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  #4641  
Old Posted Dec 21, 2009, 8:38 PM
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I have a car and I take public transit especially if I'm traveling to downtown. No way am I dealing with all the traffic and parking in downtown.
     
     
  #4642  
Old Posted Dec 21, 2009, 8:55 PM
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Originally Posted by twoNeurons View Post
Also... getting into Seattle by car outside of rush hour is easy, fast, and comes with plenty of cheap parking.

There are three freeways converging on downtown.
I'd agree with that except for the cheap parking part.
     
     
  #4643  
Old Posted Dec 21, 2009, 9:13 PM
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I'd agree with that except for the cheap parking part.
Is street parking still free after 6PM in Seattle? Maybe they've changed their hours, I don't know.
     
     
  #4644  
Old Posted Dec 21, 2009, 9:39 PM
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Originally Posted by twoNeurons View Post
Is street parking still free after 6PM in Seattle? Maybe they've changed their hours, I don't know.
Yes, and still free all day Sundays. But still very expensive during the day... Over $10/day in parkades, etc.
     
     
  #4645  
Old Posted Dec 21, 2009, 9:48 PM
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Like spongeg said earlier, one of the issues with the current LINK LRT is that it doesn't take you anywhere.
Still can't believe that it doesn't go to Southcenter Mall.
     
     
  #4646  
Old Posted Dec 21, 2009, 11:00 PM
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Originally Posted by officedweller View Post
Still can't believe that it doesn't go to Southcenter Mall.
ya really a stupid move.....it would have generated a lot of passengers and the lrt line comes literally kitty korner across the I-5 interchange from the mall....
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  #4647  
Old Posted Dec 21, 2009, 11:21 PM
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Originally Posted by jlousa View Post
I don't think the number of cities that Canada has comparatively to US cities is a valid argument. It just appears that Canadian cities are able to substain public transport easier then the equivalent sized us cities. Besides our big 3 there are numerous cities across Canada with lrt systems that for numerous reasons attract higher ridership then Seattle's line. Why that is I couldn't tell you, probably dozens of small reasons more then any one big reason though.

I look forward to riding your new line next time I'm visiting.
Likewise in the U.S. there are a number of cities outside of the top 3 that have LRT systems/subway. I still think the population/size issue is relevant and not just with transit issues, but that will remain my theory.
If anyone is familiar with Seattle the neighborhoods to the south and southeast of downtown on the way to the airport are not huge destinations neighborhoods for those of us living in other areas of the city. The Rainier valley is known for low income housing and a high crime rate as compared to the rest of Seattle. There are no destination shopping centers or any real reason to take LRT other than if you already live in those neighborhoods or are heading to the airport. As has been noted Southcenter was not included along the route. Now that the airport link is finished those numbers will probably go up but not by a huge amount.
I know in Vancouver that Richmond is a large ethnic neighborhood that is home to (if I remember correct) some type of large Asian shopping mall. Probably a lot more along the route that is worth visiting. Seattle is a very pro transit city and like someone else said, we are playing catch up right now. Once the two highest density neighborhoods are connected via University link, the ridership I guarantee will skyrocket. You could argue Seattle's choice for it's first line could have been a smarter but it will just get better from here on.
     
     
  #4648  
Old Posted Dec 21, 2009, 11:25 PM
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Originally Posted by hollywoodnorth View Post
ya really a stupid move.....it would have generated a lot of passengers and the lrt line comes literally kitty korner across the I-5 interchange from the mall....
It's one of the weird things about Seattle. I know the owners of the Bellevue Square mall across the lake in Bellevue (where Link is slated to go in a few years) have fought and fought light rail and don't want it anywhere near them. I think they've even taken Sound Transit to court over it. Maybe Southcenter was the same story?

It's a total cultural difference, I think. I certainly can't imagine any major mall owner in the Vancouver area saying no to a Skytrain station next to them.
     
     
  #4649  
Old Posted Dec 22, 2009, 12:03 AM
twoNeurons twoNeurons is offline
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Originally Posted by mooks28 View Post
It's one of the weird things about Seattle. I know the owners of the Bellevue Square mall across the lake in Bellevue (where Link is slated to go in a few years) have fought and fought light rail and don't want it anywhere near them. I think they've even taken Sound Transit to court over it. Maybe Southcenter was the same story?

It's a total cultural difference, I think. I certainly can't imagine any major mall owner in the Vancouver area saying no to a Skytrain station next to them.
To be fair, I wonder if Vancouver would've been the same 20 years ago. Metrotown was built around the SkyTrain, after all.

Where did the routing for the failed Monorail go? Wasn't it a different and complementary route? I would've loved to see a true monorail system working in Seattle.

The Canada line is a completely different beast. I think what the Canada line proves, more than anything else, is that when it comes to choosing transit, one of the biggest motivating factor is speed. It's along a busy arterial and you need to make a water crossing or two by car. There's the region's largest hospital, a University, three shopping centres, City hall, and connections to almost every East West Bus route in the region. How can it NOT be successful?

I'm pretty sure people would still drive if it were significantly faster or more convenient to do so.

