Ottawa Rapid Transit Network developments

[Richard Eade]

Originally Posted by eternallyme

Given the traffic patterns at that interchange, a 2-lane ramp from 417WB onto Moodie is necessary, and 2 lanes need to be maintained during the week (even using temporary structures). Full closures on weekends should be implemented though for the three relevant ramps (Moodie Drive itself shouldn't be impacted).

The problem is that an initial configuration at Moodie is required for westbound traffic to access the Transitway, unless a throw-away overpass is built from EB 417 across the lanes to the new Transitway or if you wanted to build it all the way to Kanata at once. That is only a reasonable option if the future Transitway were to be built on the south side of 417, which I don't see happening.

Overall, the best option I think is Interim B (unless a Kanata extension is built immediately in which B1 should be built right away) without the unnecessary local platform, followed by B1.

I understand that the volume coming off the 417 and along Moodie can be heavy, but now is the time to make any modifications to this area. Once the nearby buildings are re-populated the traffic will only get worse. Besides, the Moodie Bridge was recently down to one lane per direction and there were no serious problems. That can be done for one more season to get a proper transit system. I can assure you that what the City has planned will also affect Moodie.

The more I look at it, the more I want to simply build the underpass and forget about all the throw-away stuff the City is planning.



This moves the 417 ramps permanently and provides 2 right-turn, and 2 left-turn lanes for the west-bound 417 off-ramp. Moving the 417 ramps opens up the area to simplify the Transitway layout. This simplified Transitway alignment is easily extendable and convertable to rail. The only throw-away would be the turning circle at the west end of the Transitway. I have shown Bus-only lanes along the re-aligned Corkstown, but they may not be necessary. (If they are needed, they would also be throw-away, or they can be used as parking lanes for the folks visiting the Greenbelt from here.) I have also shown a possible link to the Transitway via the existing S-W Ramp loop (light blue). This option would remove one traffic signal for an east-bound bus to get to the Transitway.

In this configuration, local buses would use Moodie, with side platforms over the central-platform Transitway Station below.

I haven't even mentioned that Corkstown could even be given its own Moodie underpass to maximize the developable area around the sports field. Corkstown's access to Moodie would only be on the west side of Moodie. This modification is not shown on the diagram and is left as an excersize for the reader's imagination.

[RTWAP]

Originally Posted by waterloowarrior

Since it's not that hard to get signatures for a cause, I have a feeling we would be forced to consider PAT & Urbanaut for every project!

They'd get pretty good at marshalling the relevant arguments then, wouldn't they.

OK, so it was a half-formed thought.

[RTWAP]

Originally Posted by Richard Eade

I understand that the volume coming off the 417 and along Moodie can be heavy, but now is the time to make any modifications to this area. Once the nearby buildings are re-populated the traffic will only get worse. Besides, the Moodie Bridge was recently down to one lane per direction and there were no serious problems. That can be done for one more season to get a proper transit system. I can assure you that what the City has planned will also affect Moodie.

The more I look at it, the more I want to simply build the underpass and forget about all the throw-away stuff the City is planning.



This moves the 417 ramps permanently and provides 2 right-turn, and 2 left-turn lanes for the west-bound 417 off-ramp. Moving the 417 ramps opens up the area to simplify the Transitway layout. This simplified Transitway alignment is easily extendable and convertable to rail. The only throw-away would be the turning circle at the west end of the Transitway. I have shown Bus-only lanes along the re-aligned Corkstown, but they may not be necessary. (If they are needed, they would also be throw-away, or they can be used as parking lanes for the folks visiting the Greenbelt from here.) I have also shown a possible link to the Transitway via the existing S-W Ramp loop (light blue). This option would remove one traffic signal for an east-bound bus to get to the Transitway.

In this configuration, local buses would use Moodie, with side platforms over the central-platform Transitway Station below.

I haven't even mentioned that Corkstown could even be given its own Moodie underpass to maximize the developable area around the sports field. Corkstown's access to Moodie would only be on the west side of Moodie. This modification is not shown on the diagram and is left as an excersize for the reader's imagination.

Very interesting.

Couldn't the WB buses avoid a bunch of turns if the turning circle included a spur that connected to the 417WB on ramp? The WB buses would have a very clean flow in that case. One stop sign and one station stop and then back on the 417.

