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  #1401  
Old Posted Sep 17, 2009, 10:58 PM
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I wanted to bring this pic that Tony had posted on the Ogden thread over here to the SLC thread. I feel very strongly that in the right locations, there would be a market for this type of condo in downtown Salt Lake.

Also, I would like to encourage the occasional Gateway Project's lurker to rethink some of the facades on Rio Grande. I think Gateway has been a tremendous benefit to the community, but it needs tweaking in certain areas where the beige stucco, and bland, no details finish, detracts from the quality of the Gateway experience.


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  #1402  
Old Posted Sep 18, 2009, 3:41 AM
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It would actually look good to have a whole set of these together (like townhomes / rowhouses), maybe each with a bit different color and styling.
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  #1403  
Old Posted Sep 18, 2009, 4:37 AM
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Please, why do we have to resurrect a style that is over 100 years old? Are we forward or backward thinking? Architecture shouldn't have to be hindered by nostalgia or fear of the new and modern.

On the positive side, it is always good to see a proposal for an infill condition.

Last edited by Orlando; Sep 18, 2009 at 5:37 AM.
     
     
  #1404  
Old Posted Sep 18, 2009, 4:52 AM
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Nice, but for the price does it also include.......

the decorative tagging as well? I mean, if I'm forking out the kind of dough that a place like this is likely to cost I want to know I'm paying for high quality tagging and not just common street graffiti!

Quote:
Originally Posted by delts145 View Post
I wanted to bring this pic that Tony had posted on the Ogden thread over here to the SLC thread. I feel very strongly that in the right locations, there would be a market for this type of condo in downtown Salt Lake.

Also, I would like to encourage the occasional Gateway Project's lurker to rethink some of the facades on Rio Grande. I think Gateway has been a tremendous benefit to the community, but it needs tweaking in certain areas where the beige stucco, and bland, no details finish, detracts from the quality of the Gateway experience.


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  #1405  
Old Posted Sep 18, 2009, 5:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Orlando View Post
Please, why do we have to resurrect a style that is over 100 years old? Are we forward or backward thinking? Architecture shouldn't have to be hindered by nostalgia or fear of the new and modern.

On the positive side, it is always good to see a proposal for an infill condition.
Why do we have to get all worked up over architects and builders giving homage to a tried and true design and style? I don't mind copy catting one bit if it works. Further, each design tends to have its own take on that same theme, which can give it its uniqueness.

While I am not a connoisseur of architecture and design, as some here are, I welcome this kind of design, especially if it has some elements that make it unique to the area.
     
     
  #1406  
Old Posted Sep 18, 2009, 6:05 AM
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Why do we have to get all worked up over architects and builders giving homage to a tried and true design and style? I don't mind copy catting one bit if it works. Further, each design tends to have its own take on that same theme, which can give it its uniqueness.

While I am not a connoisseur of architecture and design, as some here are, I welcome this kind of design, especially if it has some elements that make it unique to the area.
This design is so early 20th century. Do you copy technology from 100 years ago? This kind of mentality is what we learn to try hard to fight against in architecture school, the mentality of the nostalgic american public. Europeans aren't nostalgic like this. They have the real past. Do us Americans try to make up for our lack of it by trying to copy the past? I say preserve what we have and move on with respect of the past and hope in the future.
     
     
  #1407  
Old Posted Sep 18, 2009, 7:18 AM
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I agree with you when you say we should preserve what elements of the past we have left, however, I'm not sure I agree completely with what they are teaching you in architecture school; I don't see anything wrong with reviving old styles of architecture.
     
     
  #1408  
Old Posted Sep 18, 2009, 7:29 AM
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Orlando

I appreciate your insights, but I have to respectfully disagree. Many of the world’s greatest buildings have borrowed elements, or are complete 'rip-offs' of Egyptian, Greek and Roman architecture, but yet they are still engaging and awe inspiring. I am not adverse to modern architecture and I am excited and hopeful for what the future creations that will yet emerge, but I would hate to see certain styles die out in the pursuit of whatever the current trend is now. Imagine if we decided that we shouldn’t pursue democracy because it was an old idea? The reason that we are who and what we are now is due to the fact that there was a past before us. Architecture helps to document that past. Isaac Newton said If I have seen further than others, it is by standing upon the shoulders of giants.” So, I agree that we should look to the future and be excited for what is yet to come, but let’s remember the past because it might help us to envision more profound creations than we thought previously imaginable.
     
