YVR Airport & Sea Island Developments Discussion

[trofirhen]

Province pushes for greater air access for Middle East airline
Emirates Airline presents study showing economic impact and new employment figures generated by flights to Vancouver
Andrew Petrozzi

British Columbia has turned up the heat on Transport Canada and the federal government’s Open Skies policy after a provincial cabinet minister stood with an airline executive to highlight the economic impact improved air access would have for the province.

B.C. Transportation Minister Shirley Bond and Emirates Airline’s senior vice-president of international affairs Andrew Parker revealed a new research report by InterVISTAS Consulting that says Emirates flights to Vancouver would bring approximately $118 million of economic benefits and create almost 700 jobs.

The projected increase would come from tourism spending, taxes and economic activity resulting from the proposed daily Dubai-Vancouver service. The report anticipates 50,968 new passengers on the route annually, as well as 312 new direct full-time jobs for a total of 689 new full-time jobs in Canada, including spin-off impacts. It anticipates $31.8 million in new direct economic activity at Vancouver International Airport, for a total of $76.6 million in total new economic activity including spin-off impacts.

It also projects $15.4 million in new direct tourism spending annually from non-resident visitors that would help generate a total of $33.5 million in new economic activity and add $8.3 million in new direct tax revenue.

“Emirates Airline is seeking federal government approval to progressively increase connections between Canada, the Middle East and Asia,” said Parker. “By growing leisure and business traffic, we can help to strengthen Canada’s tourism, trade and investment sectors – as well as increase traffic for domestic airlines.”

Bond was unavailable for comment by press time.

B.C. Premier Gordon Campbell, who was unable to attend the press conference, said in a statement: “This study identifies a great economic opportunity and highlights the need for more progress on Open Skies agreements to remove barriers to international tourism and commerce.”

Improving air access to B.C. through improved Open Skies agreements was highlighted in the recent provincial throne speech.

The InterVISTAS study also highlighted the creation of an additional 7,000 tonnes of cargo export capacity for Canadian goods between Vancouver, Dubai and other destinations. Currently, demand for cargo space for Canadian goods on Emirates flights exceeds capacity, with space routinely sold out months in advance, according to the airline.

“Emirates has been asking for additional landing rights in Canada for a decade, a request that is supported by the B.C. government,” said Parker. “This study shows that delays in approving the request are costing the B.C. economy hundreds of jobs and millions of dollars in new economic activity every year.”

InterVISTAS Consulting’s Michael Tretheway said: “Increased Emirates Airline services to Canada would provide a significant economic stimulus to tourism and trade in Canada. The increased air services would also create additional revenue for Canadian airports as no Canadian carrier currently offers these air services.”

The study also examined the economic impact of increasing service in Toronto and adding a Calgary-Dubai flight. The combined impact nationally, including B.C., would be $480 million in new economic activity and about 2,860 new jobs.

According to Transport Canada spokeswoman Maryse Durette, Transport Canada has just received the study and has not had time to review it.

“Officials continuously monitor the Canada-United Arab Emirates (UAE) market to ensure it is not underserved, as this would not be in the commercial interest of either country,” she said. “The Government of Canada greatly values the near-daily flights to Canada from the two airlines of the United Arab Emirates.”

She said that many Canadian or foreign carriers also offer one-stop service between Canada and the UAE, and that there is currently no shortage of seats to meet the demand.

“The rights under the current Canada- UAE air transport agreement meet the market demands of travellers whose origin or final destination is either Canada or the UAE,” she added. According to Durette, the agreement currently allows each carrier of the UAE – the other being Etihad Airways – to fly up to three times a week to Canada. Both carriers have decided to use all of their frequency allotment to serve Toronto only although they are permitted to fly to any other Canadian city.

But for Parker, the survey confirms that Emirates can act as a facilitator for economic growth in B.C. and Canada.

