Canada Line | Completed

[Metro-One]

Also Canada is a very provincial nation and French has been artificially pressed onto BC. Honestly, BC's history has very little to do with French. In fact, unlike the rest of Canada, BC even had a very heavy West to East migration pattern, along with the East to West pattern. And the Spanish have much more to do with BCs history than the French do! Ever notice how many places on Vancouver Island and area have Spanish names?

All I know is French classes during my years in elementary school were seen as a foreign joke to almost everyone I knew and once we reached high-school almost everyone switched their 2nd language to Chinese, Japanese or Spanish. You know, useful languages in the Greater Vancouver Area.

Geographically speaking (and historically speaking) there is more reason for the United Kingdom to instate French as an official language than here in BC.

The very idea that we should have French forced upon our metro is laughable.

[mrjauk]

Originally Posted by Metro-One

Also Canada is a very provincial nation and French has been artificially pressed onto BC. Honestly, BC's history has very little to do with French. In fact, unlike the rest of Canada, BC even had a very heavy West to East migration pattern, along with the East to West pattern. And the Spanish have much more to do with BCs history than the French do! Ever notice how many places on Vancouver Island and area have Spanish names?

All I know is French classes during my years in elementary school were seen as a foreign joke to almost everyone I knew and once we reached high-school almost everyone switched their 2nd language to Chinese, Japanese or Spanish. You know, useful languages in the Greater Vancouver Area.

Geographically speaking (and historically speaking) there is more reason for the United Kingdom to instate French as an official language than here in BC.

The very idea that we should have French forced upon our metro is laughable.

If it were not for the fact that French--unlike Spanish, Chinese, Greek, Pashto, etc--is one of Canada's two official languages. I've met many people over the years who have complained about "French being rammed down their throats." When I ask them if they know any French, they claim they don't. Then I respond that either the government didn't do a very good job of throat-ramming, or the person is full of **it.

[BCPhil]

Originally Posted by deasine

Even 33rd Avenue and 57th Avenue has the platform shell already done.

Really? I was unaware they actually have shells all done. Who says they don't have any foresight? They have at least a little.

I used to be against the idea of having a 33rd ave station, but the train goes so painfully slow through those curves. They may as well add the station ASAP as it won't slow down the end to end time by more than the dwell time of the train at the station. And it would be nice to have service to QE Park and the Children's/Women's hospital (for the employees) and then change the #33 bus to go down 33rd Ave end to end (not having the #33 on 33rd in the West side sort of creates this void of East-West bus access).

I'm still not sure of the 57th Ave station though, it's the fastest part of the trip and going that distance without stopping is what give the Canada Line its advantage over driving.

As for worrying about 50 or 80m platforms, who knows what the future has in store. Instead of needing 80m platforms, it might be simpler and more warranted to add other mass transit corridors. Main Street for example is a very busy bus. Even though it's only a few blocks away from the Canada Line, it might be necessary to put high capacity streetcars on Main street. It would be a similar situation to the Spadina Streetcar following just a few blocks west of the Toronto Subway.

Instead of fretting over 80m platforms for double length trains it might be better to invest the money it would have cost to do it on putting an inexpensive tramtrain down the Arbutus, Granville, Main, or Commercial street corridor. It might or might not do much to alleviate future pressure off the Canada Line, but it would definitely bring rapid/mass transit to more people.

Does anyone know if the Canada Line has already affected volume on the #3 or 17, for better or worse? Do you think people who live in the south side will take the Canada Line from downtown to 49th or Marine and then travel East instead of packing onto the busy #3 all the way from downtown? I would. If I still lived near 70th and Granville I would take the C-Line to Marine and the bus to the west instead of ride the 10 all the way.

[BCPhil]

Originally Posted by Metro-One

Geographically speaking (and historically speaking) there is more reason for the United Kingdom to instate French as an official language than here in BC.

The very idea that we should have French forced upon our metro is laughable.

Geographically speaking, French is an official language in 29 countries and is heavily used in over 50. English is official in 53 and heavily used in well over 80 and Spanish is official in 21. Chinese is official in 3 (counting territories of China as China) and except for pockets of Chinese abroad (like Vancouver) isn't "primarily" used in other countries.

Hindi is the second most popular language in the world with native speakers, but is only used in India and Surrey. A common language with populations does not mean it is widespread around the world.

So Geographically speaking, if you knew French and/or English, and spun a globe and pointed at a random country and went there, odds are you would know the primary local language. If you only know Mandarin and do the same, unless you are lucky enough to land on China, HK, or Richmond, you would have a difficult time communicating.

That is why French and English are official languages for the Olympics. Odds are that people coming to the Olympics can speak 1 of those 2 languages (naively or secondly) AND odds are that the Olympics will be IN a country where 1 of those languages is primary, or heavily used.