     
  #1409  
Old Posted Sep 18, 2009, 11:34 AM
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Very well said Scaperdude. My own native city of Paris is thought by the largest number of people to be the most beautiful core in the world. Yet, if Paris were to suddenly lose those pieces of architecture, whose elements had been brought forward from past cultures, it would be a very sparsely developed city indeed. Even Rome, is a conglomeration of styles and elements brought forward from previous cultures and centuries.

There are many projects in Europe, which are a direct result of nostalgia. It is very common for Europeans to resurrect lost architectural treasures. Entire cities have been recently restored, down to the most miniscule of details. Europeans appreciate the most comtemporary of architectural styles, (which are by the way never 100% original), but are also very active in restoring, rebuilding and resurrecting past styles and elements.

Salt Lake City would be well served to resurrect certain lost buildings, such as The Gardo House. I would be a big proponent of rebuilding structures such as the Newhouse Hotel or the original Salt Palace, with of course, certain improvements. At the same time we can continue forward with those Gehry or Safdie type, etc. projects, which we feel are appropriate for our downtown.

Look at The Broadway Lofts, and that entire emerging district. Is that not a style, whose elements are borrowed
from heavily? Yet, I think The Broadway has received more raves from the forum at large than any local or most national projects.

Of course, we do not use the exact same technology of yesteryear. We use those structural and seismic advances, which are most up-to-date. Anyone, architect or not, realizes it is possible to both take advantage of seismic and Green advances, and at the same time, incorporate the detailing, warmth, and charm of the past.

Last edited by delts145; Sep 18, 2009 at 12:35 PM.
     
     
  #1410  
Old Posted Sep 18, 2009, 3:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Orlando View Post
This design is so early 20th century. Do you copy technology from 100 years ago? This kind of mentality is what we learn to try hard to fight against in architecture school, the mentality of the nostalgic american public. Europeans aren't nostalgic like this. They have the real past. Do us Americans try to make up for our lack of it by trying to copy the past? I say preserve what we have and move on with respect of the past and hope in the future.
I think your architecture teachers have some personal biases. As a design student I can tell you there is nothing wrong with referencing aesthetic styles of the past. As long as the quality and thought that went into the original projects is there, why not build new versions? Some of those old styles were popular because there was so much thought for aesthetic principles put into them, which is something that can't always be said for modern architecture. I think the most important thing to making something last is quality.
     
     
  #1411  
Old Posted Sep 18, 2009, 8:24 PM
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I think your architecture teachers have some personal biases. As a design student I can tell you there is nothing wrong with referencing aesthetic styles of the past. As long as the quality and thought that went into the original projects is there, why not build new versions? Some of those old styles were popular because there was so much thought for aesthetic principles put into them, which is something that can't always be said for modern architecture. I think the most important thing to making something last is quality.
I can see both sides of this coin. I like modern architecture a lot, but don't necessarily have a problem with recreating older styles of architecture. My biggest problem with creating something like that proposed in Ogden is it will most likely utilize really cheap, tacky looking materials and will end up really awful looking. Pretty much all the new architecture that references old styles looks tacky and fake because they use cheap, modern materials that aren't suited to those older styles. And I just end up being disappointed when the finished result looks nothing like the rendering.
     
     
  #1412  
Old Posted Sep 18, 2009, 9:19 PM
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There's a huge difference between stealing and re-creating. I have nothing against (hold on, let me use everyone's description) reviving old styles, borrowing elements of past styles, resurrecting lost architectural treasures, or referencing aesthetic styles of the past. In another thread, it was suggested that Salt Lake should build an exact duplicate of something in another city, or basically just transplant something as opposed to using actual designs. Every architect and designer is inspired by something, but they can't call themselves architects or designers if they don't design anything. Stealing is not designing. But simply using basic styles is not the same as stealing. That is why I am not against going for old styles, but am opposed to building duplicates unless you're trying to copy something specifically (like Paris in Las Vegas).

