this forum to attend mayoral debates and heckle Andy until he reveals the true intent of his campaign: his 'baby' (the Transitway) is growing up and he still sees her as a precious innocent little thing that can't be disturbed.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #186  
Old Posted Sep 10, 2010, 4:08 PM
DubberDom DubberDom is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Ottawa
Posts: 201
If the city does not have an effective plan for a ring road to the south in place now, then in 20 years we'll be scrambling and trying to figure out how to move people around, and the suburbs will all be developed around the perimeter of the city, stretching from Rockland, through Limoges to Embrun, Russell on the East and Carleton Place to Kemptville on the South West over to Arnprior because the city is run by urbanauts. Gatineau will also be smiling at Ottawa's ignorance.


Why trow $3Billion into LRT when it will actually increase the time it takes for a commuter to get downtown??

Back to teh topic, Andy Haydon is only entering this race to bring back BRT to the forefront to force Watson to re-consider the LRT as Ottawa's next mayor. Once Watson concedes this, watch Haydon drop out.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #187  
Old Posted Sep 10, 2010, 4:27 PM
c_speed3108 c_speed3108 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 1,858
Quote:
Originally Posted by DubberDom View Post
If the city does not have an effective plan for a ring road to the south in place now, then in 20 years we'll be scrambling and trying to figure out how to move people around, and the suburbs will all be developed around the perimeter of the city, stretching from Rockland, through Limoges to Embrun, Russell on the East and Carleton Place to Kemptville on the South West over to Arnprior because the city is run by urbanauts. Gatineau will also be smiling at Ottawa's ignorance.


Why trow $3Billion into LRT when it will actually increase the time it takes for a commuter to get downtown??

Back to teh topic, Andy Haydon is only entering this race to bring back BRT to the forefront to force Watson to re-consider the LRT as Ottawa's next mayor. Once Watson concedes this, watch Haydon drop out.

I do believe as of the end of today the registered candidates will be on the ballot....
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #188  
Old Posted Sep 10, 2010, 6:58 PM
Cre47's Avatar
Cre47 Cre47 is offline
Awesome!
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Orleans, ON
Posts: 1,971
O'Brien's plan for freezing taxes


By Randall Denley, The Ottawa Citizen September 10, 2010 2:44 PM


OTTAWA — The last time he ran for mayor, Larry O’Brien had a firm promise to freeze taxes and no real plan. This time, he has a more realistic promise and a plan that could work, if voters and councillors have the stomach for it.

In an eight-point plan to be released Saturday, O’Brien proposes a series of tough actions that could plausibly freeze your taxes, although the O’Brien plan will certainly cut services as well. The key elements are a two-year freeze on the city’s overall wage spending, freezing departmental budgets, freezing the taxpayer subsidy for OC Transpo and a “value for money” review of all city services.

O’Brien is further promising to use the dividends from the tough new approach for spending on “city-building projects.” The message is that O’Brien wants to restrain the cost of the city’s mundane services so we can afford to spend on city-enhancing initiatives like Lansdowne revitalization and light rail.

O’Brien is vowing to personally propose a tax-freeze budget, every year. That would replace the staff- and councillor-driven budget proposals of the past and it’s an appropriate responsibility for a mayor. Obviously wiser after a term in which zero really meant 14 per cent, O’Brien is not guaranteeing that council will accept a tax freeze. He is promising to lead the way toward that goal.

The key to O’Brien’s plan is freezing the city’s $1.26 billion wage budget. O’Brien is not intending, as was previously reported, to freeze workers’ pay. He will negotiate toward that goal, but it’s not something a candidate can guarantee.

The important point, O’Brien says, is that a tax freeze and a freeze in overall wage spending will give the city some leverage in union negotiations. Advertising a willingness to increase taxes 2.5 per cent, as opponent Jim Watson has, pretty much guarantees pay increases of that size for city employees, O’Brien argues. He says, “two and a half per cent is a very union-friendly number to pick.”

