PHILADELPHIA | American Commerce Center | 1,510' Pinnacle / 1,210' Roof | 63 FLOORS

[MedicineMan]

Originally Posted by brian.odonnell20

Being an architect I disagree with a lot of the design elements of this building. For one thing, it's just way too tall for the skyline. the only angle it even kind of looks proportionate in is from the art museum. Although the massive height of the building is very important for the city aura and pride and things like that, I feel it just simply throws all the balance and art out of the skyline, which imo is quite beautiful as it is now, especially with the comcast center. If/when it gets built at this height there is going to need to be a 1100 or 1200 footer built to the left of it (looking at it from the stadiums/I95) to make the skyline beautiful again. Also, besides the height, the midrise is really imposing and unnecessary. It could honestly be half as long as it is and would make the whole building seem less demanding and outlandish. I like the idea of an observation deck, although there really isn't much at all to see compared to the empire state building or the sears/willis tower. And also in general I'd like for once to not have a skyscraper being built in this country that doesn't cheat its way above 1500 feet. The freedom tower is only something like 1370 without the spire and the acc is only 1210without its 300 foot spire. 63 floors? honestly? The comcast center nearly has that and its how many feet shorter??

IDK ill take take what I can though. Its like the health care bill.. i dont really like it but its a good start.

I am a guy who likes symmetry/proportion in a skyline. For me, the "Rocky" view from the Art Museum steps is the "gold standard" for the City of Brotherly Love. City Hall being the center of the universe. I frequently perform my 5AM runs on the Parkway. On many of those runs I would look toward city hall and visualize future skyscrapers on Market Street East in an attempt in my mind to balance the skyline. As someone stated much earlier; it is too bad that they can not put ACC at 8th and Market on that parking lot.
Saying that; if the choice is: ACC at its proposed location and a very disproportionate skyline vs no ACC, I to will live with the " quirky" skyline .

[brian.odonnell20]

"The building is deep into the city’s planning and approval process, which may work for Glaxo’s timeframe to make a decision before its leases expire and get the building out of the ground, according to industry sources."

"Such a gargantuan lease would mean a great deal for American Commerce and its developer. At one point, TD Banknorth was eying the building. A GSK lease would take up the majority of the tower’s 1.3 million square feet of office space and enable the developer to secure a construction loan, said a person with knowledge of the project."



Possible Glaxo move might be a boon for tower project - Philadelphia Business Journal

[Eigenwelt]

Brian, that article is from October, 2008. Glaxo has since moved out of the city.

[Onn]

Originally Posted by Eigenwelt

Brian, that article is from October, 2008. Glaxo has since moved out of the city.

Since when did that happen?

[Eigenwelt]

Originally Posted by Onn

Since when did that happen?

I may have misphrased that. GSK didn't leave the city, but about a month after that article Brian referenced Glaxo designated their Research Triangle campus as their headquarters.

So the company is based in North Carolina now, Philly is just a branch office.

[We Got Five]

That is correct, Eigenwelt.

ACC will be built when someone outside the area moves in.

Side note - I heard a scary rumor on Saturday regarding Towers Watson. Although they signed a deal for over 200,000 sf last year they have intentions to slowly move operations to VA - where Watson Wyatt was once based. This would be a huge loss for the city...especially in an era where they are trying to market themselves to new companies.

[brian.odonnell20]

you might disagree but i'm kind of over this not being built for awhile.. I know i had said before that the building could find a tenant as early as later this year, but if it doesn't I don't really care that bad anymore. After a few years of limbo this kind of lost its initial luster after realistic people started to bog it down with the truth, that it comes down to if philly can get an outside business to move in, which is virtually unheard of. I just think it's ironic that the problem with most buildings around the country with the same status right now is the funding, when acc had safely lined it up via a pension fund early on. oh well... this kind of —.. a lot. I kinda have the feeling this is going to be just a lot of rising action and no climax. Hopefully I'm wrong...

When you get right down to it, this building is not that great, and it doesn't need to get built right away. Also, I would strongly rather it be ~1100-1200ft, not 1510, but whatever. I also have a feeling this thread is going to die down until there is any news at all about this, since there really isn't anything people including me are productively writing about short of skepticism, criticism, and the root of the problem right now...

[wanderer34]

Originally Posted by brian.odonnell20

When you get right down to it, this building is not that great, and it doesn't need to get built right away. Also, I would strongly rather it be ~1100-1200ft, not 1510, but whatever. I also have a feeling this thread is going to die down until there is any news at all about this, since there really isn't anything people including me are productively writing about short of skepticism, criticism, and the root of the problem right now...