[Dado]

You know what Richard? I think the City has lost sight of what the problem is. Westbound buses aren't the ones having a problem along here - it's eastbound buses. That's what needs to be addressed.

For that we don't need to build a full two-lane + two-shoulders transitway. We just need a one-lane eastbound transitway with a shoulder that can be converted to rail in the future. Westbound buses can stay on the Queensway. Like this:



First thing, ignore the cyan/light blue lines for the moment.

All the red is more-or-less just as Richard had it.

The blue lines are for the Transitway buses. At the bottom you can see where the eastbound buses turn left onto Moodie. They then go over the Queensway, past the upper platform (and temporary eastbound Transitway platform), then proceed partly around the former parclo ramp, across the former off-ramp and then onto a new single-lane transitway heading east.

The westbound buses proceed as they do now from Bayshore and they leave at Moodie, heading for the underpass of Moodie and Moodie Station. But the station is built for future LRT as an island station, so the westbound buses head for what will one day be the eastbound LRT track. The green part of the platform is the BRT portion; there's also the requisite passing lane just before the underpass. After clearing Moodie, the buses head for the dedicated bus lane to Kanata. They can either merge with the westbound onramp traffic or there can be a second (dedicated) lane for the buses.

The more perceptive amongst you will have by now realized that the cyan lines represent the future LRT tracks. As you can see, a lot of the LRT can be built without touching the bus lanes.

Anyway, so here we avoid all sorts of temporary infrastructure - most of the temporary stuff makes uses of existing infrastructure.

[Richard Eade]

Well done! Quite true that I got caught up in the City's vision of keeping everything conventional - you know, left on the left and right on the right. To have the buses run in a counter-flow is a great alternative. The MTO should be happier because the bus flow immediately beside the general 417 traffic is now moving in the correct direction. This means that only be bus drivers who will need to worry about on-coming traffic on their right.

The big problem with counter-flowing the buses is how to get them ‘straightened out’ before the Bayshore Station. Somehow the Transitway lanes have to cross each-other.

If it is too difficult to swap the lanes at Bayshore, there could still be a compromise at the Moodie end. The east-bound buses could have their stop on Moodie, as you suggest, and then follow the S-W Ramp farther down to cross the west-bound buses before turning to the east. It would be an at-grade crossing, but I don't expect the bus volumes to be so great that it is impossible to cross. But then we lose the benefit of the counter-flow Transitway.

I do like the idea of leaving an unoccupied corridor for a rail line. I expect that a single line train (with suitable passing zones) could handle the traffic for a short time while the second track is laid over the Transitway lane.

That said, if an at-grade crossing is fine at Moodie, why not put in one at Bayshore? Space sould be the only limitation there.

[waterloowarrior]

on March 25th there will be an open house (6-9 pm @ Earl of March) on Proposed West Transitway Connections. The diagram shows the March to Terry Fox Transitway as well as the March Road and Fernbank branches (page C4 of today's Citizen).

[Dado]

Originally Posted by Richard Eade

Well done! Quite true that I got caught up in the City's vision of keeping everything conventional - you know, left on the left and right on the right. To have the buses run in a counter-flow is a great alternative. The MTO should be happier because the bus flow immediately beside the general 417 traffic is now moving in the correct direction. This means that only be bus drivers who will need to worry about on-coming traffic on their right.

Actually even the bus drivers wouldn't have to worry about that. The new contraflow bus lane and its shoulder would be built beyond the current shoulder as envisaged; it just wouldn't require the space for two lanes and two shoulders, much of which becomes redundant post-conversion. The narrowed transitway would be separated from the westbound lanes of the Queensway by a Jersey barrier, just as the 416 on-ramp is separated from the other lanes until past the Moodie off-ramp. That barrier should probably have those blind things on top of it, but other than that, nothing more is needed.

I've updated the graphic to show the cross-section.

The big problem with counter-flowing the buses is how to get them ‘straightened out’ before the Bayshore Station. Somehow the Transitway lanes have to cross each-other.