The mayor says he doesn’t want to freeze taxes simply for the sake of it, but to “drive change.” Faced with the prospect of job reductions, O’Brien hopes that the city unions will be more flexible on wages and working conditions.

Freezing the overall amount spent on compensation achieves the same bottom-line goal as a wage freeze, but it implies staff cuts. That will almost certainly mean service cuts, too.

The biggest squeeze would be on OC Transpo. O’Brien wants to hold the taxpayer subsidy at $175 million. That won’t keep costs from going up. What it would mean is less bus service, higher fares, or both.

Bus riders won’t like the consequences of O’Brien’s plan but it draws attention to a fact that city councillors have chosen to ignore. OC Transpo management is predicting that service expansion and wage costs will drive city taxes up 1.5 to two per cent a year, just for OC Transpo alone. O’Brien wants to hit the brakes.

Even with an overall wage freeze, achieving the target of zero won’t be automatic. Costs for police, fire and ambulance service go up every year. O’Brien has vowed to make those services a priority, so the implication of his plan is that city spending on other services will actually decline.

Perhaps the best part of O’Brien’s plan is his determination to smoke out city council candidates on their own budget plans. He has lined up a separate group to poll all the people running for council on whether they will support his tax-freeze plan. That will make it tougher for candidates to engage in the dodging and weaving they love so much.

Jim Watson clearly wants to make this an election about taxes and O’Brien’s failure to freeze them. Not that Watson could freeze them either, but that’s another story.

Having overpromised and underperformed, it will be difficult for O’Brien to regain credibility on taxes but he has to do it to have a hope of re-election. O’Brien needs to persuade the public that when it comes to taxes, he’s still 120 proof and Jim Watson’s just a spritzer.

The plan the mayor will unveil Saturday ought to achieve that goal. This time, O’Brien has identified plausible ways to freeze taxes and he can certainly produce a budget that will achieve that goal. Whether the details will be palatable to council or the public is another matter. People like to believe that taxes can be frozen without cutting services. That’s just not the case. O’Brien knows that, now, and his new goal is to be the guy who tries hardest to get to a low number. Realistically, that’s the best anyone can do.

Contact Randall Denley at 596-3756 or by e-mail, [email protected]

© Copyright (c) The Ottawa Citizen
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #189  
Old Posted Sep 10, 2010, 7:15 PM
lrt's friend lrt's friend is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 12,811
Quote:
Originally Posted by bradnixon View Post
I'm pretty sure this would be much faster.

We definitely don't need a ring road. We need the Strandherd Bridge to be built yesterday, but that should do us for years to come.

How many people are driving through Ottawa? I don't think there's that much Montreal-Pembroke traffic...
When you think of it, the Strandherd Bridge is the first component of a new ring road. It was not so long ago that the Hunt Club Road bridge opened. If you remember back then, Hunt Club only ran from Prince of Wales to Bank Street. It was gradually extended east and west.

As I have said, a true limited access ring road will be very costly and will just encourage low density sprawl beyond the urban boundaries. Inevitably, every route into the city will be negatively impacted as most traffic will be in that direction rather than following the ring road.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #190  
Old Posted Sep 10, 2010, 7:28 PM
lrt's friend lrt's friend is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 12,811
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cre47 View Post
O'Brien's plan for freezing taxes


By Randall Denley, The Ottawa Citizen September 10, 2010 2:44 PM


OTTAWA — The last time he ran for mayor, Larry O’Brien had a firm promise to freeze taxes and no real plan. This time, he has a more realistic promise and a plan that could work, if voters and councillors have the stomach for it.

In an eight-point plan to be released Saturday, O’Brien proposes a series of tough actions that could plausibly freeze your taxes, although the O’Brien plan will certainly cut services as well. The key elements are a two-year freeze on the city’s overall wage spending, freezing departmental budgets, freezing the taxpayer subsidy for OC Transpo and a “value for money” review of all city services.

