Canada Line | Completed

[metroXpress]

Originally Posted by nname

I was playing it, and this is what I've found:

From New West to Richmond Centre at around noon..

Option 1 - Take E/M-Line to Downtown then transfer to C-Line to Richmond
Option 2 - Take E/M-Line to 22nd Street, then 100 to Marine Dr, then C-Line to Richmond
Option 3 - Take E/M-Line to Broadway, then 99 to City Hall, then C-Line to Richmond
Option 4 - Take E/M-Line to 22nd Street, then transfer to 410 to Richmond
Option 5 - Take E-Line to Scott Road, 319 south to 84 Ave then 301 to Richmond

Guess what, the first 4 trips take exactly the same amount of time, and the 5th is just 1 minute longer..

the 5th option may be logical to the computers...but not me!

Anyway, I think that, in the future, there should be better connections to Canada Line for people from Delta/ Surrey/ New West. and the Fraser Valley.
People would be willing to make a bus-skytrain-skytrain-bus transfer but not a bus-skytrain-bus-skytrain-bus type of transfer. And the second type is what we are going to face now. I doubt that people from Surrey/Delta are going to use the Canada Line to get to Richmond...since there is no point going up and down and there are buses serving this corridor already. If there were a rapid transit line along 41st and up to Joyce-Collingwood station...that would be great. You can just take Expo Line or M-line and transfer at Joyce stn. to connect to Oakridge stn and the rest of C-line. (i know...buses are doing that already...)

Originally Posted by deasine

Also in other news, the horizontal bars to protect the station facade from collapsing because of bad drivers has been installed at Aberdeen and Lansdowne. Thinking back, the stations are WAY too close to the road, especially Lansdowne when there's so much more room Eastwards.


Photography by Deasine - Taken August 6 2009 - Hosted on Facebook - Creative Commons Protected



I personally find the overall redesign a welcome improvement, but it could be done way better. I feel Richmond isn't spending the money they spent on the redesign as properly as they should've done. It's great to see so much greenery and landscape, but what's the point in doing so if the urban structure isn't designed around the road. We have small strip malls with their own separate parking entering and exiting No. 3 Rd. I understand that it's not possible to just get rid of all of them all at once, but at the same time, I don't think so much greenery is needed when there isn't that much people walking around that portion of No. 3 Rd. anyway. Steven Rees commented on the bike lanes issue and I have to echo what he said about it. Richmond and Vancouver took the idea of raised bike lanes differently. Vancouver saw it as an extension of a sidewalk (Carrall St.) vs Richmond seeing it as part of the road. I really think the extension of the sidewalk will work better as it's much more friendly to average-joe bikers. I was also commenting on how bus stops aren't actual bus islands so that buses don't have to merge onto the bike lane as the bike lane is to the right of the bus stop. Considering there's so much room and so much more potential to do something else, I am slightly disappointed. I'm also quite concerned about the widths of No. 3 Rd. With the bike lanes and centre median, all the lanes are reduced to the maximum and I'm worried that many "Richmond Drivers" won't be able to handle No. 3 as properly as they should be. Lastly, I hope they are resurfacing No. 3 as there are bumps EVERYWHERE.

Thanks for the pictures. I always wondered why they didn't build Aberdeen stn closer to the land reserved for the mall expansion. I mean, look at where it is now? VERY close to No.3. No wonder they have to build those bars. I know that the land is Aberdeen Mall's property...but why not work with them and cover up the stn when the expansion is being built? That's very common in other cities and you wouldn't have to build a connector in the future.

Not sure if this is an escalator for subway but you get an idea:

[metroXpress]

Originally Posted by twoNeurons

Would've been cool if Rotem had used these stanchions:


This is the stanchion used on their Urban Mag-Lev

I don't see any ads on their trains except the big blue ROTEM COMPANY sticker!
(I know...there are still in the factory)

The train must be wider than ours to have those stanchions.


Also, look at those holes on the seats...

[Gordon]

I didn't read my email properly the average weekday boardings arre 232,099

[mr.x]

^ that's an outdated number, at least 5-years outdated. The weekday boardings today is above 270,000.

[SpongeG]

Originally Posted by mr.x

If they lowered it to 7-minutes in Vancouver and 14-15 mins at YVR/Richmond, it would be acceptable in my opinion. But 20-minutes is just ridiculous for people to actually make the Canada Line a feasible transport choice during late night hours.

its not that bad - unless you get there as the train leaves buyt how often does that happen

[officedweller]

Isn't that the escalator to Beverly Centre in LA? A shopping mall on top of 5 or 6 levels of parking?