Even though Chinese and Hindi are popular languages, it would do more of international trade as a whole to add Spanish to the list of Official Languages.

As for Canada, if you travel outside the tight knit Asian communities in the lower mainland and Toronto into the rest of the country (the majority of our land mass), you'll soon find a much higher % of people who speak French over Mandarin, it's just a bit more difficult to find them based on looks (but there are an increasing number of African and Caribbean immigrants who speak French).

As a home language, in Canada English is used by 20.5 million people (67% of us), French is spoken in the home by 6.6 million (19%) and Chinese by 790,000 (2.6%). There is a lot more to Canada that a few square miles around No 3 road.

Having Chinese signs in Richmond makes sense because of the community, but French is part of the Canadian Identity and Culture and IS the second most used language in the Country. If learning French is laughable, then so is maple syrup, hockey and Bryan Adams, and I would kindly ask you to stop making fun of us.

[CLC]

Originally Posted by deasine

Future Jugo Juice

Photography by Deasine - Hosted on Picasa Web Albums - Creative Commons Protected

Which underground stations have jugo juice?
(I know it has been mentioned hundreds of page ago)

I still can't believe that elevated stations (Richmond stations and Marine Drive ) are not going to have any store, they are all as high passenger traffic as at least King Edward

[officedweller]

Pacific Boulevard will just get worse - we have two intersections without left turn bays - Richards abd Davie. That narrows the street to one through lane. But the biggest back-up is in the curb lane under Granville Bridge where West End through traffic, cars entering from Richrads, and cars exiting and entering to/from Granville Bridge create gridlock.
For me to get from Yaletown to Burrard marina for paddling practices (with gear etc.) it's now faster to take a longer route across Cambie Bridge, 2nd Ave and north on Burrard.

[Metro-One]

Geographically speaking, French is an official language in 29 countries and is heavily used in over 50. English is official in 53 and heavily used in well over 80 and Spanish is official in 21. Chinese is official in 3 (counting territories of China as China) and except for pockets of Chinese abroad (like Vancouver) isn't "primarily" used in other countries.

Hindi is the second most popular language in the world with native speakers, but is only used in India and Surrey. A common language with populations does not mean it is widespread around the world.

So Geographically speaking, if you knew French and/or English, and spun a globe and pointed at a random country and went there, odds are you would know the primary local language. If you only know Mandarin and do the same, unless you are lucky enough to land on China, HK, or Richmond, you would have a difficult time communicating.

That is why French and English are official languages for the Olympics. Odds are that people coming to the Olympics can speak 1 of those 2 languages (naively or secondly) AND odds are that the Olympics will be IN a country where 1 of those languages is primary, or heavily used.

Even though Chinese and Hindi are popular languages, it would do more of international trade as a whole to add Spanish to the list of Official Languages.

As for Canada, if you travel outside the tight knit Asian communities in the lower mainland and Toronto into the rest of the country (the majority of our land mass), you'll soon find a much higher % of people who speak French over Mandarin, it's just a bit more difficult to find them based on looks (but there are an increasing number of African and Caribbean immigrants who speak French).

As a home language, in Canada English is used by 20.5 million people (67% of us), French is spoken in the home by 6.6 million (19%) and Chinese by 790,000 (2.6%). There is a lot more to Canada that a few square miles around No 3 road.

Having Chinese signs in Richmond makes sense because of the community, but French is part of the Canadian Identity and Culture and IS the second most used language in the Country. If learning French is laughable, then so is maple syrup, hockey and Bryan Adams, and I would kindly ask you to stop making fun of us.

I don't care much for hockey (can't skate and only really watch the Canucks) and Brian Adams is laughable.

And you already answered the questions, the majority of speakers around the Canada line are Chinese, hence why it makes no sense to put French on our metro system. And I have been around a lot of BC, and I have never been anywhere that has a considerably large French presence (if anything a lot of central BC has a strong German presence).

Again, you seem to missing all the points about BCs history and geographical location. French is not important here, no more than any other language really, so I do not think it should be slapped on our announcements and labels when so many other languages are much more useful throughout BC than it is.

[zivan56]

I just took it for the first time today, and I have to agree that the stations are too short. However, even worse is the fact that they are too narrow. Everyone bunches up near the entrance and there is no way to reach the other end of the platform unless I walk over the yellow strips on the edge.
The trains are already too crowded...I took it today from 1-1:30pm back and forth and every train was standing room only. I can only imagine how it will be a sardine can during rush hour after labour day (or even now).

[metroXpress]

FYI-

Portland MAX light rail- Green Line opens on Sept 12th, 2009!