O’Brien is further promising to use the dividends from the tough new approach for spending on “city-building projects.” The message is that O’Brien wants to restrain the cost of the city’s mundane services so we can afford to spend on city-enhancing initiatives like Lansdowne revitalization and light rail.

O’Brien is vowing to personally propose a tax-freeze budget, every year. That would replace the staff- and councillor-driven budget proposals of the past and it’s an appropriate responsibility for a mayor. Obviously wiser after a term in which zero really meant 14 per cent, O’Brien is not guaranteeing that council will accept a tax freeze. He is promising to lead the way toward that goal.

The key to O’Brien’s plan is freezing the city’s $1.26 billion wage budget. O’Brien is not intending, as was previously reported, to freeze workers’ pay. He will negotiate toward that goal, but it’s not something a candidate can guarantee.

The important point, O’Brien says, is that a tax freeze and a freeze in overall wage spending will give the city some leverage in union negotiations. Advertising a willingness to increase taxes 2.5 per cent, as opponent Jim Watson has, pretty much guarantees pay increases of that size for city employees, O’Brien argues. He says, “two and a half per cent is a very union-friendly number to pick.”

The mayor says he doesn’t want to freeze taxes simply for the sake of it, but to “drive change.” Faced with the prospect of job reductions, O’Brien hopes that the city unions will be more flexible on wages and working conditions.

Freezing the overall amount spent on compensation achieves the same bottom-line goal as a wage freeze, but it implies staff cuts. That will almost certainly mean service cuts, too.

The biggest squeeze would be on OC Transpo. O’Brien wants to hold the taxpayer subsidy at $175 million. That won’t keep costs from going up. What it would mean is less bus service, higher fares, or both.

Bus riders won’t like the consequences of O’Brien’s plan but it draws attention to a fact that city councillors have chosen to ignore. OC Transpo management is predicting that service expansion and wage costs will drive city taxes up 1.5 to two per cent a year, just for OC Transpo alone. O’Brien wants to hit the brakes.

Even with an overall wage freeze, achieving the target of zero won’t be automatic. Costs for police, fire and ambulance service go up every year. O’Brien has vowed to make those services a priority, so the implication of his plan is that city spending on other services will actually decline.

Perhaps the best part of O’Brien’s plan is his determination to smoke out city council candidates on their own budget plans. He has lined up a separate group to poll all the people running for council on whether they will support his tax-freeze plan. That will make it tougher for candidates to engage in the dodging and weaving they love so much.

Jim Watson clearly wants to make this an election about taxes and O’Brien’s failure to freeze them. Not that Watson could freeze them either, but that’s another story.

Having overpromised and underperformed, it will be difficult for O’Brien to regain credibility on taxes but he has to do it to have a hope of re-election. O’Brien needs to persuade the public that when it comes to taxes, he’s still 120 proof and Jim Watson’s just a spritzer.

The plan the mayor will unveil Saturday ought to achieve that goal. This time, O’Brien has identified plausible ways to freeze taxes and he can certainly produce a budget that will achieve that goal. Whether the details will be palatable to council or the public is another matter. People like to believe that taxes can be frozen without cutting services. That’s just not the case. O’Brien knows that, now, and his new goal is to be the guy who tries hardest to get to a low number. Realistically, that’s the best anyone can do.

Contact Randall Denley at 596-3756 or by e-mail, [email protected]

© Copyright (c) The Ottawa Citizen

We better be very aware of the impact of doing something like this.

First of all, freezing departmental budgets takes decisions directly out of the hands of City Council and places it in the hands of the bureaucrats. We will not necessarily see improvements in efficiency because they are always more difficult to achieve. The result will be service cuts. Remember back around 6 or 7 years ago when an austerity budget was passed and what happened. There were irrational bus route cuts, and city looked like a disgusting mess because parks and roadsides were not being maintained.

Doing this for 4 years, will result almost certainly in a cross the board 10% service cut. Whether bus service, garbage collection, park maintenance, snow removal, police, fire and library services etc. If there are some exemptions, the cuts in the affected departments will be even higher. And then to justify these cuts to cover the cost of big ticket items will be a bitter pill to swallow.

