Gore Park

[Berklon]

Originally Posted by SteelTown

I like it.

Let's hope no stupid short-sighted decision changes the way this is supposed to look and operate.

[coalminecanary]

I hope they put a separated bike lane there - it's a serious pain to navigate that part of King on a bike unless you want to break one-way or sidewalk-riding laws!

[highwater]

Is that a couple of giraffe I see standing in front of Queen Victoria? WTF?

If LRT ends up running on King, they'll need to lose the fence on the north side. They should lose it anyway. It's an unwelcoming physical and psychological barrier.

Otherwise, good stuff!

[SteelTown]

Yes there's two giraffes haha. The south west corner is a newspaper stand. Gore Park will be spilt into three parts, Victorian Park (that's the fountain section), Veterans Park and Sir John A MacDonald Park, his statue will be relocated in front of Royal Connaught area.

Along the south section of King you can see grey blocks with a circle, that's going to be Hamilton's version of Walk of Fame. Someone like Lincoln Alexander and perhaps Martin Short will have a block.

[matt602]

I've got to say, that looks absolutely beautiful. If the final product looks like that, it's going to do absolute wonders for downtown. Especially with an LRT line winding up the North side of King St. there.

[SteelTown]

Beware that the garden section next to Hughson St is an alternative not the preferred concept. Which is a shame I would really hope they'll include that garden section, it would be a great linkage with the fountain.

[Gurnett71]

Originally Posted by realcity

I starting to like the idea of redoing Gore. I just get worried whenever the City tries to do ANYTHING

Agreed. I think the plan will enhance the area with the pedestrian friendly concept-really like the cafe style/Hess atmosphere of the south King stretch.

[SteelTown]

The Gore Master Plan – Pedestrianization Initiative, Functional Design Study

http://www.hamilton.ca/NR/rdonlyres/...m72PW10009.pdf

[SteelTown]

A friendlier, greener Gore
Pedestrian promenade, cafes highlight new vision for park

January 19, 2010
Emma Reilly
The Hamilton Spectator
http://www.thespec.com/News/Local/article/707552

Picture a pedestrian promenade, outdoor cafes, public art and a canopy of green trees.

Now picture all of that in the heart of downtown.

The city unveiled its plan for a friendlier, greener Gore Park at a public works committee meeting yesterday. Construction on the $5-million proposal is to begin in 2012.

The centrepiece of the city's vision is a pedestrian-only area on the south side of King Street near James that will be closed to traffic except emergency vehicles.

Starting in August, the bus stops in the area will be moved to a new terminal on MacNab Street. The city will then close the street to other traffic as part of a pilot plan to test the pedestrian mall concept.

In addition to the pedestrian-only area, the plan calls for three distinct areas within Gore Park.

Macdonald Square, named for the statue of Sir John A. Macdonald, will stretch from Catharine Street to John Street North.

The middle block, between John and Hughson, will honour Hamilton's veterans with a memorial wall, the cenotaph and a public art piece.

The western block, called the Central Garden, will feature a wider sidewalk around the Gore fountain and raised flowerbeds around the Queen Victoria statue.

The whole park is based on a Victorian Carriageway theme.

Though Mayor Fred Eisenberger called the plan "terrific," he said one notable element was missing -- public washrooms.

Le'Ann Whitehouse Seely, the city's project manager of landscape architectural services, said staff have considered adding washrooms in Gore Park. However, she added, there can be problems with private areas in a public area, where illicit activities could occur.

Councillor Tom Jackson's main concern was how the plan would handle the park's 128 trees. In the 1980s, a disastrous makeover to the park saw Gore's green space destroyed to make way for several concrete block structures. The move proved to be so unpopular that it was removed for the present design.

Seely said though some of Gore's trees will come down -- either due to illness or their position -- the plans for the park call for a total of 129 trees, one more than now.

Though the city's conceptual drawings show urbane, well-dressed residents strolling through the park, the Gore has faced some image problems. The area has been recently criticized for giving the downtown the image of being dirty and unsafe.

Councillor Bob Bratina, who represents the park, has called for a cleanup of the area -- especially the north side of King between James and Catharine -- before the 2015 Pan Am Games.

[realcity]

Originally Posted by realcity

That's what I was thinking. I would like to see the water jets. But that's def too progressive.... they'll never happen.

are the water spouts still in? or Just like washrooms, they'll cause too much work and maybe policing.

[realcity]

I like it. Maybe it's me but im not seeing anything earth-shattering different. Other then the pedestranized section. That will I guess have an earth-shattering difference in how the park functions. I'm with Mayor Fred, its missing washrooms. That would be too much effort for the police though. They might have to get out of their cars.

Too funny about the giraffes. Those should be our new mounted police just hanging out, esp on weekends. That would make people feel safe.

On the south side it still just looks like a road, with sidewalks on both sides. I guess that could be useful if tents or events wanted to set up along there. Please tell me that won't be an ashphalt surface....