Anyways, apart from the land acquisition problem, having the station further in would have created a jog in the guideway and they probably wanted to keep it as straight as possible (and on the approach curve, well separated from the Radisson across the street).

***********

That stanchion would 🞵🞵🞵🞵. You can't grasp a horizontal bar at shoulder level easily (it would be harder on your shoulder). You have more strength if you grasp a vertical element.

[deasine]

Originally Posted by Allen

the 5th option may be logical to the computers...but not me!

Anyway, I think that, in the future, there should be better connections to Canada Line for people from Delta/ Surrey/ New West. and the Fraser Valley
People would be willing to make a bus-skytrain-skytrain-bus transfer but not a bus-skytrain-bus-skytrain-bus type of transfer. And the second type is what we are going to face now. I doubt that people from Surrey/Delta are going to use the Canada Line to get to Richmond...since there is no point going up and down and there are buses serving this corridor already. If there were a rapid transit line along 41st and up to Joyce-Collingwood station...that would be great. You can just take Expo Line or M-line and transfer at Joyce stn. to connect to Oakridge stn and the rest of C-line. (i know...buses are doing that already...)

The main problem with our rapid transit system is that there isn't enough transit connection between Metropolitan Centres. We pretty much got our main system to downtown complete, however, Vancouver doesn't have a central downtown like many cities, but multiple city centres. It's a good and bad thing: it sure makes transportation planning a lot more complicated.

Clearly, looking from the Transit Planning software results, we can see there is a lack of rapid transit connection from Burnaby through Vancouver to Richmond (which leads to more complication with the Tri-Cities) and Richmond with South of Fraser. This is another reason why we need the "UBC Line" portion built as SkyTrain to facilitate easier and actually RAPID transportation.

We need an expansive rapid transit network to really better service Metro Vancouver. Of course, some routes should be SkyTrain and others should be LRT, but I really think we need to better look at how we move people in the region and I feel there isn't enough planning for this, not to mention, not enough education for the general public. If we have people here spreading misinformation about SkyTrain, LRT, and BRT, we aren't going anywhere obviously.

Originally Posted by Allen

Thanks for the pictures. I always wondered why they didn't build Aberdeen stn closer to the land reserved for the mall expansion. I mean, look at where it is now? VERY close to No.3. No wonder they have to build those bars. I know that the land is Aberdeen Mall's property...but why not work with them and cover up the stn when the expansion is being built? That's very common in other cities and you wouldn't have to build a connector in the future.

Well the Canada Line does make a sharp turn around the Radisson Hotel which forces the station to be close to the street: very close obviously. Not to mention, there are many plazas right after Aberdeen Stn that prevents it to be closer to the mall. Once you acquire more land, you pay more money. With Lansdowne however, there is a lot more room but then again it's expensive to curve a guideway when it could be running straight through.

[metroXpress]

^ you could split the guideway and build a station with a centre island platform. Just curve the inner tracks.

[deasine]

Originally Posted by Allen

^ you could split the guideway and build a station with a centre island platform. Just curve the inner tracks.

It's all about money at the end of the day. I'm sure having two side platforms without having the guideway move is cheaper than having an island platform.

[mr.x]

I think most of you know would know what I'd do if we had more money to spend on the Canada Line...

[TransitJack]

Originally Posted by mr.x

I think most of you know would know what I'd do if we had more money to spend on the Canada Line...

ya ya, we know EXTEND THE PLATFORMS.

Should be interesting to see how it all shapes up, especially with the big commuting rush that occurs in little over a month from now.

[Millennium2002]

I concur with deasine. The curve around Aberdeen makes it impossible for Canada Line construction crews to build the station any further away from the street than where it is right now. If they wanted to they could have moved the curve closer to the building but then how would that yellow gantry crane that assembled the guideway pieces manage to squish through there?

- Allan Kuan

[officedweller]

Originally Posted by deasine

I'm sure having two side platforms without having the guideway move is cheaper than having an island platform.

Definitely. Even the cost of 2 elevators / escalators doesn't counter the cost of splitting the guideway for a centre platform.