And what do you do in the next 4 years? This is not sustainable.

I am of the opinion that there should be a reasonable inflationary increase each year so that services are sustainable and consistent. You look for efficiencies within City Hall at all times by getting councillors working with staff. By all means, cut services that are no longer a priority but across the board cuts end up cutting both the fat and the muscle.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #191  
Old Posted Sep 10, 2010, 8:54 PM
adam-machiavelli adam-machiavelli is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,246
The real problem is the limited power of municipalities to levy taxes. If they had greater autonomy, they could increase their revenues without depending solely on property taxes.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #192  
Old Posted Sep 11, 2010, 9:31 PM
reidjr reidjr is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,237
Quote:
Originally Posted by adam-machiavelli View Post
I encourage readers of this forum to attend mayoral debates and heckle Andy until he reveals the true intent of his campaign: his 'baby' (the Transitway) is growing up and he still sees her as a precious innocent little thing that can't be disturbed.
I hope people don't just to heckle.Yers people should go and ask questions people should not go and turn the debates into a side show.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #193  
Old Posted Sep 11, 2010, 9:50 PM
Cre47's Avatar
Cre47 Cre47 is offline
Awesome!
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Orleans, ON
Posts: 1,971
Mayor promises to write city budget himself if re-elected


Larry O'Brien has promised to write the city's budget himself, if re-elected as Mayor in a press conference in which he outlined an eight-point plan, Sept. 11, 2010.


OTTAWA — If re-elected mayor of Ottawa, Larry O’Brien has a plan for taking the pressure off councillors: he’ll write the budget himself.

“The buck stops with the mayor,” O’Brien said Saturday morning as he outlined his eight-point plan on city spending previously reported in the Citizen. “The mayor should put the budget out.”

O’Brien somewhat reformed the budget proceeding last year by bringing in consultant Bob Plamondon to oversee the process, taking input and suggestions from councillors and then drafting a spending plan for council to debate. The final result of that process was a property tax increase of about four per cent.

But if voters return him to the helm of city council on Oct. 25, O’Brien said his office will be responsible for crafting the entire budget, which can then be debated— and changed — by council.

This process would help O’Brien keep his campaign promise of a “goal,” but not a promise of zero tax increases, as he did with his now infamous “zero means zero” slogan from the 2006 election.

“Life changes, things happen,” said O’Brien, adding that he’d be open to increases if there was “a good reason” to do so, such to as increase public security and safety or the prosperity of citizens.

He’s even asking the current council to say ahead of the election whether it supports his budget plan.

In an e-mail to councillors Saturday, O’Brien wrote that “as the only candidate with a city-wide mandate, the Mayor’s office should — in consultation with committee chair and with the support of staff — submit the budget to council. That way we will have a single starting point, rather than competing plans at the table.”

In the e-mail, he explains that he believes the budget discussions must start from a zero increase basis, instead of a “wish-list budget,” which council has to then pare down.

O’Brien ends by asking for councillors’ “support on the above two points as a reasonable and prudent way to establish control over the $2.5 billion that the City spends every year.”

The mayor said he doesn’t expect responses from councillors for a week or two, but the strategy is part of the O’Brien team’s plan to identify candidates who would support him on his financial plans.

O’Brien has often complained that he is “just one vote” on council, which is why he has not been able to implement some of his goals, including a transit commission to oversee OC Transpo, an idea he has revived for this campaign.

He wants voters to elect like-minded councillors so he can “get the job done.” To help voters identify them, O’Brien said a couple of outside organizations — he declined to say who they were — were planning to post lists of candidates who have signed on to the mayor’s plan.

© Copyright (c) The Ottawa Citizen
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #194  
Old Posted Sep 12, 2010, 2:39 AM
lrt's friend lrt's friend is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 12,811
Quote:
O’Brien has often complained that he is “just one vote” on council, which is why he has not been able to implement some of his goals
Like substantial service cuts that will be needed to achieve a 0% tax increase.