I don't have anything against those styles, but as any smart design student should know, it is very rare for a modern-day building to be built to the same aesthetic standards as original examples of the style. Times have changed, as procedures in construction has changed, so have quality, effort, and attention. Furthermore, people just don't put as much money into buildings anymore. If you've ever been to DC, this is obvious. You look at buildings like the Library of Congress and are amazed by the quality and beauty of the building, and can't imagine something like it being built today. And surrounding those old, magnificent buildings, are much newer government buildings, which are bland, boring, and obviously much cheaper to build. If the government were to build something like the U.S. Capitol, Washington Monument, Supreme Court, LOC, White House, etc. today, people would be outraged, point their fingers, and complain that their money is being wasted. Even with enough money, however, I think it's just too unrealistic to expect modern day buildings to be built to the same standards as old masterpieces. The Harold Washington Library is a good example of a building designed to look old, but still utilizing more modern decoration. I think it was executed well, as many do, but many also think it is hideous. When compared to, say, Salt Lake's Library, I think most people would prefer Salt Lake's, despite the fancy ornamentation and high-quality old-looking design of Chicago's.
     
     
  #1413  
Old Posted Sep 19, 2009, 12:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Orlando View Post
Please, why do we have to resurrect a style that is over 100 years old? Are we forward or backward thinking? Architecture shouldn't have to be hindered by nostalgia or fear of the new and modern.

On the positive side, it is always good to see a proposal for an infill condition.
Because that was back when they actually created something worthwhile. Nowdays it's all about making it as cheap as possible. In fact, that's why those designs aren't replicated anymore, despite the idea that many people love them. You make it sound as if it was just the style of the day and at some point people got tired of it the look, when I think that styled died because of a desire to be cheap instead.

I'm not saying every new building needs to look like that, but it would be nice to throw them in as well.

And how can you compare technology to design? Would you say Picasso's paintings are lame nowdays because they're 100 years old?
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  #1414  
Old Posted Sep 19, 2009, 12:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Orlando View Post
This design is so early 20th century. Do you copy technology from 100 years ago? This kind of mentality is what we learn to try hard to fight against in architecture school, the mentality of the nostalgic american public. Europeans aren't nostalgic like this. They have the real past. Do us Americans try to make up for our lack of it by trying to copy the past? I say preserve what we have and move on with respect of the past and hope in the future.
I love that rendering and would love to see buildings like this built all over the city. But I don't love it because of a nostalgia. I love it because of it's aesthic appeal, and what appears to be the quality of the building. I agree with TonyAnderson that most contmporary designs look cheap. I still am torn on my feelings of 222 south main. I love the infill, I like the design, but I'm not a fan of the materials. It looks cheap to me.
So I don't think this is an attempt to "copy the past" at all. I think it's an attempt to build something that is proven to have a widespread appeal.
     
     
  #1415  
Old Posted Sep 19, 2009, 4:38 AM
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A photo from tonight.

Sunset over Main Street

     
     
  #1416  
Old Posted Sep 19, 2009, 4:29 PM
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What a great shot...

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A photo from tonight.

Sunset over Main Street

The sky is gorgeous and the area is one that most take for granted. What a revealing shot to display that downtown section. Is that between 1st and 2nd south?

Whereever, very very nice!
     
     
  #1417  
Old Posted Sep 19, 2009, 5:07 PM
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That is surreal...

You gotta do an entire photo thread one of these days. It'd be a classic.
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  #1418  
Old Posted Sep 19, 2009, 11:35 PM
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What a revealing shot to display that downtown section. Is that between 1st and 2nd south?
Yeah, it's from the top of the Regent Street Parking Garage--between 1st and 2nd South, between Main and State Street. Great shot, T-Mac!
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  #1419  
Old Posted Sep 21, 2009, 12:33 PM
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Beautiful shot T-Mac. Thanks for sharing.

I've noticed the colors are beginning to change. Wow, October will be here before we know it!!
     
     
  #1420  
Old Posted Sep 21, 2009, 4:08 PM
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Thanks guys.
     
     
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