In Seattle, after regular business hours, I'd imagine the LRT isn't used much, mostly because it's relatively painless to just hop in the car. Also, because Seattle is quite hilly downtown, I'm sure some factor the walk into their equation.

Who wants to take the train when you'll have to walk uphill to your destination. The car's just more convenient.

Now, if they closed off some of the interstate exits downtown, and once they make the Alaskan tunnel all but bypass downtown ( is that still going forward ) you might see increased usage.

Of course, the university will add ridership, as well.
     
     
  #4650  
Old Posted Dec 22, 2009, 12:09 AM
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Originally Posted by twoNeurons View Post
The Canada line is a completely different beast. I think what the Canada line proves, more than anything else, is that when it comes to choosing transit, one of the biggest motivating factor is speed. It's along a busy arterial and you need to make a water crossing or two by car.
I agree with that 100%. I think it's the same reason the WCE is so successful. Now convince the "railforthevalley" crowd and Stephen Rees.
     
     
  #4651  
Old Posted Dec 22, 2009, 12:56 AM
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I agree with that 100%. I think it's the same reason the WCE is so successful. Now convince the "railforthevalley" crowd and Stephen Rees.
Yup - speed is the king...As for Rees I have maybe seen one positive post in the last 100 on his site on any topic so there is no helping that.
     
     
  #4652  
Old Posted Dec 22, 2009, 1:04 AM
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Speed is why I take skytrain and WCE, love it!

I also noticed in Japan that speed is a major factor in its transit system, almost no at grade rail networks (and if they do have them, they are rarely the main system).
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  #4653  
Old Posted Dec 22, 2009, 1:19 AM
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Yes, and we need a WCE going south below the Fraser River as well ! Faster public transport is the only way to attract more users. Right now, people south of Fraser either won't go to downtown Vancouver (not frequently) or drive there simply because it's just so much easier.
     
     
  #4654  
Old Posted Dec 22, 2009, 1:26 AM
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I would love to see a WCE south of the Fraser as well, at least to Abbotsford.

Then we could have a true multi-platform rail station with both WCE trains (Mission bound & Abbotsford bound) leaving Waterfront at the same time. Would be so cool. In Osaka I always took the Hankyu train back home and several of the trains would leave Umeda station at the same time (the station has 8 or 10 bays) and they would play a really cool short song before they would leave. Would be so great to have at least a taste of that in Vancouver.

WCE should operate more like a Hankyu train (which is heavy rail, sometimes at grade (akin to CPR or CNR with ROW), some times elevated) but instead of being very 10 mins, WCE should be every half hour during peak times, and an hour during off peak. Build a 3rd rail now!
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  #4655  
Old Posted Dec 22, 2009, 9:17 AM
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Here are the new signs I was talking about earlier, this one is a shot at Waterfront Stn this afternoon.

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  #4656  
Old Posted Dec 22, 2009, 9:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mooks28 View Post
It's one of the weird things about Seattle. I know the owners of the Bellevue Square mall across the lake in Bellevue (where Link is slated to go in a few years) have fought and fought light rail and don't want it anywhere near them. I think they've even taken Sound Transit to court over it. Maybe Southcenter was the same story?

It's a total cultural difference, I think. I certainly can't imagine any major mall owner in the Vancouver area saying no to a Skytrain station next to them.
I hope for Seattles sake. That some moron doesn't start shouting off about how the LINK has really poor numbers and why should they build it out more.
     
     
  #4657  
Old Posted Dec 22, 2009, 10:01 AM
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Thanks, deasine! Our little transit system is growing up..
     
     
  #4658  
Old Posted Dec 22, 2009, 4:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Metro-One View Post
Speed is why I take skytrain and WCE, love it!

I also noticed in Japan that speed is a major factor in its transit system, almost no at grade rail networks (and if they do have them, they are rarely the main system).
Cost and Convenience and the fact that most employers pay for your transit pass to work also are factors.

More expensive to run a car. Elevated roads are fast and tolled ( until recently ) and surface roads are slow. Trains run on time almost all the time. High density limited geography. Japan has lots going for it when it comes to trains. Some of it people created, some of it geologic.
     
     
  #4659  
Old Posted Dec 22, 2009, 5:49 PM
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West Coast Express
South Fraser Express
Boundary Bay Express

Does anyone have ridership statistics for the first couple of years for Skytrain? I wonder how many of them came from buses and how many of them came from cars.
     
     
  #4660  
Old Posted Dec 23, 2009, 8:22 PM
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SkyTrain service back except downtown Vancouver stations after Expo Line problem

Wednesday, December 23rd, 2009 | 8:40 am

Canwest News Service

METRO VANCOUVER – Expo Line SkyTrain is back in service between Stadium Station and Surrey after an earlier switching problem Wednesday morning.

SkyTrain is running as far as Stadium Station, leaving Waterfront, Burrard and Granville as the only stations without service.

A bus bridge is running a loop through downtown Vancouver from Stadium Station to take passengers to their destinations.

...

http://www.kelowna.com/2009/12/23/skytra...couver-stations-after-expo-line-problem/
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