Mobile Development Thread - Page 197

| BRAVO | · #**3921** Posted **May 20, 2009, 9:01 PM**

What happened to (Tim)?

nimsjus · #**3922** Posted **May 21, 2009, 1:57 PM**

While this is a good start, I don't think it is what people were shooting for when they ask for Downtown grocery stores. Congress and Broad is the extreme northwest corner of downtown. It needs to be closer to residents and it has to be a more nationally recognized store. To me this is a waste of the MLK associations funds. People already drive past the sorry Save-a-lot store at Broad and Govt to go to a WinnDixie a few blocks further. Local low-end stores like Save-a-lot, Food for Less and Greers are not what people were asking for when they said downtown grocery store. They wanted a Publix/WinnDixie/Fresh Market/Whole Foods in the core of downtown. If it is Greers it is going to have to be really nice like the one in downtown Fairhope and not like the stores they have on SpringHill Ave and S Broad.

Grocery store billed as anchor for downtown retail development
Thursday, May 21, 2009
By DAN MURTAUGH
Staff Reporter
A grocery store will anchor a 40,000-square-foot shopping complex planned for the corner of Congress and Broad streets in downtown Mobile, according to city officials.
The nonprofit MLK Avenue Redevelopment Corp. is behind the project. The organization's president, Michael Pierce, said the project would be completed within two years and would include a big-box store and a smaller strip mall.
He said he could not name any potential tenants.
The funding will come from the corporation's own assets, foundation grants and loans from financial institutions if necessary, Pierce said.
"All I can say is that it will be a first-class development that will allow access to goods and services not currently present in the community," Pierce said.
City leaders have long sought to bring more grocery stores to the downtown area. And there is at least some mutual interest.
Kamal Constantine, general manager of the Food For Less chain, said his company has been contacted by the development group but has not made a commitment.
Robert Greer, a vice president of Prichard-based Autry Greer & Sons, said his company has talked to the Downtown Mobile Alliance and is considering a survey to gauge the downtown market.
He said the ideal situation would be a store with some parking and within walking distance of new residences.
However, Greer said the company has not pledged to open at the Congress and Broad site.
Greer said the company would probably look at a store of about 18,000 to 20,000 square feet. A location could be opened in the "market" format the company has rolled out in some renovated stores, he said, but it might still end up competing with Greer's locations at Spring Hill Avenue and Ann Street and on South Broad Street.
"We are interested in expanding and in some new stores," Greer said.
Pierce has been working on the project for more than two years. The redevelopment group will buy the land from the Mobile County Health Department.
The property is part of the Broad Street-Beauregard Street Connection Project, a 1953 redevelopment plan created by the Mobile Housing Board and the city government.

SouthSky · #**3923** Posted **May 21, 2009, 4:29 PM**

I know that Greer's would probably build an upscale market store if they decided to move forward with this location but they have been in talks for some properties around central downtown to build for some while.

Port_of_Bama · #**3924** Posted **May 21, 2009, 7:18 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by | BRAVO |

What happened to (Tim)?

No idea Bravo

I hope it will be up scale, because I was looikng forward to a Publix, but it seems that Publix build town centre style stores. So there wouldn`t be any room for a Publix I believe .

BlessedMobile · #**3925** Posted **May 21, 2009, 8:50 PM**

40K s/f shopping center is very small. You could get a Greer's or Food For Less in there. If they made the deal very sweet you might see one of these guys in there but not one of the big boys. I'll ask my buddies tomorrow, who are local developers, what they think of the location, etc.
I have missed Tim with his great downtown photos and pithy comments. He does live in Mobile I thought. Who knows where he is? Tim.....Speak!

NitekKetin · #**3926** Posted **May 21, 2009, 10:06 PM**

I'm somewhat excited at the prospect of another Downtown grocery store. Hopefully the retail is built out towards the streets with landscaped parking or even a parking structure in the center. No outparcels please. The last thing we need in the Downtown core is a strip mall similar to that Office Depot anchored development in Midtown.

Scottybo · #**3927** Posted **May 21, 2009, 10:47 PM**

40,000 sq Ft would be ok for a grocery store. The Winn-Dixie I work at is 48,000 sq ft, which is a good size. I have seen smaller ones.