[Metro-One]

Nice looking trains, how about that, the 3 largest cities in the PNW all open a new metro line this year!

[GeeCee]

But yet only one had the brains to build a grade separated system..

[twoNeurons]

Originally Posted by Metro-One

I don't care much for hockey (can't skate and only really watch the Canucks) and Brian Adams is laughable.

And you already answered the questions, the majority of speakers around the Canada line are Chinese, hence why it makes no sense to put French on our metro system. And I have been around a lot of BC, and I have never been anywhere that has a considerably large French presence (if anything a lot of central BC has a strong German presence).

Again, you seem to missing all the points about BCs history and geographical location. French is not important here, no more than any other language really, so I do not think it should be slapped on our announcements and labels when so many other languages are much more useful throughout BC than it is.

This is a stupid argument and I knew it would bring all the French nationals out of the wood work. And if we do put French on things, lets put real french on them, not bastardized Quebec french (that is how the people in France explained Quebec french to me while I was in France).

While we're at it, let's put Proper English on things, instead of bastardized (I hate that word) Canadian spellings, right? The French tend to look down at Quebecois French, but in reality, there's nothing wrong with it. They also look down at Haitian Creole, which takes parts of French and mixes it up. I don't get why people actually have the gall to say that they screwed up way that other people communicate is more crappy than the screwed up way they themselves communicate. That, if anything, is laughable. Languages and culture go hand in hand and so when someone denigrades another languages, they're in essence looking down at the culture.

Languages aren't "pure" and the ones that are more "pure" are generally not as flexible and adaptable, anyhow.

While I agree that there shouldn't be french in the system, many french speakers are simply bilingual, so they blend in. French is still required for many jobs, especially with retailers that sell nationally. Chinese really only matters locally, and it really only matters because they haven't yet integrated. I wouldn't be surprised to see the use of Chinese slowly decrease over the next 20 years.

I don't know of many second generation Chinese that can actually read the characters, and given that it requires a lot of education just to read the language, Vancouver's Chinese literacy rates will likely decrease rapidly without drastically increased immigration.

Yes, there are schools that parents send their kids to to learn the characters, but the majority of 2nd generation Chinese still are not and will not become bilingual. (speak, read and write the language).

As for why the Olympics are in French and English, I would hazard a guess that it has more to do with the fact that the IOC movement was started by a Frenchman in Lausanne, Switzerland. The International language of Business and trade was English (due to England's position as a World Empire) and French was the official language of diplomacy (at the time). French and English are also the two working languages of the UN. Other official languages are : Chinese, Arabic, Spanish and Russian.

[CBeats]

Went on the line today, that little area near future 33rd avenue station is painfully slow and really screechy. It felt as if the train was really struggling to get around those very tight corners. And there were several other spots where the train seemed to slow down for no reason whatsoever.

Other than that, a good ride

[BCPhil]

Well, I'm not saying anything to do with the Skytrain should be in French either, except maybe ONLY during the Olympics, when we are welcoming a lot of French speaking people to the City for an event that is officially in English AND French. But for the rest of the time, even though we are a multicultural city, we are supposed to have a common basic understanding of English to function fully. If we start to include any other languages, we'll have to include them all, least we offend the people who speak Tamil.

But in reality, hardly any of it needs to be in any language. The only words that mater are the names of the next stop and the destination, the rest is just filler to keep the elderly from being confused. If the announcement on platform said "Next Train: YVR", everyone would know what it means. Heck, hardly any English speakers know what it means when the announcement says "Inbound" or "outbound" or if it said North, South, East, or West, and how is a blind person supposed to tell the difference between inbound and outbound trains? Most of the people I know know which way is North or South in Liberty City or San Andreas better than in Vancouver.

P.S. anyone notice on Google maps they reverted to a bunch of old images for Vancouver? The images predate the Canada Line construction now, even the Old Sawmill is still there on the river. And the Golden Ears bridge (from when it was almost done), Pitt River Bridge construction, and even the VCC Millennium line station are gone too. Maybe a massive update is soon to come?

[mezzanine]

Originally Posted by zivan56

I just took it for the first time today, and I have to agree that the stations are too short. However, even worse is the fact that they are too narrow. .

Totally agree. combined with the fact that the entrances are on one end of the platform (esp in rchmd) makes for a lot of congestion on the platforms.

I would think that short platforms/frequent trains should work well, but the narrowness of the platform gives it little margin for error...

[BCPhil]

Originally Posted by twoNeurons

I wouldn't be surprised to see the use of Chinese slowly decrease over the next 20 years.

I don't know of many second generation Chinese that can actually read the characters, and given that it requires a lot of education just to read the language, Vancouver's Chinese literacy rates will likely decrease rapidly without drastically increased immigration.