The trees do need to be thinned out. If you see that same angle today you can't see anything but the tree canopy.

[emge]

It's a nice redesign. I do like it. I think it is a lot better than what's there.

Going out on a (very small) limb here I still think it won't have as wide-reaching impact as it could unless the city intentionally creates attractions in and around the park - places to go and things to do - within the park and the new pedestrian area itself. The removal of the fence along King Street will help a little, in the sense that it'll connect some of the businesses to the park.

But there still need to be destinations people know of and activities they're interested in: with enough variety to keep them coming back, and enough consistency so that some things are always there.

Without that, you can engineer all the "space" you want and it'll change things somewhat. It will attract a slightly different dynamic. It will make it more pleasant.

However, it won't change what the function of the space is now, besides removing the buses: a "default" space mainly occupied by those with nowhere else to go and nothing else to do, or those who take advantage of its centrality to meet up with others for "business" purposes.

And it discourages me that washrooms are not part of the plan and that they're seen as too big of an expense, because that speaks to not planning for events and attractions there.

So I hope I see markets. I hope I see cafes. I hope I see plays and music and busking and checker tables and kids' events and petting zoos and public art and yoga classes and more. Because I like Gore Park, and I do try to spend time there - whether that's going to Al Centro when I can or reading a book in the summer there - but if the only change is to make it nicer "dead" space that won't change much.

I was thinking about a while ago and Googled some stuff.. I came back with the Project for Public Spaces site that says some of the same things, but I'm wondering what other resources there are on the topic....

I think we can do better, and I want to see the city build that into their plan as well.

[SteelTown]

Washrooms will be available at the new HSR passenger terminal building, which is what a one or two minute walk from Gore Park?

[realcity]

are the waterspouts included?

[SteelTown]

Nope. Instead it'll look like this...



More patio space and Hamilton's version of Walk of Fame.

[realcity]

that's too bad. the waterspouts were never going to go on the street anyway, they wouldn't prohibit the walk of fame or infringe on the patios which are subject to the property owners on the south side anyway. I don't see how not including them means more patios. It was a small semi circle of waterspouts around the fountain.

The pedestrian walkway, is in the exact same route that King St is now.... maybe a bit narrower.

Actually that area gets little sun. it's a north facing area and almost always in shade. Not the best location for patios.

What business will operate these 'cafes and patios'?

Scotia Bank, TD Bank, Laurentian Bank, HSBC bank, The Court House? Basically whatever patios are there now is all that'll be there when this is done. Unless the variety store gets into the patio/cafe business.

Ask any citizen of this city what was the worst thing to happen to Gore Park EVER. And they'll say, "removal of the washrooms".

[realcity]

I'm glad it's being done. It's better. But it falls short of full potential... of what it could've been.

Like most things this city does. It strove for a B- instead of an A+

[SteelTown]

Originally Posted by realcity

Ask any citizen of this city what was the worst thing to happen to Gore Park EVER. And they'll say, "removal of the washrooms".

If I read history right it was the people that demanded the washrooms to close down, it was a bit of homophobia, cleanness issue and a popular area for drug trades. I think people were more applauded about the trees.

If you watched CHCH this evening you would have seen video clips of the Gore Park massacre. I can't believe they actually flatten everything and built what looks like a cement hut and then halfway during construction decided to demolish it, thanks to Bob Morrow.

We are going on for what nearly three decades and still trying to fix Gore Park.

[realcity]

Notice the "Speakers' Corner, Celebration Stage", what was called "Performance Square" is missing. A component that was in all three original concepts is gone. Replaced with that useless globe thing and criss-crossed garden (middle of rendering). A space that would've made Gore useful as a public space.

Read the original objective was to "recapture the authenticity of the Gore". The authentic use of the Gore was for a public gathering spot, to protest and hang out. Not to look and marvel day after day at such a lovely cement 'globe' sitting in the middle of geraniums. O how lovely, and convenient that that component is missing. Check out the Gore photos when World War 2 ended. That's what it's for. Not stupid flower beds.

At least we can take our voice to web now. But 100 years ago, 'the authentic' use of public spaces like Gore were to protest and rally and to meet and loiter. We'll hang out on the web instead.

[realcity]

People demanded the washrooms close down? Every older person I talked to laments over the missing washrooms. Maybe in the 80s when there was homophobia everywhere over AIDS and ignorance I could see that. But the washrooms (or lack of) almost always comes up in a conversation about the Gore with me. Public space demands public washrooms. Private washrooms (ie Tim Horton) are private, for paying customers and you have to get a key.

Where the hell do you go when you have small kids and they have to go pee every 38 minutes?

That's only when you leave the house of course. At home kids don't drink or pee. Leave the house and 10 minutes later they're thirsty and 20 minutes later they have to pee. (Only parents will get this)


So don't ticket a homeless person when he pisses in the fountain or in a corner on Jackson Sq roof.