NitekKetin · #**3928** Posted **May 21, 2009, 11:00 PM**

^Yeah, 40K square feet is pretty good for your standard supermarket, but the anchor store of this development will probably be no more than 20K square feet. Perhaps an ambitious, creative developer will come in and do 65k square feet on the ground level for the grocery component and 20-35k square feet on a couple of levels above that, with all of this commercial space wrapping around a core of parking. Of course the architecture will be done in Spanish Rivial or Italianate styles.

Scottybo · #**3929** Posted **May 22, 2009, 1:29 AM**

Oh ok, I mis-read the post.

BlessedMobile · #**3930** Posted **May 22, 2009, 3:40 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by NitekKetin

^Yeah, 40K square feet is pretty good for your standard supermarket, but the anchor store of this development will probably be no more than 20K square feet. Perhaps an ambitious, creative developer will come in and do 65k square feet on the ground level for the grocery component and 20-35k square feet on a couple of levels above that, with all of this commercial space wrapping around a core of parking. Of course the architecture will be done in Spanish Rivial or Italianate styles.

I am pretty sure that Michael Pierce of the MLK Redevelopment is doing his own development just as he did the earlier small strip center at MLK and Broad. Out of the 40K he could easily do a 30K grocery and small 1K stores and offices. He will have a hard time getting some mid level national tenants in there because of the demographics. I would look for a few local eateries and some government offices. It is very, very hard to get true local tenants who can afford the required rent and be confident of success. I had long wondered why that land was sitting idle. I once managed a 70K strip shopping center in Metairie which had a second floor; it was only half good for offices and then everyone complained about going up the stairs. Michael will make sure the building looks good no matter the architecture. I think he may have a catalyst to improve the shopping in the whole Broad Street area.

NitekKetin · #**3931** Posted **May 22, 2009, 5:13 AM**

Yeah, I wasn't being realistic with my ideas on the project, which were fueled by the excitment of having a new downtown grocery store. If done correctly, this development will contribute greatly to the urban grid.

Now, I wonder where they're going to have those carnival rides during Mardi Gras next year.

CottonCity251 · #**3932** Posted **May 22, 2009, 12:15 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by NitekKetin

Yeah, I wasn't being realistic with my ideas on the project, which were fueled by the excitment of having a new downtown grocery store. If done correctly, this development will contribute greatly to the urban grid.

Now, I wonder where they're going to have those carnival rides during Mardi Gras next year.

This sounds good...I'm pretty optimistic about this development. If done right it could spark new developments on that neglected side of DT. Hope they'll be finishing up Bring Back Broad St. about the time this opens. Delchamps would have been nice...hate they shut down for good!

nimsjus · #**3933** Posted **May 22, 2009, 12:44 PM**

No real news here...Barton Academy is in peril. Hopefully pieces like this really spur some kind of restoration effort. I'm not sure about the selling it to someone deal. You have to have some pretty stiff contracts to make sure someone doesn't come in and turn it into a parking lot later down the road. One reason it is still standing is because it was a goverment owned/used office during the time of Urban Renewal.
Riley to sign bill allowing school system to sell or lease Barton Academy
Friday, May 22, 2009
By ALEX PAPPAS
Staff Reporter
Gov. Bob Riley will sign a bill allowing vacant Barton Academy to be sold or leased by the Mobile County school board, according to local schools Superintendent Roy Nichols.
The signing comes at a time that two groups have, for the second time, listed the antebellum Barton as one of the most endangered historic buildings in all of Alabama.
Nichols said that the governor's office called him Tuesday telling him of Riley's plans.
The bill passed by the Legislature in April gives the school board more flexibility in finding ways to preserve and renovate the crumbling building on downtown Mobile's Government Street.
Designed in 1836, Barton is one of the oldest public school buildings in the nation.
From the 1970s to 2007, it served as the central administration office for the school system that is Alabama's largest at more than 60,000 students.
Barton has sat vacant since the central office staff moved out.
Renovation costs there have been estimated at $15 million to $20 million.
"The school board will do all it can to muster support for the building," Nichols said.
Nichols said that the board is "not necessarily interesting in selling the building," but he didn't rule that out. The most appealing option, he said, would be to secure an outside entity to invest in the building, while allowing the school board to use it in some fashion.
There have been suggestions that Barton could become an arts magnet school.
This week, the Alabama Historical Commission and the Alabama Trust for Historic Preservation identified Barton Academy as one of 12 "Places in Peril" in the state. The groups pointed to the fact that Barton had previously been named to the list in 2005 but had not received significant repairs or restoration since then.
Nichols said he was aware of the report.
Barton's inclusion in "Places in Peril" does not come with any legal mandate to force restoration efforts. The two groups, however, hope the designation will bring awareness to the need to preserve important cultural resources.
This week, a reporter stopping by Barton found the front gates locked, but noted the presence of maintenance trucks in the back parking lot. Several people coming out of an adjacent Social Security office said that they'd like to see the old building saved.
"It's a beautiful building," said Christy Cargile of Mobile, with her young son and daughter in tow. "If you're going to restore it, use it for children."

