LOS ANGELES | Downtown Project Rundown 3.0

[Just-In-Cali]

I assume they are think that in 3 or 4 years, which probably would be the lifespan of the project from design to completion , the housing market at least will have stablized. I wouldnt be that brave, but if they feel good about it, I wont knock them.

[edluva]

^then i'd also assume they're factoring pricing 3-4 years from now, in which case it would still be a very tough market to profit from because such a market has generally forbidden highrise lux from breaking ground in the past, and LA is returning to playing by economic fundamentals of the past.

[JDRCRASH]

Economic fundamentals like what?

[JDRCRASH]

Originally Posted by edluva

wow, people are still even considering the idea of building for-sale housing in downtown la right now? i'd say they're either delusional or suicidal

Yes, I would go for rentals instead, although even that has been falling as of late.

[Just-In-Cali]

Originally Posted by edluva

^then i'd also assume they're factoring pricing 3-4 years from now, in which case it would still be a very tough market to profit from because such a market has generally forbidden highrise lux from breaking ground in the past, and LA is returning to playing by economic fundamentals of the past.

I would agree, surprisingly. At this point, all of the "hot markets" that became far overpriced in far to short a time are not going to be able to get the prices they were previously for a long time to come, I would guess even a decade or more. SoCal, Phoenix, Las Vegas, Miami and the Bay Area to name a few.
Downtown may have to embrace the idea that high priced condos are not in its best interests for now. They should build a the few already approved to be slowly absorbed over the next 5 years, but the boom is done for now. Now they should focus on making the district more traversible. This article from DT News highlights a start to that.

http://www.ladowntownnews.com/articles/2009/01/12/news/01-12-09-news01.txt

[JDRCRASH]

^ Don't forget Dubai; houses at the Palm Islands are well over $5 Million. And that was before the Housing Market collapsed. The peak was double that amount. If you think Los Angeles is bad, that place has a LONG way to go before it (if ever) recovers.

[edluva]

^^yeah, downtown already has a glut, as small as the market is. and it's never been the most desirable neighborhood to begin with so you need a really good reason to build high-rises there. and that good reason is gone for probably at least a decade...that is unless we cut costs by undoing prop 13 and reverse prohibitive zoning (eg. parking, density), but that "unless" won't happen realistically without the transit...the absolute lowest common denominator for all of LA's major issues.

that's why hollow optimism about individual projects is just plain stupid to me when the big picture speaks tons more about the reality. while citywatch yaps on and on about aesthetics or deadzones, LA continues to fester in the product of its own paralyzing incompetence...it's congestion.

[JDRCRASH]

Ed, did you vote on Measure R? I honestly think the acceleration of the completion of those projects rests in the hands of, not the State Legislature, (which is in shambles as it is), but the Obama Administration and Congress.

[JDRCRASH]

From L.A. Times,

Grand Avenue project moves forward, but not ready for construction

12:10 PM, January 12, 2009


Image credit: Grand Avenue Committee


The developer behind the massive Grand Avenue project has met all of the required milestones on the downtown development but probably won't meet next month's deadline for beginning construction.

Last year, Related Cos. agreed to pay financial penalties to the Los Angeles Grand Avenue Authority if ground isn’t broken by Feb. 15, totaling $250,000 a month until the project breaks ground.

If Grand Avenue has not started construction by February 2011, the authority has the right to renegotiate the deal.

With the current state of the credit market, it is likely that Related will pay some penalties to the authority starting next month.

Related officials today told the joint city-county authority overseeing the project that they have met all the deadlines required by the panel but that the $3-billion project will not move forward until the developer can obtain funding for the project.

Among other things, the developer produced 80% of the project’s construction documents before its Dec. 15, 2008, deadline, paid most of the costs for the project’s design needs and has been providing monthly updates on its project, said Nelson Rising, chairman of a committee overseeing the negotiations on behalf of the city and county.

“We are near the finish line,” said Related California chief Bill Witte, who added that the project will be in position to move forward once the credit market allows Related to obtain financing.

