Metro Vancouver Transit Discussion

[hollywoodnorth]

Originally Posted by dreambrother808

Why would running a B-line down Kingsway mean there could be no Rapid Bus in Surrey? Those Langley/White Rock/Surrey plans are already in place.

As for the 19 on Kingsway, it's a slow, well-used route that could use a B-line.

agreed. the 19 and 106 are BUSY. and to have a Bline go down Kingsway connecting all the NODES would be brilliant.

[BCPhil]

Originally Posted by dreambrother808

Why would running a B-line down Kingsway mean there could be no Rapid Bus in Surrey? Those Langley/White Rock/Surrey plans are already in place.

As for the 19 on Kingsway, it's a slow, well-used route that could use a B-line.

Because articulated buses are expensive, and for every one you buy to run a parallel route to Skytrain is one less you can buy to introduce nonexistent service elsewhere. Translink's budget is already stretched thin, there is no money available to copy Skytrain service with buses. We should be spending our money the other way around, replacing highly used bus routes with Skytrain.

From Metrotown to Main Street, Kingsway is the same block after block. There aren't any "centers". And Kingsway is one of the slowest roads in the region, a B line probably wouldn't be that much faster than regular bus service. Just increase the frequency of the 19 and 25 because 25 serves the west end of Kingsway really well and connects with Nanaimo station.

To the East of Metortown, it could use more local bus service. A route from Metrotown down Imperial would be a great service. But the only "centers" not on the Skytrain are Middlegate and Royal City Center (if Middlegate counts as a center and not just a glorified plaza), but both are served by the 106 between them, and by various other bus routes.

[twoNeurons]

Clearly, we need a monorail down Kingsway... or a gondola.

[dreambrother808]

Originally Posted by BCPhil

Because articulated buses are expensive, and for every one you buy to run a parallel route to Skytrain is one less you can buy to introduce nonexistent service elsewhere. Translink's budget is already stretched thin, there is no money available to copy Skytrain service with buses. We should be spending our money the other way around, replacing highly used bus routes with Skytrain.

From Metrotown to Main Street, Kingsway is the same block after block. There aren't any "centers". And Kingsway is one of the slowest roads in the region, a B line probably wouldn't be that much faster than regular bus service. Just increase the frequency of the 19 and 25 because 25 serves the west end of Kingsway really well and connects with Nanaimo station.

The 19 is largely slow because it has to stop at every — stop.

Overcrowding on Skytrain is helped by improved bus routes. I am quite sure that the people making these decisions do a lot of studies to determine what is the best use of their money, what needs will be in the future, and how to meet them, etc. It's not simply a matter of frivolous spending here and there.

This isn't really an argument for me, because I agree that service needs to improve elsewhere as well. I just don't see how working on this one route means that plans elsewhere won't go through. I don't see how crapping on someone else's improvements elsewhere in the region necessarily helps your own. It simply creates an "us vs. them" mentality that I think is unhealthy.

[jlousa]

The B-line would not come into effect for years, it's simply on the radar, and it would eliminate having to switch buses at Metrotown to continue a trip, not to mention not stoping at every other block. There are numerous hubs along the stretch and it's set to densify very quickly. While a street car would be nice, I don't see the need anytime soon, a B-Line would be great though.

The 19 is already at capacity, it's back up to 6min headways at peak time, quite the change from when they cut it to 20min service when the skytrain opened, it killed alot of businesses along Kingsway.

[deasine]

TransLink has changed a few of the announcements (for the better). Stadium is now announced as Stadium-Chinatown (finally), and Waterfront Station is announced as "Waterfront, Terminus Station. Transfer to Canada Line, Sea Bus, and West Coast Express. Terminus Station." ProTransBC, what about changing the announcement at Waterfront for the Canada Line to indicate the possible connections. Also, what do you think of standardizing messages?

"The next station is (Terminus Station) Waterfront. Please change at Waterfront for the (Canada Line), (Expo Line), (Millennium Line), SeaBus, and the West Coast Express."

What I really think SkyTrains should do is:

1. Announce the next station with connections right when the train leaves the station.
   "The next station is, (terminus station), (station name here). (List possible connections with format above)."
2. Before train doors open, announce the arrival. This announcement is useful for those who missed the first one, and for the blind to indicate that the doors are about to open.
   "Now arriving at (terminus station), (station name here)."
3. When the train doors are open, announce where the train is bound for.
   "This is a (line name here) train for (terminus station here)."
4. Before chime runs, at the station platform (not on the train), announce that the train doors are closing.
   "Please stand clear of closing doors."
5. Chime, doors close. Back to #1

[The Lonely Tanner]

Kingsway use to have a street car *way* back in the day, maybe it'll come back again? (I think there was even a lobby group at some recent point?) Since Burnaby is now upgrading Kingsway to 3x3 instead of its 2x2 format by Boundary, maybe it'll be more likely.