I thought about that too (unsurprisingly). One option is to simply deal with it by way of traffic signals at Holly Acres. Eastbound buses could cross Holly Acres into Bayshore (and into the right lane) at the same time that north-to-west general traffic on Holly Acres is turning onto the Queensway on-ramp, since this is an otherwise "dead" period of the cycle for all other directions and the two movements aren't in conflict (think about it!). Another option is to just build the overpass; this need not be the full two-lane overpass - it could be a single-lane overpass on the alignment of the future westbound track with allowance to the south for a future second overpass for the eastbound track (i.e. build the footings but not the overpass). In both cases, westbound buses cross Holly Acres at grade.

I do like the idea of leaving an unoccupied corridor for a rail line. I expect that a single line train (with suitable passing zones) could handle the traffic for a short time while the second track is laid over the Transitway lane.

That's what I was thinking too.

That said, if an at-grade crossing is fine at Moodie, why not put in one at Bayshore? Space sould be the only limitation there.

Not sure what you mean... I don't propose an at-grade crossing at Moodie save coming off the eastbound bus lane and turning left at Moodie. The westbound direction, as above, crosses Holly Acres at grade but goes below Moodie from the outset, although I suppose it could go up the off-ramp and back down the on-ramp on the other side (another benefit of diamonds! they're more transit friendly!), leaving the underpass for the future. Westbound express buses could just skip turning off at Moodie altogether.

[Richard Eade]

OK, so for the next iteration I have a question: Why do you have the Jersey barrier between the bus/train lanes? Since there is a full empty shoulder lane between the buses, I'd do away with that extra space. I am trying to minimize the amount of land needed and if I can get the same functionality for only 8 metres, then that is great.

In this drawing I have also minimized the cost by postponing the tunnel and simply making use of the ramp diamond. I have stolen this idea from you so I felt obligated to also steal your Profile picture and modify that too.



And, just to be clear that I think I do understand what you meant by 'un-crossing' the lanes at the Holly Acres intersection, I prepared a schematic showing the signal phases.



The signals would generally move between Phase 1 & 2 unless a bus needed to cross Holly Acres; then Phase 3, or 4, or both sequentially, would come into play.

So, what have I missed?

[waterloowarrior]

Construction of Southwest Transitway extension starts this week

http://www.ottawacitizen.com/Constructio...sion+starts+this+week/2699004/story.html
THE OTTAWA CITIZENMARCH 18, 2010 6:57 PM


OTTAWA — Construction of the Southwest Transitway extension between the Strandherd Transitway station and Jockvale Road starts this week and the city says people in the area should expect some changes.

During the first phase of construction, the two eastbound lanes on Strandherd Drive between Greenbank Road and Riocan Avenue will be shifted north so a new underpass can be built. Two westbound lanes on Strandherd will stay the same.

Pedestrians will need to use the sidewalk on the north side of the road, and the dedicated bicycle lane on Strandherd will not be maintained, the city says. [good to see the city's priorities are straight ]

OC Transpo Routes 95 (Orléans), 181 (Bayshore) and 406 (Scotiabank Place) will be detoured onto Riocan Avenue, and two new bus stops are being set up on Riocan, north and south of Marketplace Avenue. More information can be found at octranspo.com.

Businesses in the area will stay open.

The Transitway extension is a $52.6 million project that’s expected to be finished by March 31, 2011.

© Copyright (c) The Ottawa Citizen

[Dado]

Originally Posted by Richard Eade

OK, so for the next iteration I have a question: Why do you have the Jersey barrier between the bus/train lanes? Since there is a full empty shoulder lane between the buses, I'd do away with that extra space. I am trying to minimize the amount of land needed and if I can get the same functionality for only 8 metres, then that is great.

The barrier exists because the westbound lane is not exclusive to buses; it is shared between cars entering at Holly Acres and those leaving to turn north at Moodie. Having buses head directly for these people would probably freak them (and the transportation engineers) out. I also don't want idiotic drivers crashing into my trains in the future.

I've pretty much halved their RoW requirement, so I'm happy.

In this drawing I have also minimized the cost by postponing the tunnel and simply making use of the ramp diamond. I have stolen this idea from you so I felt obligated to also steal your Profile picture and modify that too.

Ya... I came up with something similar, but I put the westbound platform on the west side of Moodie and not the east side, since there is more space over there. This is what was done for years at Pinecrest and still is. That also allowed the existing on-ramp to remain in use until construction of the underpass.