“Not only would the services create new jobs, increased tax revenue and tourism spending, but throughout our extensive global network, we would provide British Columbia with enhanced links between businesses and greater access to international capital and trade markets.” •

[email protected]

[natelox]

Air Canada CEO says letting Dubai's Emirates Airlines increase Canadian service would be 'devastating'

By JOANNE LEE-YOUNG, VANCOUVER SUN March 9, 2010

The CEO of Air Canada launched a blistering attack on recent efforts by Emirates Airlines to expand its services to Canada, saying the impact of allowing the Dubai-based airline to increase its service to Toronto and start flying to Calgary and Vancouver and would be "devastating."

Speaking publicly for the first time on the topic, Calin Rovinescu said that such an entry by Emirates would eventually diminish direct flights to Canada and "have the effect of severely damaging our hubs in Canada and our network in Europe and elsewhere."

"What Emirates wants to do is flood the Canadian market with capacity. Its strategy is to scoop up travelers going elsewhere in the world and funnel them through Dubai, further strengthening Dubai as a global flow hub," he said.

The Campbell government and YVR have been in favour of Emirates' lobbying effort, saying it's in line with their desire for Ottawa to allow freer skies that would lead to greater travel and trade. Greater access by foreign airlines is a cornerstone of B.C.'s Asia-Pacific gateway strategy.

Two weeks ago, Emirates unveiled a study that predicted economic benefits to Canada if it is allowed to expand, including $480 million of new business and almost 3,000 jobs. Rovinescu, however, described these projections as "the stuff of fairy tales" and "subterfuge." Further, he slammed attempts by Emirates to tie its campaign to "military bases necessary for our country's operation in Afghanistan."

"While its argument may be seductive, what Emirates' strategy will do is constrain the growth of Canadian airports by turning them from hubs into stubs at the end of a spoke that leads only to Emirates' hub in Dubai," said Rovinescu. "Sure, you will still be able to get to anywhere from Vancouver. But you will have to get there through Dubai."

Rovinescu told a Vancouver Board of Trade luncheon that as Vancouver tries to build itself as an Asian hub, the arrival of Emirates could significantly hurt these plans. With the awarding of approved destination status to Canada from China and the growth of the intra-Asian airline market, Air Canada "will look to capture a greater share of the Asia to North America market," he said. It plans to increase total capacity to Vancouver by 3.3 per cent in July, including a 26 per cent increase to countries in the Pacific Rim. For example, in June, it will start daily flights from Vancouver to Beijing and Shanghai, up from three weekly to Beijing and four to Shanghai.

[email protected]
© Copyright (c) The Vancouver Sun

http://www.vancouversun.com/Canada+says+...ould+devastating/2663916/story.html]Link.

[MistyMountainHop]

Air Canada seems worried that they won't be able to get away with horrible service if they're competing against another airline.

[SpongeG]

air canada just laid off another 1000 people

I met someone who works for them as an airlines steward whatever and he says the west is always screwed if u want the best routes or schedule and chances for advancemnet u have to live or base yourself in toronto or montreal but he likes it here and puts up with it

[Yume-sama]

Originally Posted by SpongeG

air canada just laid off another 1000

Which makes them giving financial advice on the part of Emirates to the Canadian government even more logical. I mean, they must know...

[Rusty Gull]

The war of words between Emirates and AC is getting pretty intense. I am hoping it stays like this - this story needs to be told beyond the business pages, as it effects everybody. Even if you have no intention to fly to Dubai, what about if you want to go to Mumbai or New Delhi? Right now, you are mostly stuck with AC's shitty routes - and chances are you have to connect in somewhere like Frankfurt.

GO EMIRATES GO!

[MalcolmTucker]

Wouldn't you rather there be a direct flight from Vancouver to India? Right now there are negotiations for a new bilateral air services agreement going on which will hopefully open the routes up.

If Emirates gets in first there will be no chance of getting that direct connection.

Plus, the UAE government linked Camp Mirage with the bilateral, which is really crass. No one gets away with bs like that, especially when the point is made through the media. The Canadian Forces will move to Bahrain or Qatar, and the UAE can go suck on it.

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by Sir.Humphrey.Appleby

Wouldn't you rather there be a direct flight from Vancouver to India? Right now there are negotiations for a new bilateral air services agreement going on which will hopefully open the routes up.

If Emirates gets in first there will be no chance of getting that direct connection.