And Vancouver is trying to break up the monotony of the street a bit; Kingsway & Knight is slated for further densification.


W.R.T the redevelopment of areas around the expo line in Vancouver, does anyone know if priority areas have been established? Like around Nanimo where there are huge grassy fields? And no lights?

[usog]

Originally Posted by deasine

TransLink has changed a few of the announcements (for the better). Stadium is now announced as Stadium-Chinatown (finally), and Waterfront Station is announced as "Waterfront, Terminus Station. Transfer to Canada Line, Sea Bus, and West Coast Express. Terminus Station." ProTransBC, what about changing the announcement at Waterfront for the Canada Line to indicate the possible connections. Also, what do you think of standardizing messages?

"The next station is (Terminus Station) Waterfront. Please change at Waterfront for the (Canada Line), (Expo Line), (Millennium Line), SeaBus, and the West Coast Express."

What I really think SkyTrains should do is:

1. Announce the next station with connections right when the train leaves the station.
   "The next station is, (terminus station), (station name here). (List possible connections with format above)."
2. Before train doors open, announce the arrival. This announcement is useful for those who missed the first one, and for the blind to indicate that the doors are about to open.
   "Now arriving at (terminus station), (station name here)."
3. When the train doors are open, announce where the train is bound for.
   "This is a (line name here) train for (terminus station here)."
4. Before chime runs, at the station platform (not on the train), announce that the train doors are closing.
   "Please stand clear of closing doors."
5. Chime, doors close. Back to #1

I've always wondered, why do they use the phrasing terminus station instead of something more...I don't know, colloquial? I have never ever heard the word terminus used outside of skytrain before, where it was the first time I've seen that term used. Oh and is it just me or do some of the messages for Broadway-Commercial mention platform numbers now? I swore I heard them being mentioned in the announcement the other day.

[Rusty Gull]

Streetcar down Kingsway would rock.

Either way, I love Kingsway -- congestion and all. It's the closest thing we have to one of the great avenues of Los Angeles, minus the palm trees of course!

[osirisboy]

seriously?? kingsway is the most friggin ugliest street i have ever seen

[Spork]

Originally Posted by osirisboy

seriously?? kingsway is the most friggin ugliest street i have ever seen

^^^

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by osirisboy

seriously?? kingsway is the most friggin ugliest street i have ever seen

I have to agree with you on that one!! It's almost as if they went out of their way to make it ugly. When I was a child, its ugliness was further exacerbated by a forest of tacky, tacky neon and electric signs. Most of them have gone, but Kingsway would look better if someone nuked it!!

[Metro-One]

Kingsway is not that bad, it looks like an urban street, it does not try to pretend to be something it is not.

Is it a marvel, nope, but does it do its job, yep. Since Vancouver has no true freeway/high capacity road heading to or near downtown, roads such as Kingsway have had to essentially become our "freeways" by default.

Also I like Kingsway from Joyce east to Edmonds, it has a big city feel as it passes though Metrotown. In fact, one of the best things is driving west along Kingsway from Edmonds to Metrotown on a hot summer evening, it makes one feel as if they are in LA. It is nice that not every street in Vancouver looks the same, it is good for different areas to have different feelings.

[kylemacmac]

Originally Posted by Metro-One

....Also I like Kingsway from Joyce east to Edmonds, it has a big city feel as it passes though Metrotown. In fact, one of the best things is driving west along Kingsway from Edmonds to Metrotown on a hot summer evening, it makes one feel as if they are in LA. It is nice that not every street in Vancouver looks the same, it is good for different areas to have different feelings.

Not hating on Kingsway, cause the mere fact that a Bino's still survives on Kingsway speaks of its uniqueness as a street, but I'm sure I speak for others when I say there is no need for Vancouverites to feel as though they are in L.A....when they are still in Vancouver.

[Metro-One]

Ok, I feel like I am driving in the suburbs of Buenos Aires then, is that better? You know, not everyhitng about LA is horrible and not everyhitng about Vancouver is great.

LA may have smog but Vancouver has far to much smug.

Just because a street gives of the sensation of LA does not make it bad. What gives that stretch of Kingsway the "LA" sensation IMO is the fact that it rides along the top of the crest of a large hill, therefor giving it a very "big sky" feeling, which one often gets in the Sun Belt (hence why I said hot summer evening). Also, there is a Greek restaurant there with about 15 large palm trees that give the LA feeling as well, as does approaching the Metrotown skyline, which, with its office towers in the evening sun, gives it a mini downtown LA style skyline silhouette. Also, it is very ethnically diverse, with a very wide range of restaurants.

Honestly, Vancouver's largest problem is how high our horse has become.