And, just to be clear that I think I do understand what you meant by 'un-crossing' the lanes at the Holly Acres intersection, I prepared a schematic showing the signal phases.



The signals would generally move between Phase 1 & 2 unless a bus needed to cross Holly Acres; then Phase 3, or 4, or both sequentially, would come into play.

So, what have I missed?

That's pretty much what I was thinking.

[waterloowarrior]

http://ottawa.ca/residents/public_consult/transitway_connections/index_en.html

Proposed West Transitway Connections
(Highway 417/Eagleson Interchange to March Road North and Terry Fox Drive to Fernbank Road)
Open House #1 / Pre-Consultation
Thursday March 25, 2010
6 to 9 p.m.
Earl of March Highschool
4 The Parkway
Kanata, Ontario


[ Enlarge PDF 1.6 MB]

The City of Ottawa has initiated its pre-consultation / initial planning process for the upcoming Environmental Assessment (EA) Study for the proposed West Transitway Connections. The West Transitway Extension is a key component of the recommended interconnected system of rapid transit corridors. The Corridor offers significant opportunities for compact, mixed-used development in the vicinity of stations. This project is being undertaken to improve transit service from Ottawa’s west end to central Ottawa; and address existing and future development issues.

The formal EA process commences in the summer 2010. At that time, a Notice of EA Study Commencement will be issued. This EA Study will be undertaken in accordance with the new Ontario Transit Regulation 231/08 under the Ontario Environmental Assessment Act.

Public participation will form an integral part of the study. The first Open House has been arranged to present the study process, objectives, background and schedule, and also to provide the public and interested stakeholders an opportunity to discuss the study with the project team.

The City of Ottawa encourages interested persons to provide comments at any time during the pre-consultation or formal EA stages of this study. Please note that with the exception of personal information, all comments collected will become part of the public record.

[waterloowarrior]

the sun has a video showing transitway construction at the Barrhaven Marketplace
http://www.ottawasun.com/news/ottawa/2010/03/19/13293771.html

[Richard Eade]

The more I look at what is being produced by City Staff and their Consultants, the more I get worried for my pocket-book.

Again, going back to Moodie Drive and the Western Transitway Extension, the Staff seem to like the idea of putting the Transitway under the three ramps and Moodie - Yes, FOUR NEW STRUCTURES!



I just get the feeling that they don't understand. And it's not just because they have neatly drawn in an intersection which allows for left turns from Moodie onto the off-ramp of the 417!

But I started talking about the new bridges, so I'll continue about those: In the diagram, notice that the east side ramps will be raised by 3 and 4 metres! This is necessary, they will tell us, because the new Transitway must be kept higher than the Storm Water Pond outlet (64.23m) - otherwise, there will be an operating cost to pump water. Fair enough, but the ramp splits off the 417 at about 66.5m and must rise to 72.0m over the 250 metres to the bridge. Then cars get to drop again to about 69.5m at the intersection with Moodie. Weeeee!

Basically, if they are rebuilding the entire ramp lengths, they might as well simply move the ramps once and not have to touch them again. As it stands, the ramps will need to be modified for the Interim solution, then they will need to be rebuilt for the final solution. Both times, traffic will be disrupted.

I just can't figure out what is driving their thinking. (Maybe the Consultants are trying to plan very expensive projects so that their 15% is bigger?)

[lrt's friend]

What is the impact of the Ontario Budget on transit in Ottawa?

The only clear indication is that the bus replacement program has been cancelled.

Projects to be completed by March 31, 2011 will proceed. In Ottawa, this will be the Barrhaven Transitway extension.

There is clear indication that a number of projects in the Toronto area have been delayed, likely by several years, more likely indefinitely.

What is unclear, will we be able to tap into the $600 Million announced for our LRT project? We may not know until we move forward to the next step. What we do know is that liklihood for additional funding for other transit projects is zero for the forseeable future. We can guarantee that the Moodie Drive Transitway extension will not be funded. The western LRT line will not be funded. The North-South LRT will not be funded.

If we do still get the $600 million, we better invest it wisely and for the maximum impact because there will likely be no more money for 10 or 20 years.

