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  #3041  
Old Posted Mar 2, 2010, 8:49 PM
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TonyAnderson TonyAnderson is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shakman View Post
Who are the people who made these doctors and lawyers in the first place?
High-end educational systems, with professors who usually make tons of money. But mostly though, they made themselves.

Pay should be based off of the free market, not what we currently deem as jobs that 'make a difference' more than others.
     
     
  #3042  
Old Posted Mar 2, 2010, 9:03 PM
urbanboy urbanboy is offline
 
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Something like this Hyatt Regency in Kansas City would be great for a convention hotel here in Salt Lake City:



or this one in Denver:



If Salt Lake City is awarded the GOP Convention, what are the chances we could get Hyatt Regency to build a convention hotel?
     
     
  #3043  
Old Posted Mar 2, 2010, 9:20 PM
scottharding scottharding is offline
 
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I'll take the Denver Hyatt, please.
     
     
  #3044  
Old Posted Mar 2, 2010, 9:30 PM
arkhitektor arkhitektor is offline
 
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The Denver Hyatt is much, much better looking. Plus, unlike the KC example, its design hasn't killed anybody:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyatt_Regency_walkway_collapse
     
     
  #3045  
Old Posted Mar 2, 2010, 9:44 PM
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114 people?! Holy cow.
     
     
  #3046  
Old Posted Mar 2, 2010, 10:45 PM
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I'm going to submit my vote for something along the lines of the more attractive less lethal Denver Hyatt!'

The Denver Hyatt took 2 1/2 years to build, so they would have to announce the convention now to even come close to having it built in time.
     
     
  #3047  
Old Posted Mar 2, 2010, 10:59 PM
arkhitektor arkhitektor is offline
 
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Call me a pessimist, but I doubt that a new convention center hotel will be open in time for the RNC, and I doubt that the convention will even be held here.
     
     
  #3048  
Old Posted Mar 2, 2010, 11:48 PM
urbanboy urbanboy is offline
 
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How about a Ritz-Carlton:



     
     
  #3049  
Old Posted Mar 3, 2010, 12:00 AM
scottharding scottharding is offline
 
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The last one, the Ritz-Carlton in Los Angeles is completed now. And it looks even better than the rendering.
     
     
  #3050  
Old Posted Mar 3, 2010, 1:55 AM
cololi cololi is offline
 
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My guess would be that the convention hotel will be a rather boring building. I would be thankful for something that fills in a blank spot along the street, but holding out for an above average piece of architecture, dreaming of an incredible work of art.
     
     
  #3051  
Old Posted Mar 3, 2010, 4:00 AM
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I would love to see a twisty-turny building in downtown SLC.
     
     
  #3052  
Old Posted Mar 3, 2010, 4:45 AM
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jedikermit jedikermit is offline
 
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I know I'm late to the party, but I just wanted to chime in on the state of education in Utah.

I've been teaching for seven years now. I love my job. I got my Masters Degree a few years ago in Educational Technology and Instructional Design, and I don't make anywhere near the 65K that was cited earlier. Every summer since I've been teaching, I've been taking classes, attending workshops, or traveling, frequently on my own dime, to find resources to help improve my teaching. Summer of 2008, I had three weeks "off" where I wasn't doing something; 2009 I was down to two weeks off. During that time, I'm also required to attend meetings for my school, district, and for the State Office of Education, without getting paid. Sometimes I'll get lunch out of it. A lot of that is extra stuff that I do because I either want to be a better teacher or as "networking opportunities," but much of it is required. We also don't get any other "vacation days" during the school year, so if I want to take my family on a trip, it'll be in the summer with everyone else.

BUT for many of the teachers, I don't think it's a matter of salary as much as it is the expectations of the job vs. the tools we're given to do the job. We have the largest class size in the nation, with the lowest amount of money spent per pupil. This year I have 210 students spread across six class periods, so the class size ranges from 32 - 38, depending on where they need the kids. I've presented at national conferences where teachers will share their stories about their classrooms, where they have 18 students per classroom, with a full time adult aide "to help them bear that load." Utah has trained us to think that public education should be a certain way, and we make do.