We seem to get so offended here if someone says an area of Metro-Vancouver feels like LA, or wherever, but we will willingly accept a comment in which someone says another area (such as any area of a city in NA where many new glass condos are built) feels like Vancouver.

Here you go guys:

Richmond feels like a suburb of Hong Kong
Burnaby feels like LA in places
Surrey feels like middle America
New West downtown looks and feels like tiny New York
Kits and the west end feel like San Fran
Gastown feels like eastern Canada or Europe
Lougheed town center is becoming mini Korea
Pitt Meadows feels like Amsterdam with all the dikes and farms

etc...

oh no, did I just hurt Vancouver's feelings?

Saying that somewhere feels or looks like somewhere else is a commonly used technique to describe the feeling or vibe an area gives off, and while we use it for areas that are common in our lives, people in other cities (as we even see on this forum) will refer to areas of their cities or towns as feeling "like Vancouver."

[geoff's two cents]

Metro-One, I think you've got the topic pretty much covered.

Not a huge fan of Kingsway in Burnaby myself, though I'm quite fond of the street as it runs through the Collingwood and Mt. Pleasant neighborhoods. As it is, Collingwood is only loosely connected to the Skytrain (much like the Stadium station to Chinatown). I'd say there's a case to be made in connecting these otherwise disparate parts of the city via rapid transit - at some point in the future, anyways.

[ryanmaccdn]

NYC's Subway Announcements are by far the best at getting you direct info.

Check this out.

It gives you info on available station transfers and clearly explains its routing and next stop.

I think the tone of voice with slight Western twang adjustment would be perfect. I think the male voice/female voice gets the point across.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lSTU5jxJ8lE

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by Metro-One

Ok, I feel like I am driving in the suburbs of Buenos Aires then, is that better? You know, not everyhitng about LA is horrible and not everyhitng about Vancouver is great.

LA may have smog but Vancouver has far to much smug.*1

Honestly, Vancouver's largest problem is how high our horse has become.*2

Richmond feels like a suburb of Hong Kong
Burnaby feels like LA in places
Surrey feels like middle America
New West downtown looks and feels like tiny New York
Kits and the west end feel like San Fran
Gastown feels like eastern Canada or Europe
Lougheed town center is becoming mini Korea
Pitt Meadows feels like Amsterdam with all the dikes and farms

etc...


Saying that somewhere feels or looks like somewhere else is a commonly used technique to describe the feeling or vibe an area gives off, and while we use it for areas that are common in our lives, people in other cities (as we even see on this forum) will refer to areas of their cities or towns as feeling "like Vancouver."

*1.Smug: Yes, it is. (Not as bad as Toronto, but inching upwards)

*2.That's true; our city has delusions of grandeur nonpareil. (rather like the naked emperor in the tale by Hans Christian Andersen)


Your point is well-made, Metro, and I often chime with you on many things. However, it is possible to let our imaginations get us carried a little far afield.*

> While it's true that some areas of the city may have a tang of another, I don't thing Kingsway is like a chic, palm-lined L.A. boulevard, and I cannot understand how downtown New West feels like a tiny New York - unless you're talking about New York in the early 1800s.

> As for Gastown feeling like Europe; I'm sorry, but making things out of brick, even with a few old lanes, doesn't create Europe! It feels more like Main Street in Disneyland than anything else.

> Pitt Meadows may feel like rural areas of the Netherlands, yes ... but NOT Amsterdam, with its old narrow houses, coffee shops, canals, Red Light District, the Concertgebouw....

> The demographics of Richmond and Lougheed Town Centre lend a certain credence to your statement, but architecturally there is little comparison.

> Kits and the West End like San Fran? Stretching it a bit, but there are similar views, and similar vibes ... here and there.

> Burnaby WOULD feel like L.A. in places, if it had eight-lane freeways intersecting in massive spaghetti junctions, and if the hills of North Burnaby were more chic and elegant in the design of the homes.

> The one place you parallelled fairly accurately was Surrey. It does feel like SOMEWHERE in Middle America, (that being the easiest place for us to imitate, as, although in Canada, we are culturally part of "Middle North America").

We have a great city with great potential, yes. But please, let's keep our feet on the ground. Vancouver is simply Vancouver, nothing more, nothing less. It's up to us to give it more character and enhance its beauty and nascent dynamism. THEN people will start to say "... oh, I almost feel as if I'm in Vancouver ! !"

[WarrenC12]

Hahaha nice Metro-One!

[WarrenC12]

Thomas Prendergast is leaving to run the biggest public transit system in the world, NYC.

Funny enough I found this link while looking for more details:

http://www.masstransitmag.com/online/article.jsp?id=6424&siteSection=16

So, clearly he's been wanting to go back home for a while.