Plus, the UAE government linked Camp Mirage with the bilateral, which is really crass. No one gets away with bs like that, especially when the point is made through the media. The Canadian Forces will move to Bahrain or Qatar, and the UAE can go suck on it.

As I understand it, the airlines in question are JET AIRWAYS, KINGFISHER AIRLINES, and AIR INDIA. The negotiations have been dragging on for three years or more. So where are the routes? Not a mention of them.
*
Also, If EMIRATES came to Vancouver, does that mean they'll siphon off all traffic to India? That would make for a rather awkward routing, zig-zagging back into into India. I would have thought they'd be more of a hub for the Middle East and Africa, The Persian Gulf, and of course Dubai itself.
...........................
But no ....... let's keep Vancouver a "spoke" city with a branch plant economy. It's so much "quainter" that way. I'd hate to see it get big and sophisticated, able to wield corporate power. Wouldn't that be AWFUL? What would Toronto do? ....
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
However, I must agree with you totally that their little arm-twisting effort suggesting closing down the Canadian base is pathetic and sucks, big time.

[trofirhen]

from The Vancouver Sun

Rovinescu told a Vancouver Board of Trade luncheon that as Vancouver tries to build itself as an Asian hub, the arrival of Emirates could significantly hurt these plans. With the awarding of approved destination status to Canada from China and the growth of the intra-Asian airline market, Air Canada "will look to capture a greater share of the Asia to North America market," he said. It plans to increase total capacity to Vancouver by 3.3 per cent in July, including a 26 per cent increase to countries in the Pacific Rim. For example, in June, it will start daily flights from Vancouver to Beijing and Shanghai, up from three weekly to Beijing and four to Shanghai.
_________________________________________

This part of Rovinescu's argument is ludicrous, and an example of "straw man" combined with trying to foster anxiety. There's no way EMIRATES is going to fly from Vancouver to Dubai, then take passengers on to places like Beijing and Shanghai, a third of the way back around the hemisphere. It's ridiculous. At this point Rovinescu is grabbing at straws.

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by trofirhen

from The Vancouver Sun

Rovinescu told a Vancouver Board of Trade luncheon that as Vancouver tries to build itself as an Asian hub, the arrival of Emirates could significantly hurt these plans. With the awarding of approved destination status to Canada from China and the growth of the intra-Asian airline market, Air Canada "will look to capture a greater share of the Asia to North America market," he said. It plans to increase total capacity to Vancouver by 3.3 per cent in July, including a 26 per cent increase to countries in the Pacific Rim. For example, in June, it will start daily flights from Vancouver to Beijing and Shanghai, up from three weekly to Beijing and four to Shanghai.
_________________________________________

This part of Rovinescu's argument is ludicrous, and an example of "straw man" combined with trying to foster anxiety. There's no way EMIRATES is going to fly from Vancouver to Dubai, then take passengers on to places like Beijing and Shanghai, a third of the way back around the hemisphere. It's ridiculous. At this point Rovinescu is grabbing at straws.

What?! You honestly believe there are that many people who want to travel from Vancouver to Dubai and vice versa? Of course Emirates just wants to turn Vancouver into a spoke to fuel their Dubai hub. To claim otherwise is ridiculous.

[twoNeurons]

I'm mixed on this one. I prefer direct flights, however, if I'm going to transfer, I'd rather choose my transfer point. Most of the locations where we would benefit from Emirates would be transfer locations that we will never have direct flights for.

Ottawa is taking a firm stance on this because they don't want Dubai to become "the hub" for all flights, but I don't think adding a couple of slots for Emirates would do that.

If you want to travel to Europe, you invariably will have to go through London, Amsterdam or Frankfurt.

Look at Emirates network in Asia:


Sure, we may lose a direct flight or two, but look at those connections. We will NEVER get direct flights to half those places.

Like it or not, they are fantastically placed to be a hub for that region. Air Canada would lose flights to other hubs, like London and Frankfurt. Air Canada ISN'T turning YVR into an Asian hub.

There's room for both here, and adding a few slots will both increase competetiveness and increase choice without flooding the market. To say otherwise is just propping up AC.