[waterloowarrior]

Duncan's little cut at the LRT
http://communities.canada.com/OTTAWACITI...an-s-little-cut-at-the-lrt.aspx#comments

By DAVID REEVELY THU, MAR 25 2010 COMMENTS(1) GREATER OTTAWA

Filed under: transit, LRT, Queen's Park
The Ontario budget is postponing $4 billion worth of transit projects the province was going to pay for in Toronto. On the one hand, less transit is bad, but on the other hand Toronto's deal was so absurdly sweet that as a non-Torontonian I have difficulty weeping over it. Meanwhile, I am assured by Ottawa Centre MPP Yasir Naqvi's people, Ottawa's $600 million is safe — it's basically booked as spending in the last fiscal year, not the one they've just presented a budget for. There are undoubtedly ways they could have sucked it back, but they aren't doing it.

One fly:

The province will also scrap a program that paid up to one-third the cost of replacing city buses in all municipalities, including Ottawa, saving $50 million per year.

This was a partial replacement for an old provincial policy of routinely funding relatively small capital purchases, such as new buses. Now, says Finance Minister Dwight Duncan, cities will have to buy new buses out of gas-tax transfers. Which means basically it's just a straight cut to a regular transfer payment, since cities typically spend that money on transit already.

In Ottawa, the plan was to spend gas-tax money for many years to come on LRT plan. The amount of money we're talking about, maybe $10 million a year, isn't a fortune, but it's not nothing, either. Certainly enough to require a rejig of the LRT plan's financing, a cut somewhere else to make up the difference, or a one-per-cent tax hike.

[Richard Eade]

Looking at the next leg of the Western Transitway Extension, I think Staff have only planned for an interim solution.



I thought that I'd get the ball rolling on a more future-minded plan.



In this concept drawing, I have moved the 417 ramps into a diamond configuration (similar to what I suggested for Moodie), and I have re-aligned Campeau (requires an expropriation) and Corkstown to meet March at a right angle. Again, as before, the 417 ramps are in red, the Transitway is in blue.

This time, however, I have added a huge Park & Ride facility (yellow) with its own ramps to and from Moodie and the 417 (shown in green). I have tried to keep these as free-flow ramps. I expect that most of the vehicles arriving at the Park & Ride will come from the west via the 417 (crossing the 417 on the March Bridge), however, there might be a bunch from the 416 via the west-bound 417. There are also secondary accesses onto Campeau and Corkstown. Notice that the Park & Ride has a bi-directional car tunnel passing under Moodie beside the Transitway.

(I have suggested moving the OPP Station, but this doesn't really need to be done to accomplish most of this plan.)

What I am unhappy with is getting cars from the Park & Ride to head south on Moodie. I can add another ramp from the west lot between the two shown, but there will still be weaving with the cars heading for the west-bound 417 (the vertical red line).

Any suggestions?

[eternallyme]

Originally Posted by Richard Eade

Looking at the next leg of the Western Transitway Extension, I think Staff have only planned for an interim solution.



I thought that I'd get the ball rolling on a more future-minded plan.



In this concept drawing, I have moved the 417 ramps into a diamond configuration (similar to what I suggested for Moodie), and I have re-aligned Campeau (requires an expropriation) and Corkstown to meet March at a right angle. Again, as before, the 417 ramps are in red, the Transitway is in blue.

This time, however, I have added a huge Park & Ride facility (yellow) with its own ramps to and from Moodie and the 417 (shown in green). I have tried to keep these as free-flow ramps. I expect that most of the vehicles arriving at the Park & Ride will come from the west via the 417 (crossing the 417 on the Moodie Bridge), however, there might be a bunch from the 416 via the east-bound 417. There are also secondary accesses onto Campeau and Corkstown. Notice that the Park & Ride has a bi-directional car tunnel passing under Moodie beside the Transitway.

(I have suggested moving the OPP Station, but this doesn't really need to be done to accomplish most of this plan.)

What I am unhappy with is getting cars from the Park & Ride to head south on Moodie. I can add another ramp from the west lot between the two shown, but there will still be weaving with the cars heading for the west-bound 417 (the vertical red line).

Any suggestions?