On the whole, our schools are still successful (as measured by national standardized tests), and I do attribute that more to the efforts of families and individual students than the teachers and the education system we're locked into. I would like to see changes, in the form of merit pay (based on a combination of student achievement, parent/student surveys, and administrative review), instead of a purely tenure-based system.

I do think the starting salary for teachers is an embarrassment, and I applaud former Governor Huntsman for his efforts to increase that salary. My first year, I made 18,000 for the year, and that was very difficult. Now I'm around 45,000. Some days, I feel very overpaid. Some days, not so much. I think there are many teachers who are a whiny, overprotected lot, and it's largely those people who have never worked in any other field. They don't realize quite how good they've got it. I also think there are people in the Legislature who have an ax to grind against education, and others in the private sector who want to treat education like business, assuming that anyone can do that job, and don't understand why the output isn't measuring up to what we're putting in.

My experience so far is that most Utah teachers aren't in it for the money anyway, they're in it because they want to help children. They were told they'd have job security (and they do, to an extent), health and retirement benefits, and a certain pay schedule. Now many of those things are in jeopardy, as they are for many millions of us in this economy. From last year to this year, my monthly take home pay dropped by a few hundred dollars. I'm hopeful that this will rebound, but for now I'm lucky that I have a job, and I have a job I love.

I guess that's my two cents.
     
     
  #3053  
Old Posted Mar 3, 2010, 5:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wrendog View Post
I would love to see a twisty-turny building in downtown SLC.
ME TOO!
     
     
  #3054  
Old Posted Mar 3, 2010, 5:13 AM
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UB, for some strange reason you forgot to post this CC hotel example:

Sheraton in Phoenix:

http://www.parsons.com
     
     
  #3055  
Old Posted Mar 3, 2010, 5:39 AM
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The Philladelphia convention center hotel is a really nice hotel inside, it's pretty nice on the outside too. It helps that it's in a very dense city.





     
     
  #3056  
Old Posted Mar 3, 2010, 6:01 AM
scottharding scottharding is offline
 
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JediKermit, thank your for your first-hard comments regarding education. I was very interested in the topic, though it seemed a lot of people were making the same guesses and assumptions anyone on the outside-looking-in would make.
     
     
  #3057  
Old Posted Mar 3, 2010, 6:02 AM
scottharding scottharding is offline
 
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JediKermit, thank your for your first-hand comments regarding education. I was very interested in the topic, though it seemed a lot of people were making the same guesses and assumptions anyone on the outside-looking-in would make.
     
     
  #3058  
Old Posted Mar 3, 2010, 12:39 PM
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Future Mayor, I love how the Philadelphia convention center and hotel is set up, and its location is a wonderful jumping-off point to explore the city. I think it's the only one in this discussion that I've actually been to, but I liked how it was integrated into a very dense part of town.

And Scott, thanks. I know too much has been said about education already in this development forum, but I had to get it off my chest. It's not really related to development/skyscrapers, but it could become so. If Utah became known for its failing schools, we'd see more of an impact. As it stands, we seem to do alright with the amount of money per pupil that we do spend, so nothing significant will change, except that the Legislature will whittle away at funding until something reaches a breaking point. Then the economy will eventually right itself, and they'll hem and haw about putting that money back into education. It's not an easy problem to fix, and as long as it looks successful from the outside due to test scores, it'll be on the back burner. Sadly, as is often the case with test scores, that's not the whole picture of what's happening in the schools.
     
     
  #3059  
Old Posted Mar 3, 2010, 5:09 PM
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I have stayed in the Denver Hyatt at the Convention Center. There are two Hyatts downtown so you do need to differentiate. Especially if you climb into a cab with 3 of your drunk friends, trying to find your way back to your room, after celebrating a successful Opening Day at Coors Field. Good times.

It's a great hotel and in an awesome location.

FYI-- I thought that I read in one of the reports that the soonest a hotel of this caliber could be completed is 2014. I could definitely be wrong with that info.
     
     
  #3060  
Old Posted Mar 3, 2010, 5:14 PM
arkhitektor arkhitektor is offline
 
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Something tells me that if we do get a CC hotel, especially if tax dollars are spent to build it, we'd get something like the Phoenix example, which looks more like a government ministry in Beirut than an inviting hotel.
     
     
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