[CLC]

I guess this story from CTV last night hasn't been posted:

Bus riders say Canada Line may not be faster

Updated: Wed Aug. 05 2009 18:41:58

ctvbc.ca

The $2 billion Canada Line rapid transit system is supposed to make commuting faster and easier for people living south of the Fraser River in British Columbia's Lower Mainland. But some transit users claim the new line will do just the opposite.

That's because Delta and Richmond-based commuters who are used to getting directly downtown via the 601 bus and others, will now have to switch to the SkyTrain at one of two Canada Line stations in Richmond.

"It will honestly make [the commute] a lot more difficult than it is,'' said Bryan, who frequently makes the trip.

Another commuter named Vivien said she has heard that the advent of the Canada Line would take seven minutes off the trip from Delta to the downtown area. "But I can't see how,'' she said.

"And in the rain, who wants to be transferring [from the bus to the SkyTrain],'' she said.

"I mean this isn't broken, don't fix it,'' she said.

Drew Snider, a spokesman for the South Coast British Columbia Transportation Authority (TransLink) says he has heard such complaints before.

"There's been that single seat trip that has taken them into downtown Vancouver,'' he said.

"But I think what they'll find here is a trip that's more reliable.''

Canada Line is expected to be more reliable because it will bypass the congestion of the Oak Street and Granville Street bridges, which made it nearly impossible for the buses like 601 to stick to their schedule.

"On paper yes it looks like it will be faster. When you get into practice we will see how it shakes down,'' Snider said.

Commuters will have a few weeks to check out the new system. The Canada Line opens August 17th, and the 601 and other direct downtown buses will keep running until September 6th

"I really hope it's going be smooth and efficient and all of those kinds of good things,'' said Delta Mayor Lois Jackson. "But it hasn't been proven to us yet and only time will tell,'' she said.

With a report by CTV British Columbia's Shannon Paterson

[SpongeG]

it is a pretty smart way to lose transit riders - if people in south surrey wanted to use skytrain they would just go to king george clearly they prefer the bus

[metroXpress]

^ still they are going to face it and use the line.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by CLC

Another commuter named Vivien said she has heard that the advent of the Canada Line would take seven minutes off the trip from Delta to the downtown area. "But I can't see how,'' she said.

A transfer is a pain in the 🞵🞵🞵, but welcome to everybody else's world. If somebody can't see the advantage of a rapid transit line through the busiest traffic area of their commute, I don't think there's anything that would convince them.

[officedweller]

They get higher frequency of busses shuttling them to the train station. That's better service.

[nname]

Originally Posted by Bus riders say Canada Line may not be faster

I mean this isn't broken, don't fix it

Having a route that's subsidized slightly more than twice as much compare to the other routes on average (I was referring to the 351, but I think the 601 is probably slightly better), I wouldn't say it isn't broken.

Originally Posted by SpongeG

it is a pretty smart way to lose transit riders - if people in south surrey wanted to use skytrain they would just go to king george clearly they prefer the bus

I won't care if they loose some riders over this as I'm pretty sure the higher frequency and shorter travel time (by about 12-14 minutes) would attract more. Since going via Richmond is shorter than King George after Canada Line, I think it would have the capacity to take some load off the 321/394/Expo Line and give the space for new riders in the other areas. In the end, more riders + same operating cost = higher efficiency = less subsidy.

====

Something I keep wondering.. why wouldn't they make the short-turned #351 into #354 so it would run all day (at least till about 6pm)? This wouldn't take much extra resource, but would save a few community shuttle that can be placed into area such as Morgan Creek...

[argon007]

Originally Posted by mr.x

<<Deleted by argon007>>

And there's also a SERVICE PLAN in the contract when the line gets busier, which will only increase peak-hour and mid-day frequencies marginally by using 2 additional trains by having 18 of the 20 trains online at a time. There's no improvement to late-night frequencies whatsoever:

SERVICE PLAN
(36 vehicles/18 trains required)

<<Deleted by argon007>>

Afternoon Peak Period
- Waterfront to Bridgeport: 3 minutes 10 secs
- Bridgeport to YVR: 6 minutes 20 secs
- Bridgeport to Richmond Centre: 6 minutes 20 secs

Late Night
- Waterfront to Bridgeport: 10 minutes
- Bridgeport to YVR: 20 minutes
- Bridgeport to Richmond Centre: 20 minutes

wait, what about evening? still the same as the initial plan?