phoenixboi08 · #**3934** Posted **May 22, 2009, 3:28 PM**

I've considered starting up some kind of citizen movement for the building, but was unsure how, so I abandoned the idea...maybe I'll give it another shot? Besides getting demolished, it'd also be a shame if the building just sits there and continues to grow ever more decrepit...Maybe a museum if not an arts magnet school. I kind of like the museum idea more since Birmingham already has the Alabama School of Performing Arts, which is like ASMS (AL. School of Math and Science).

BlessedMobile · #**3935** Posted **May 22, 2009, 4:04 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by phoenixboi08

I've considered starting up some kind of citizen movement for the building, but was unsure how, so I abandoned the idea...maybe I'll give it another shot? Besides getting demolished, it'd also be a shame if the building just sits there and continues to grow ever more decrepit...Maybe a museum if not an arts magnet school. I kind of like the museum idea more since Birmingham already has the Alabama School of Performing Arts, which is like ASMS (AL. School of Math and Science).

Barton will almost have to be a government project as the private sector sure can't make any money from it. A museum would be the best application as you would have far less interior work than a school or government office building. You could actually put several different museums and a few offices in there that could serve as training classes. I can't imagine anyone buying that place unless they are spending someone else's money...read that as "government". Mobile has matured to the point that we won't allow any more of our historic buildings to be destroyed. Barton has a chance to live now.

SouthSky · #**3936** Posted **May 22, 2009, 5:04 PM**

Another article on the Broad and Congress development:

http://blog.al.com/live/2009/05/mobile_city_officials_say_down.html

...and an article about the Eastern Shore in Smithsonian Magazine:

http://www.smithsonianmag.com/travel/44733002.html

BlessedMobile · #**3937** Posted **May 23, 2009, 1:01 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by SouthSky

Another article on the Broad and Congress development:

http://blog.al.com/live/2009/05/mobile_city_officials_say_down.html

...and an article about the Eastern Shore in Smithsonian Magazine:

http://www.smithsonianmag.com/travel/44733002.html

Just reading the comments on al.com about the shopping experience downtown shows that we have a few self-centered, small minded people chiming in their two cents ( and that's pushing it) worth of opinion about someone else's shopping needs and habits. I talked to my developer friends today and they feel that the center can attract a small grocer. That area of town is underserved especially with the larger HOPE VI project underway. No large grocer will consider downtown until there are a lot more people living there. The center will be built and it will be successful. The city is working out a project to develop the Civic Center area with apartments and shopping; that , in my opinion, will be the likely location of a larger grocer.

CottonCity251 · #**3938** Posted **May 23, 2009, 1:34 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlessedMobile

The city is working out a project to develop the Civic Center area with apartments and shopping; that , in my opinion, will be the likely location of a larger grocer.

That sounds great! Will it include demolishing the arena and gutting the parking lot?

BlessedMobile · #**3939** Posted **May 23, 2009, 4:24 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by CottonCity251

That sounds great! Will it include demolishing the arena and gutting the parking lot?

The plan is to demolish everything but the theatre. Just remember that this is a vision for the future. There would be private development on the property for residences and shopping. Everyone knows we need apartment rentals downtown in much larger numbers if we are to bring in some form of grocery and pharmacy. Let's go for the high-rise apartment building and not the low-level condos. We just need the economy to turn around and for venture capital to flow our way...it will and it will!

NitekKetin · #**3940** Posted **May 23, 2009, 6:12 AM**

The footprint of the Civic Center Auditorium would make a focal point for this new 'destination'. This lush Mardi Gras themed park would be the starting and endpoint for parade routes and a cultural space rivaling Cathedral and Bienville Squares. The lots north of this plaza could be developed into a mixture of hotel and higher density residential complexes with ample ground level retail and street interaction, while the areas south would be the sites of townhomes, rowhouses and, in order to match the scale of the neighborhoods south of Downtown, single family homes built to zero lot lines. The supermarket-anchored shopping center would probably be oriented towards Canal Street. Oh, how I love my somewhat infeasible developments!