[trofirhen]

IF the Feds do what they do best; protect their own Eastern interests, and drag their feet, Emirates may well say "truck you" and fly to Seattle.

If they do, Seattle will have a great advantage over Vancouver for connections to that and other parts of the world.

Is that what Ottawa wants? Or is it just that they don't care?

[vana8]

Many of us Canadians from Vancouver based in the Persian Gulf are following this story with great interest. Until there is a direct flight to YVR from a Middle Eastern country, I guess I have to put up with transiting through a European country and waiting for up to 15 hours with my 2 kids before catching the connection.

[Yume-sama]

Originally Posted by vana8

Many of us Canadians from Vancouver based in the Persian Gulf are following this story with great interest. Until there is a direct flight to YVR from a Middle Eastern country, I guess I have to put up with transiting through a European country and waiting for up to 15 hours with my 2 kids before catching the connection.

But don't you feel better that Air Canada's employees can keep their job?

Well, other than the 1000 they just fired. And the thousands of others they've let go...

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by vana8

Many of us Canadians from Vancouver based in the Persian Gulf are following this story with great interest. Until there is a direct flight to YVR from a Middle Eastern country, I guess I have to put up with transiting through a European country and waiting for up to 15 hours with my 2 kids before catching the connection.

Unless you live in Dubai, you're still going to have to wait there to catch your flight to any middle eastern destination. What's the difference whether you wait in Frankfurt or Dubai?

As to those bemoaning the fact AC doesn't serve countries like India: there is absolutely nothing stopping Air India or Jet from serving YVR. Sad that people like to turn this into a chance to bash Air Canada, rather than standing up what's best for Canada.

[vana8]

Originally Posted by whatnext

Unless you live in Dubai, you're still going to have to wait there to catch your flight to any middle eastern destination. What's the difference whether you wait in Frankfurt or Dubai?

The difference is probably a 2-hour wait in Dubai as opposed to the 21-hour wait this December in Amsterdam or the 12-hour wait in LHR in February (for the Olympics!) with frustrated kids. If a direct flight from the Middle East to YVR on Air Canada existed, I'd definitely take that.

[Prometheus]

Originally Posted by whatnext

Sad that people like to turn this into a chance to bash Air Canada, rather than standing up what's best for Canada.

Please tell us what is best for Canada and why it is best.

[Star Scraper]

Originally Posted by trofirhen

IF the Feds do what they do best; protect their own Eastern interests, and drag their feet, Emirates may well say "truck you" and fly to Seattle.

If they do, Seattle will have a great advantage over Vancouver for connections to that and other parts of the world.

Is that what Ottawa wants? Or is it just that they don't care?

lol If there was any demand for a non-stop flight from Seattle too Dubai, one of the american carriers would already be providing it...

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by Star Scraper

lol If there was any demand for a non-stop flight from Seattle too Dubai, one of the american carriers would already be providing it...

I mentioned that because it was listed on the Wikipedia site for Seattle Airport as one of their future possible carriers..

[twoNeurons]

Originally Posted by whatnext

Unless you live in Dubai, you're still going to have to wait there to catch your flight to any middle eastern destination. What's the difference whether you wait in Frankfurt or Dubai?

Exactly! In BOTH cases, you're not flying direct. In both cases, you have to transfer in a foreign country. In addition, Emirates Air has a huge network. More choice means not having to transfer TWICE, especially given the size of Emirates network.

Again, I re-iterate, we all want to fly direct, but the reality is there is no difference between LHR, FRA and Dubai, when you have to transfer anyhow. Dubai just gives us another choice and the possibility of better connections to our destination.

As to those bemoaning the fact AC doesn't serve countries like India: there is absolutely nothing stopping Air India or Jet from serving YVR. Sad that people like to turn this into a chance to bash Air Canada, rather than standing up what's best for Canada.

What's best for [Air] Canada isn't always what's best for Canadians.

If there isn't enough demand, travellers from a few cities pool in a hub and go to their destination. Dubai is as good, if not better, than any other extra-country hub.

I'm sorry if you, or a family or friend get laid off, I really am... but I'm sure that some leeway can be given here. A compromise can be made.