You might be right about that. 2.6% of the Canadian population says they speak Chinese at home, but 3.9% of the population identifies themselves as Chinese Canadian. And I think the difference between them has been growing. While Chinese isn't going to fade away in the lower mainland, the census does note that "Of prime working-age Chinese immigrants, 89% reported knowing at least one official language" and " only about 790,500 people reported speaking a Chinese language at home on a regular basis, 81,900 fewer than those who reported having a Chinese mother tongue"

Time will tell.

[officedweller]

Came across this detailed article on the tunnelling soil conditions etc. for U-Link for Seattle:

http://jacobssf.com/articles/2008_Adams-...ty%20Link%20Tunnels%20and%20Stations.pdf

Insanely overbuilt - See poster boards:

Capitol Hill Station - Does it need THREE entrances?
(Also shows deconstructed fighter jet sculture to be hung in station)
http://www.soundtransit.org/Documents/pdf/projects/link/north/ULink/CH90percentOpenHouse.pdf

University Station
(The superstructure is for an elevated pedestrian walkway (the station appears to be on the outskirts of campus next to the stadium))
http://www.soundtransit.org/Documents/pdf/projects/link/north/ULink/UW_90_OpenHouse_022509.pdf

[SFUVancouver]

Originally Posted by officedweller

Came across this detailed article on the U-Link for Seattle:

http://jacobssf.com/articles/2008_Adams-...ty%20Link%20Tunnels%20and%20Stations.pdf

Thanks for posting OfficeDweller.

A few highlights:

"When it opens, the U-Link section of Seattle’s Light Rail Transit (LRT) program will increase Iinital Segment/Airport ridership by an estimated 70,000 travelers a day."
Source [page1]


"The University Link project extends Seattle’s light rail from downtown to University of Washington (UW). It includes 5.0 kilometers (3.15 miles) of twin-bored, 6.4 meters (21 feet) excavated diameter tunnels, and two cut-and-cover stations.

The Capitol Hill Station (CHS) requires an excavation 170.7 meters (560 feet) long, 22.6 meters (74 feet) wide, and 22.9 meters (75 feet) deep.

The University of Washington Station (UWS) requires an excavation of about 238.4 meters (782 feet) long, 21.3 meters (70 feet) wide, and 33.5 meters (110 feet) deep."
Source [page1]


"At I-5 the tunnels will be passing under the roadway with 4.6 meters (15 feet) of cover. In order to cross at this grade, portions of the existing cylinder pile walls adjacent to I-5 will need to be removed. These existing walls will be incorporated into four pits that will be excavated prior to the tunnels passing under I-5 and will act as lateral supports."
Source [page2]

The Canada Line never had to contend with the footings of the largest highway on the West Coast. The huge budget for the project is beginning to make more sense.


"One of the challenges of the UWS design is the hydrostatic uplift force acting on the invert slab due to the high water level. Typically, where hydrostatic forces exceed dead loads, stability can be created by adding dead load, reducing hydrostatic forces, or anchoring down the structure. Adding dead load would be a very costly solution because of the massive oversizing of the invert slab required to create enough weight."
Source [page4]


"Husky football and the University Medical Center are two very important entities for the UW. So much so that the University’s agreement with Sound Transit requires that throughout the 60-month construction duration, Medical Center access to the portions of the parking lots not impacted by construction must be maintained and Husky Stadium must remain accessible on football Game Days and four other events during the year. To meet this goal, the design includes a two-contract and three-staged site plan, which includes 2.4 hectare (6 acres) of work area for the initial 36 months, 1.6 hectares (4 acres) of work area for the months 37–57 and 0.8 hectare (2 acres) of work area for the balance of the contract."
Source [page4]

I'm sure the general contractor loves that they will have to move their construction staging sites three times during construction, and each time to a site half the size of the last.


Look at how tight the tunnel cross section is:

Source [page5]

[mrjauk]

I rode the C-Line today from Waterfront to Yaletown and back. With the C-Line, I have the ability to broaden my lunch choices.

I didn't have to wait more than a couple of minutes for either train. I noticed a lot of luggage-carrying passengers, both inbound and outbound. It was quite busy. All of the seats were occupied. The escalator closest to surface level at Yaletown is now working, and Yaletown was much busier than it was the last time I was at the station on Monday. I really think this line is going to be a hit. Actually, I guess it already is.

[mr.x]

^ judging from how they built Yaletown Station, i think they underestimated that station's ridership. Even I was surprised by how busy it is.

The last time I was at the station, which was two days ago, there was a lineup of 20 people to use the two TVM's. And there were quite a few waiting for a train at the platform.

I also passed by the station entrance today and i saw about 5 people with luggages heading into the station.