The question that I'd love to ask is why must we as a city settle for less??? I don't really see how shortening the ACC to 1200 ft will improve the aesthetics of the tower. I'd love to see this tower built in it's original form and height. I don't mind seeing alterations on the exterior, and maybe even adding condo units to it's top floors (similar to Liberty Place, and the John Hancock Tower in Chicago). I just don't like the negadelphian approach that seems to permeate all aspects of life in this city. I just wish hat we can get a better mayor than the one we have right now. Nutter's idea of development is to just tear down housing, leave empty lots causing blight in certain neighborhoods, and to put a casino in the middle of CC. WHAT A FRAUD!!!!!!

[brian.odonnell20]

I can definitely understand what your saying. The reason i'd want it shortened is only because it's over 550 feet taller than anything else, and kills any of the balance, proportion, or symmetry in the skyline existing today. The tower itself is fine for me. Believe me, I'm not trying to settle for less, its just that after more than 2 years of fruitless planning and development, with the building still lacking an anchor tenant and final city approval, its very hard to be so optimistic about this project.

The proven upside is, though, that a lot of supertalls in NYC are either getting approved or have started construction as of late, because of class A office space coming back to the national financial market. Hopefully this can carry over to Philly enough to get this tower through. The financing is there, and so is enough public support. Philly just needs to attract an outside source.

[brian.odonnell20]

And I wouldn't call nutter a fraud but he has lost a lot of ambition and is bringing the city down. He actually supports the tower, though.

[OneWorldTradeCenter]

I really like this building, it would be a great landmark for Philadeplhia. The second tallest building in North America, behind 1 WTC (Freedom Tower). But I doubt that it gets built, at least within the next 5-6 years.

[brian.odonnell20]

Originally Posted by OneWorldTradeCenter

I really like this building, it would be a great landmark for Philadeplhia. The second tallest building in North America, behind 1 WTC (Freedom Tower). But I doubt that it gets built, at least within the next 5-6 years.

The only way it gets started within 5-6 years is to have a company move to philly instead of nearby ny, which sounds pretty impossible right now with all the development in manhattan and brooklyn.
I don't care how long it takes though. I'd wait ten years for this thing.

[OneWorldTradeCenter]

Originally Posted by brian.odonnell20

The only way it gets started within 5-6 years is to have a company move to philly instead of nearby ny, which sounds pretty impossible right now with all the development in manhattan and brooklyn.
I don't care how long it takes though. I'd wait ten years for this thing.

The tenants. That's the point. NYC and Philly need tenants. NYC for its WTC-towers and Philly for that one. The problem is, that there is simply no need for office space in the entire country.

[wanderer34]

Originally Posted by brian.odonnell20

The only way it gets started within 5-6 years is to have a company move to philly instead of nearby ny, which sounds pretty impossible right now with all the development in manhattan and brooklyn.
I don't care how long it takes though. I'd wait ten years for this thing.

I'm still not sure whether Bklyn would become a viable business district in it's own right. Maybe some smaller companies can go in DT Bklyn, but I don't really see a major one moving there. If you've ever been to DT Bklyn, it's nothing more than discount stores, chicken shacks, and etc. In other words, it's like Market East, but 10X bigger. Downtown and Midtown Manhatan have always been the major CBD's in NYC.

What Philly needs to do is to extend the KOZ to the ACC, plus any other tax breaks available. I know, corporate welfare isn't my way of doing things, but if that's the only thing that's holding the tenant from coming here (TD, GSK, etc.) and getting the ACC built, than Philly and PA (especially Rendell) needs to get this rolling before the end of this year.

[brian.odonnell20]

Originally Posted by OneWorldTradeCenter

The tenants. That's the point. NYC and Philly need tenants. NYC for its WTC-towers and Philly for that one. The problem is, that there is simply no need for office space in the entire country.

The good news is that'll change coming into next year.

[OneWorldTradeCenter]

Originally Posted by brian.odonnell20

The good news is that'll change coming into next year.

I really hope so!

[brian.odonnell20]

Any ideas on tenants like Towers Perrin, KPMG, White and Williams, Beneficial Bank and Cozen O’Connor? As of 2009 they all were looking for a lot of office space.

[hammersklavier]

Well, I've heard no news but inking contracts with two of them would provide enough floor space to begin construction. It would also be a move for Beneficial Bank to brand their own named tower, if they're angling to expand.

[We Got Five]

Brian - Towers Watson will not be in Philadelphia within 5 years. They have seized most, if not all Philadelphia hiring and will move their operations to VA - where Watson Wyatt was based.

The other transactions are under 125,000 square feet...hardly enough to kick start a new building. Not to mention the gaping holes these organizations would leave in other downtown areas.

[brian.odonnell20]

just spitballin here