Canada Line | Completed

[officedweller]

Originally Posted by allan_kuan

That money isn't quite useful I think. Yes... it's nice to have $400000 back for how many turned-off transit users who had to go through the mess? =S

True - but it's not as if we save any money from SkyTrain disruptions... so better than pissed off passengers and no money.

[Millennium2002]

True I guess.

[mr.x]

Report: Canada Line won't be breaking even until 2025
Despite ridership, over $14 million will be lost annually

Lyle Fisher VANCOUVER (NEWS1130) | Thursday, November 12th, 2009 5:41 am

VANCOUVER (NEWS1130) - Even though the Canada Line is drawing over 80,000 riders per day, the mega-transportation project will be a money loser for years to come. That's the conclusion in a recent report from B.C.'s Comptroller-General.

It cost $2 billion to build and it's predicted to lose anywhere from $14 to $21 million annually until the year 2025. TransLink's Ken hardie says the costs are partially the result of how the public-private partnership was worked out with the aim of getting most of the project paid for up front, similar to paying off your home mortgage early.

NDP transportation critic Harry Bains thinks the Canada Line is one of the main reasons that TransLink is struggling to meet its budget targets. But transportation experts believe the benefits of the Canada Line outweigh the total cost due to the number of cars that it takes off the raod.

[WarrenC12]

I hate stories like that with no background info. Was this worse or better than the initial planning estimates? Just give us the cost recovery %, I'm sure it's way better than many bus routes, but less than the busiest routes, and the Expo Line.

[nname]

I'm sure the 98 B-Line, the 48x and 49x express bus, the 35x and 60x together lost more than this annually, and they won't break even before Richmond sinks under the ocean!

[CLC]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

I hate stories like that with no background info. Was this worse or better than the initial planning estimates? Just give us the cost recovery %, I'm sure it's way better than many bus routes, but less than the busiest routes, and the Expo Line.

I'm pretty sure a lot of readers would think 14 million a year is a "huge loss". Prepare for the flood of comments that would appear on Vancouver Sun and Province website.

From Province article, seems that Translink actually didn't provide any updated ridership figure for Canada Line. The media still quote the average daily ridership of 83,027 for the period from Sept. 9 to Oct. 6. I wonder what's the issue that no new ridership # has been mentioned?

[officedweller]

Well - how reasonable is the expectation that a subway line breaks even?
Why don't they use the same measure for bus routes?

Hmmm...

[The_Henry_Man]

How long did it take the Expo/Millenium Lines to break even in terms of cost? I smell double-standard here.....

[The_Henry_Man]

Originally Posted by CLC

I'm pretty sure a lot of readers would think 14 million a year is a "huge loss". Prepare for the flood of comments that would appear on Vancouver Sun and Province website.

From Province article, seems that Translink actually didn't provide any updated ridership figure for Canada Line. The media still quote the average daily ridership of 83,027 for the period from Sept. 9 to Oct. 6. I wonder what's the issue that no new ridership # has been mentioned?

And what most people don't realize is that Translink loses at least 4-5 million annually due to fare evasion anyway but did NDP take note of that as well? Course not.

[SpongeG]

nothing comes for free - i think most reasonable people realize this but they are not vocal like the negative people are

[NucksFanInVan]

Originally Posted by mr.x

[SIZE="4"]
It cost $2 billion to build and it's predicted to lose anywhere from $14 to $21 million annually until the year 2025.

No question it cripples Translink's cash flow that much more, but it seems to me that the $700,000,000 in up-front construction costs paid by the private partner deserve a bit more attention...

Anyone have a quick number on what the annual payments would be if the government had to borrow that much at say 3% interest?

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by SpongeG

nothing comes for free - i think most reasonable people realize this but they are not vocal like the negative people are

Bill Good had a short segment on the Canada Line this morning. Almost everybody thought it was a great line, costs were fine, overall a success.

Many comparisons were made to systems around the world, indicating the price was good, and fare evasion needs to be delt with via faregates or something similar.

[Zassk]

Has Millennium Line covered its operating costs yet? I recall that it was getting close, but I don't know where to find specific info.

I confess that I thought Canada Line was intended to cover its costs at 100,000 ridership... but it sounds like it will need higher 2025 estimated ridership to cover its costs (what will that be, 140,000/day?).

[mr.x]

Originally Posted by CLC

Prepare for the flood of comments that would appear on Vancouver Sun and Province website.

From Province article, seems that Translink actually didn't provide any updated ridership figure for Canada Line. The media still quote the average daily ridership of 83,027 for the period from Sept. 9 to Oct. 6. I wonder what's the issue that no new ridership # has been mentioned?

Zweisystem

November 12, 2009 - 11:17 AM
Flag this as Inappropriate

83,000 passengers, surely means 83,000 trips made by about 41,500 people, if it were not then the RAV Canada Line instantly doubled the number of people using the previous bus services! As TransLink hasn't crowed about that, then the 83,000 passenger trips roughly work out to the number of passengers who previously used the bus. In essence, TransLink spent close to $3 billion to give current bus riders a more inconvenient and longer trip!

But how many RAV customers are using the U-Pass, that lovely $25 a month student pass that is bankrupting TransLink. Let's see if a student in Vancouver takes a bus to RAV or RAV then a bus to school, The Canada Line's portion of that fare is $12.50 a month - no wonder TransLink is bankrupt!

railforthevalley.wordpress.com/.../the-apportioned-fare-what-is-it-will-translink-do-it




http://www.theprovince.com/business/Cana...pite+strong+ridership/2213875/story.html

[Metro-One]

I really, really hate that guy. He is honestly the strangest dude I have ever heard of, save a mass murderer.

Are bus trips not measured in the same fashion? Would not 41,500 trips on a bus line per day = only 20750 passengers a day? (one there one back).

Also not to mention the line is likely closer to 90 000 or above today and with more cars, and C car extensions could eventually carry well over 200 000 a day.

ugh...

[Yume-sama]

I don't know if I ever expected to hear NDP talking heads come out *against* public transportation.

Hint: Absolutely not a single one of their billions in social expenditures would have made a dime. Ever.

[GeeCee]

Originally Posted by SpongeG

nothing comes for free - i think most reasonable people realize this but they are not vocal like the negative people are

Yup. Everyone's just concerned about their own personal tax burden rather than seeing infrastructure being built for everyone.

[Yume-sama]

Originally Posted by GeeCee

Yup. Everyone's just concerned about their own personal tax burden rather than seeing infrastructure being built for everyone.

People whining on a news website during the middle of the work day probably aren't contributing much to the tax base, anyways.

[GeeCee]

Originally Posted by Yume-sama

People whining on a news website during the middle of the work day probably aren't contributing much to the tax base, anyways.

Eh, people who have the time to do that kind of thing are probably in management and thus are contributing to the tax base, but make enough money that they don't think they should have to take transit and whine about their taxes being used for it.

Edit: wait a minute, we're whining on a forum during the middle of the work day.. LOL!

[Yume-sama]

Originally Posted by GeeCee

Eh, people who have the time to do that kind of thing are probably in management and thus are contributing to the tax base, but make enough money that they don't think they should have to take transit and whine about their taxes being used for it.

Edit: wait a minute, we're whining on a forum during the middle of the work day.. LOL!

Yeah, but I'm in management.