I don't trust this man, given the whacky ideas that keep coming out of his mouth.

Given the City Council did not like what he was doing with the budget in the past, why would City Council want to give him this power? If I were them, I would not touch this proposal with a ten foot pole.

It seemed like with most significant issues, City Councillors had to take action on their own in order to bring things to a reasonable conclusion including items that Larry O'Brien is now taking credit. Why would this suddenly change?
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #195  
Old Posted Sep 13, 2010, 7:13 PM
Cre47's Avatar
Cre47 Cre47 is offline
Awesome!
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Orleans, ON
Posts: 1,971
Anyone saw Lex's video today. Unable to post the video there but will link however.

http://www.ottawacitizen.com/news/Brien+launches+election+video/3516432/story.html
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #196  
Old Posted Sep 13, 2010, 7:55 PM
Ottawan Ottawan is offline
Citizen-at-large
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Expat (in Toronto)
Posts: 738
While hilariously ridiculous as expected, his slogan "action over politics" is a good one against Watson. Watson is a career politician who hasn't achieved anything while in politics other than to avoid scandal.

*sigh* Now that the rolls are closed and we have all our candidates, I actually have to consider which one of these poor options I vote for. I wish this were 2006 again, when either Bob Chiarelli or Alex Munter would have made fine mayors. Now, O'Brien seems about as good as the rest.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #197  
Old Posted Sep 13, 2010, 8:14 PM
eternallyme eternallyme is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 5,243
Any thought of contracting out bus service (on the condition that routes cannot be cut unless approved by council in full consultation)?
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #198  
Old Posted Sep 13, 2010, 8:29 PM
Ottawan Ottawan is offline
Citizen-at-large
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Expat (in Toronto)
Posts: 738
Quote:
Originally Posted by eternallyme View Post
Any thought of contracting out bus service (on the condition that routes cannot be cut unless approved by council in full consultation)?
The problem with this is that the city would face two scenarios:

1) we contract out the full system, in which case there are few contractors able to fulfill such demand, and those that are can only do so if the contract is on a long enough term basis for them to acquire the necessary buses, employees, and other infrastructure/expertise. As a result, after the initial tender we would be hostage to whatever price that contractor demanded, as it is unlikely others would want to expend the required expense to be a true contender. We would probably pay less initially, but more in the long term.

2) we contract out on a route-by-route basis, in which case the routes that are not profitable end up with no tenders, and the city must either only run those routes which cost it the most, or give them up altogether and fail to provide transit to a large number of constituents.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #199  
Old Posted Sep 14, 2010, 12:14 AM
waterloowarrior's Avatar
waterloowarrior waterloowarrior is offline
National Capital Region
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Eastern Ontario
Posts: 9,255
There are 20 candidates for mayor.... vs 7-9 the first three elections since amalgamation
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #200  
Old Posted Sep 14, 2010, 1:37 AM
Suzie Suzie is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 245
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ottawan View Post
The problem with this is that the city would face two scenarios:

1) we contract out the full system, in which case there are few contractors able to fulfill such demand, and those that are can only do so if the contract is on a long enough term basis for them to acquire the necessary buses, employees, and other infrastructure/expertise. As a result, after the initial tender we would be hostage to whatever price that contractor demanded, as it is unlikely others would want to expend the required expense to be a true contender. We would probably pay less initially, but more in the long term.

2) we contract out on a route-by-route basis, in which case the routes that are not profitable end up with no tenders, and the city must either only run those routes which cost it the most, or give them up altogether and fail to provide transit to a large number of constituents.
How do they do it in London (UK), Australian cities and Scandinavian countries, among other places?
Reply With Quote
     
     
This discussion thread continues

Use the page links to the lower-right to go to the next page for additional posts
 
 
Reply

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Regional Sections > Canada > Ontario > Ottawa-Gatineau > Business, Politics & the Economy
Forum Jump



Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 10:49 AM.

     

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2026, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.