In the meantime, Witte and others said that they are moving forward with the design of a 16-acre civic park that is part of the project. They have completed schematic designs and are waiting for cost estimates; a report on that and a plan for a business model to run the park are expected to be presented at the authority’s February meeting.

--Cara Mia DiMassa

[citywatch]

I think the far bigger problem with DT is that it looks too much like Mission Viejo. Or, come to think of it, the bigger issue is that DT looks too much like Beverly Hills.

Actually, the problem is beverly hills looks too much like Gardena. Or maybe it's Gardena looks too much like Beverly Hills? Or is it a case of Beverly Hills looking too much like Harbor city? Or Burbank?

Or is it that Brentwood looks too much like Compton?

I'm so confused.

Meanwhile, this is my pictorial salute to the various trolls of SSP:


Omar Omar


And, btw, deadzones like the following were plaguing the hood during the era of the big red car, after the era of the red car, before WWII, after WWII, before the Red Line subway was built, after the red line subway was built, before fwys became very common throughout So Ca, after fwys became very common throughout So Cal, before 9-11, after 9-11, before the invention of color TV, after the invention of color TV, before rap music existed, after rap music existed....

[JDRCRASH]

Originally Posted by citywatch

Omar Omar

If any one of you thinks this is attractive, i'm gonna puke....

[StethJeff]

the spearmint girl sure is.

[colemonkee]

Damn you, StethJeff, you beat me to it.

citywatch, I think you're starting to lose it. That first paragraph makes no sense. Hold on, man! Hold on!! You can make it!!!

JDR, try not to get too crazy with your copies and pastes. You posted that article twice in the same post (which I fixed).

[Just-In-Cali]

Originally Posted by JDRCRASH

If any one of you thinks this is attractive, i'm gonna puke....

Its the hottest thing ever captured in photograph!


(waiting for melodramatic puking to begin)

[BrandonJXN]

(I'm so drunk right now thatit's a struggle to type this.

But I'll help JDR out witt this guy:

[edluva]

hey don't be dissin on spearmint downtown. they have some hot colombian mamees

to make citywatch happy they should zone those lots for strip joints and create a design ordinance requiring facades be built according to his tastes. then we won't need mass transit at all!

[JDRCRASH]

Originally Posted by Just-In-Cali

Its the hottest thing ever captured in photograph!


(waiting for melodramatic puking to begin)

[Just-In-Cali]

Best puke goes to JD...best supporting puke goes to ThreeHundred...
And Ed, city...cmon now! We have been...surprisingly...maintaining a constructive dialogue (aside from the puke thing)...lets not start getting trite now. City...i agree with Colemonkee...could you please explain that seemingly stroke induced first half of your last comment? I really am not getting it.
I...again...agree with edluva,(I know...I'm waiting for the four horsemen too) about the priorities. Having been downtown several times in the last couple weeks, the main thing that kept happening is everytime we wanted to see a different part (Ice rink at Pershing, LA Live, City Hall, Broadway) we found it easier to just keep moving the car. That sums up what is a sestemic problem in Los Angeles.

[colemonkee]

^ Downtown does have a pretty good Dash system, and you can always catch a cab. If you know the various systems, it's actually rather easy to get around the different neighborhoods within downtown. Yes, it could be better (with the Downtown Connector and Broadway Streetcar), but it's not completely broken right now.

edluva's comments on mass transit, which I agree with for the record, center on mass transit not being feasible for the average person citywide, not necessarily specific to downtown. To that end, the Eastside Gold Line Extension, the Expo Lines, and the Downtown Connector will all play roles in that. Once all three open in 5 years, our system will be far less "broken", however, still very far from being considered useable to a large portion of the population.

On the topic of the Downtown Connector, it has now moved on to the next phase: the full EIR. Meetings with the MTA start this week and next week. There is still a below grade option on the table, which is encouraging.

[LosAngelesSportsFan]

i would be shocked if they went with the at grade option for the downtown connector. The below ground is "only" 150 million more and is far less disruptive to the city streets. we have to think long term and go under ground on it.