Personally, I would only make minor changes to the interchange. I would depress the Transitway so that it goes underneath the ramps. I would build the busy N->E ramp to the south side of the Park and Ride (around the edge of it) so that pedestrians along the overpass would not have to cross the uncontrolled ramp. Since virtually no pedestrians are headed for the NE quadrant, the ramp crossings seem acceptable with crosswalks. The traffic lights at the P&R entrance would provide access to the SW quadrant.

The platforms should be directly beneath March Road so that pedestrians can easily access the station. A walkway should go beneath the S->W ramp so that pedestrians can reach Campeau and Teron easily. The Eagleson West Park and Ride should be closed and redeveloped, and a parking garage should be built on the eastern site (perhaps where the existing N->E ramp is).

[Dado]

Originally Posted by Richard Eade

Looking at the next leg of the Western Transitway Extension, I think Staff have only planned for an interim solution.

What I am looking at here? Is that supposed to be a transitway connection on the left?

(I have suggested moving the OPP Station, but this doesn't really need to be done to accomplish most of this plan.)

Looks very Marsy... (Mars... March...)

Any suggestions?

Yes... please edit your post to fix the March/Moodie confusion, including that bit about the 416!

Also, how are express buses to get on and off the transitway?

[Richard Eade]

Originally Posted by eternallyme

Personally, I would only make minor changes to the interchange. I would depress the Transitway so that it goes underneath the ramps. I would build the busy N->E ramp to the south side of the Park and Ride (around the edge of it) so that pedestrians along the overpass would not have to cross the uncontrolled ramp. Since virtually no pedestrians are headed for the NE quadrant, the ramp crossings seem acceptable with crosswalks. The traffic lights at the P&R entrance would provide access to the SW quadrant.

The platforms should be directly beneath March Road so that pedestrians can easily access the station. A walkway should go beneath the S->W ramp so that pedestrians can reach Campeau and Teron easily. The Eagleson West Park and Ride should be closed and redeveloped, and a parking garage should be built on the eastern site (perhaps where the existing N->E ramp is).

Well, the problem I have with the current set-up is that the Transitway is planned for north of the 417, but the Park & Ride is on the south. I was trying to make enough room to put a new March Park & Ride on the north side, beside the Transitway, and then close the Eagleson Park & Ride lots south of the 417. This would remove a transfer just to get across the March Bridge from Transitway Buses - unless you like to walk across, but this is not the nicest area to walk in. (I will agree, though, that the Park & Ride area I have suggested has walks almost as long as getting to the Eagleson Park & Ride, but they are within the lot which might make people 'feel' that it is less of a distance, safer, and more pleasant.)

Depressing the Transitway under the ramps is an option, but I think it would cost more than re-arranging the ramps. Because of the streams in the area, the Transitway could not be depressed very far so the ramps would have to be raised. This means rebuilding them all and adding four new structures; one for each of N->W ramp, March, S->W ramp, and the west-bound off-ramp. Also, because the west-bound off-ramp and the Transitway run close to parallel, that structure would be large and expensive. These are the same issues faced with the Moodie interchange; which is why I also suggested moving the ramps there.

[Richard Eade]

Originally Posted by Dado

What I am looking at here? Is that supposed to be a transitway connection on the left?

Yup. This is what is being planned to connect the March Road Transitway, and any Transitway east of March with the (already approved) section west of March. As I say it looks like an interim solution. I'm betting that they have a long range idea to raise March and the ramps above the Transitway, just as they are planning for Moodie. (See my comment about that in my reply to eternallyme, above.)

Looks very Marsy... (Mars... March...)

Yes, I get it. Very cleaver.

Yes... please edit your post to fix the March/Moodie confusion, including that bit about the 416!

Yes, confusion on my part; thanks. I've edited the original so that east-bound vehicles are arriving at the March Park & Ride across the March Bridge and any vehicles coming up the 416 looking for the nearest Park & Ride would be coming along the west-bound 417 and then into the March Park & Ride. Yes they are back-tracking a bit, but I think it is the closest Park & Ride for them.

Also, how are express buses to get on and off the transitway?

I think you could add an access from the Transitway into the Park & Ride area. Of course, once the train is there, you wouldn't need that access. Remember, this is a "future-minded" concept plan.